MK2011 High Level Gameplay and character description thread. (4/30/2011) List completed (alpha)
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posted08/24/2011 05:14 PM (UTC)by
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06/24/2005 12:23 AM (UTC)
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First, thanks to the one(s) that made this forum, this is a really kick ass idea.
Next, I have found a very simple way to snatch a flawless on expert with Scorpion almost every match, every time (on the demo, of course). It may take some quick reaction time and playing fast enough to create CTS, but it works... a lot!
If you use your three low-punch combo (called Torment in the moves list), followed immediately (and I mean Immediately) with a spear, it sets you perfectly for a Forward + Square, and Low kick combo (the combo is called Grievance in the moves list) followed quickly with Hellfire. Hellfire sets you up perfectly to go right back into your three low punch/spear combo. Do that a few times and after getting a few spears hit you x-ray move and that will seal the deal.... FLAWLESS VICTORY!
So, that's 'Torment' followed with a Spear, while they're dazed hit 'Grievance' followed by Hellfire, do that a few more times (timing is crucial the whole way) after your last Torment/Spear combo and the life is low enough hit the x-ray, and you're good to go. I would assume that if you're playing people that are not used to the game this will be very difficult to defend. They only get 1 breaker every 2 lines of meter, so this advantageous. Good players can recognize this pattern though and break it... the computer, not so much!
WINS
Next, I have found a very simple way to snatch a flawless on expert with Scorpion almost every match, every time (on the demo, of course). It may take some quick reaction time and playing fast enough to create CTS, but it works... a lot!
If you use your three low-punch combo (called Torment in the moves list), followed immediately (and I mean Immediately) with a spear, it sets you perfectly for a Forward + Square, and Low kick combo (the combo is called Grievance in the moves list) followed quickly with Hellfire. Hellfire sets you up perfectly to go right back into your three low punch/spear combo. Do that a few times and after getting a few spears hit you x-ray move and that will seal the deal.... FLAWLESS VICTORY!
So, that's 'Torment' followed with a Spear, while they're dazed hit 'Grievance' followed by Hellfire, do that a few more times (timing is crucial the whole way) after your last Torment/Spear combo and the life is low enough hit the x-ray, and you're good to go. I would assume that if you're playing people that are not used to the game this will be very difficult to defend. They only get 1 breaker every 2 lines of meter, so this advantageous. Good players can recognize this pattern though and break it... the computer, not so much!
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FlamingTP Wrote:
Hmm, this will take a lot more work to determine but what about combo ranges that go from 0 on the enemy super meter to the hit that gives them a breaker. in a good fight that would be the maximum damage we might be looking at.
The other idea is your idea that I should just input the combo range of "do from anywhere combos" but I cant really test this until after the game comes out with the 4 characters in the demo. I'm pretty sure they've been changed a lot.
Bloodfang Wrote:
I see what you mean about the combos. I was coming from the idea of taking a large and varied sample of the combos that the character is known to be capable of and listing the range of damage that TENDS to be done most often (statistically speaking this would be called the "mode" range) and using that as the statistical range. This still presents issues because some characters like Cage for example CAN do crazy high damage BUT only in "ideal situations" like after his x-ray (if you can pull that off.. I can't seem to land anything more than a shadow kick reliably unless they are near the wall) or up against the wall.
I would greatly prefer the range be taken from combos that can be done anywhere and anytime and use those to find the most common range of damage dealt but some characters are specifically designed to require "situations" for optimal game play so this would underrate them.
I dunno just a thought, lol. I tend not use or put much stock in combos that NEED to be done off a wall or require some bizarre, good luck pulling that off on a real opponent, type setup. No offense to the hardcore combo kings, I love their combo vids but starting a combo off with the neutral JP Pop-up hit just isn't practical. It's awesome but good luck pulling that mid-fight. Same with combos that require you to be close to a wall. More useful sure 'cause it does come up but I just don't consider them reliable enough to be the "bread and butter" combos on which the character is statistically graded on. Again just my opinion most would probably disagree with this use of the statistic.
I see what you mean about the combos. I was coming from the idea of taking a large and varied sample of the combos that the character is known to be capable of and listing the range of damage that TENDS to be done most often (statistically speaking this would be called the "mode" range) and using that as the statistical range. This still presents issues because some characters like Cage for example CAN do crazy high damage BUT only in "ideal situations" like after his x-ray (if you can pull that off.. I can't seem to land anything more than a shadow kick reliably unless they are near the wall) or up against the wall.
I would greatly prefer the range be taken from combos that can be done anywhere and anytime and use those to find the most common range of damage dealt but some characters are specifically designed to require "situations" for optimal game play so this would underrate them.
I dunno just a thought, lol. I tend not use or put much stock in combos that NEED to be done off a wall or require some bizarre, good luck pulling that off on a real opponent, type setup. No offense to the hardcore combo kings, I love their combo vids but starting a combo off with the neutral JP Pop-up hit just isn't practical. It's awesome but good luck pulling that mid-fight. Same with combos that require you to be close to a wall. More useful sure 'cause it does come up but I just don't consider them reliable enough to be the "bread and butter" combos on which the character is statistically graded on. Again just my opinion most would probably disagree with this use of the statistic.
Hmm, this will take a lot more work to determine but what about combo ranges that go from 0 on the enemy super meter to the hit that gives them a breaker. in a good fight that would be the maximum damage we might be looking at.
The other idea is your idea that I should just input the combo range of "do from anywhere combos" but I cant really test this until after the game comes out with the 4 characters in the demo. I'm pretty sure they've been changed a lot.
The thing about breakers is that someone may opt to use or not use the breaker depending on the match situation. For example, I start a combo with Scorpion, and the enemy started with 0 super guage, and during a combo that would eventually net 60% damage the opponent gets a breaker. Now, they will probably get the breaker after most of the damage from that combo has been done (being that it builds from damage), so it may not be advantageous to use the breaker to save 10% at the end of a massive combo. Also, maybe the person doing the combo has a huge health lead, so it wouldn't make sense to use up your meter to save a single combo when they could save it for the next round.
My point with all of this is: there are too many factors in a match to make sense of maximum combo damage accounting for breakers. However, I would base the combo ranges on midscreen combos, as they are the most likely to happen in a match. Corner combos WILL happen, but let's say someone averages 20-30% midscreen, but can pull 55% in a corner--now compare that to someone who averages 30-40% midscreen, but can only muster 45% in the corner. If you list with corner combos the ranges would be:
20-55%
and
30-45%
It may look like the top person averages higher, but actually doesn't as the frequency of mid-screen combos will be much greater in actual matches.
Also, I would not account for any combos that start with a JP-Popup, because these combos are video showcases that have no actual use in a match.
Nice thread, I think having a quick look to guide to get an idea of how a character plays will be helpful to the community. I'm writing an in-depth strategy guide, so I should have some info if you need a hand with anything. Let me know
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TheDarkPassenger Wrote:
The thing about breakers is that someone may opt to use or not use the breaker depending on the match situation. For example, I start a combo with Scorpion, and the enemy started with 0 super guage, and during a combo that would eventually net 60% damage the opponent gets a breaker. Now, they will probably get the breaker after most of the damage from that combo has been done (being that it builds from damage), so it may not be advantageous to use the breaker to save 10% at the end of a massive combo. Also, maybe the person doing the combo has a huge health lead, so it wouldn't make sense to use up your meter to save a single combo when they could save it for the next round.
My point with all of this is: there are too many factors in a match to make sense of maximum combo damage accounting for breakers. However, I would base the combo ranges on midscreen combos, as they are the most likely to happen in a match. Corner combos WILL happen, but let's say someone averages 20-30% midscreen, but can pull 55% in a corner--now compare that to someone who averages 30-40% midscreen, but can only muster 45% in the corner. If you list with corner combos the ranges would be:
20-55%
and
30-45%
It may look like the top person averages higher, but actually doesn't as the frequency of mid-screen combos will be much greater in actual matches.
Also, I would not account for any combos that start with a JP-Popup, because these combos are video showcases that have no actual use in a match.
Nice thread, I think having a quick look to guide to get an idea of how a character plays will be helpful to the community. I'm writing an in-depth strategy guide, so I should have some info if you need a hand with anything. Let me know
The thing about breakers is that someone may opt to use or not use the breaker depending on the match situation. For example, I start a combo with Scorpion, and the enemy started with 0 super guage, and during a combo that would eventually net 60% damage the opponent gets a breaker. Now, they will probably get the breaker after most of the damage from that combo has been done (being that it builds from damage), so it may not be advantageous to use the breaker to save 10% at the end of a massive combo. Also, maybe the person doing the combo has a huge health lead, so it wouldn't make sense to use up your meter to save a single combo when they could save it for the next round.
My point with all of this is: there are too many factors in a match to make sense of maximum combo damage accounting for breakers. However, I would base the combo ranges on midscreen combos, as they are the most likely to happen in a match. Corner combos WILL happen, but let's say someone averages 20-30% midscreen, but can pull 55% in a corner--now compare that to someone who averages 30-40% midscreen, but can only muster 45% in the corner. If you list with corner combos the ranges would be:
20-55%
and
30-45%
It may look like the top person averages higher, but actually doesn't as the frequency of mid-screen combos will be much greater in actual matches.
Also, I would not account for any combos that start with a JP-Popup, because these combos are video showcases that have no actual use in a match.
Nice thread, I think having a quick look to guide to get an idea of how a character plays will be helpful to the community. I'm writing an in-depth strategy guide, so I should have some info if you need a hand with anything. Let me know
I think I will list with minimum combos (the ones in the general moves list) and then go up to the highest percentage seen without a JP-popup. I will also not list combos against idle opponents or the CPU. that sounds like a fair idea. accounting for all possible combos is neigh-on-impossible and would take up way way too much time. I will be using my capture card to record all my matches so we should set up some time when the game comes out to just pick every character available and go for it. I'll dig up other sources as well and make sure any combos can be verified. it shouldn't take long. I'm hoping to get the combo part of the list complete by may 1st and the character tier positions complete after the first tournament.
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