What do you hate about scorpion?
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posted01/10/2008 11:48 PM (UTC)by
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ermac2powerfull
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02/20/2007 07:47 PM (UTC)
I ask people who do they like in mortal kombat.Most say they like sub zero or reptile.But they say they dont like scorpion.
wow
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Shinnok-fan64
04/07/2007 01:00 AM (UTC)
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his storyline is bland and repetitive. It's always about revenge, ever since MK4. it seems as though his character is a broken record, as all he can think or do is one thing; and in this case it is revenge. He needs to get over the revenge thing and have a totally revamped storyline, or he will become huge garbage extremely quickly. The thing that annoys me is that his MKA ending really screws up the chances of him getting a good storyline, since its basically saying," me kill Quan Chi!" Its so retarded, he either gets a new storyline or i hope he dies after Armageddeon. I believe his storyline will repeat itself again, though, so i hope actually he dies off. It sucks though that he's been confirmed in MK8, as that means we're stuck with Scorpion's lame storyline for another long period of time; oh what fun!
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ermac2powerfull
04/07/2007 01:03 AM (UTC)
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I do agree that his strory line sucks. Thats a good reason. But i still like him.furious
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Shinnok-fan64
04/07/2007 01:14 AM (UTC)
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yeah, i still love Scorpion for his look, moves, specials, and fatalities, but story is key to making a good character.
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ermac2powerfull
04/07/2007 01:26 AM (UTC)
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story will be important for every fighter.
that will be the only thing that makes scropion a fool.
he will be searching for revenge forever probly.
wink
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Sub-Zero_7th
04/08/2007 10:36 PM (UTC)
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This is going to be a lengthy post, but here goes...

Story/Character

The main thing I hate about Scorpion is how they changed him from someone that had a compassionate heart, which is an important characteristic to the Shinobi no Mono, into an angry, vengeful, idiotic, trouble-making, and overly 1-dimensional imbecile that goes around trying to start fights with people, only to get his ass handed to him.

Everything that was wrong about Scorpion, from his attitude to his silly costume, was proudly broadcasted in MK: Shaolin Monks.

His story is STILL a big mess, and it needs to be resolved before the MK team moves onto making the next-gen MK games.

What is this mess I'm referring to? Well, it all goes back to his MK4 storyline, where his bio states that he accepts Quan Chi's offer to fight for him and Shinnok but hides under alterior motives. What are those ulterior motives? It's of course to find, fight, and defeat Sub-Zero, who he believes killed his family and clan.

His MKDA primary bio starts off with this line: "The ninja spectre Scorpion had assumed for many years that Sub-Zero had killed his family and clan, only to later discover that the true murderer was the sorcerer Quan Chi."

This pretty much backs up his MK4 story, right? Yes, it certainly does.

Then there's also a line in one of Sub-Zero's MKDA Konquest missions that states the following:

"Scorpion has hunted Sub-Zero for years. He believed that Sub-Zero murdered his family and clan. Now he believes Quan Chi to be the true murderer, and will not harm Sub-Zero."

This goes along with what has been mentioned already, thus reinforcing it.

Some of you might we wondering, "Then what's the problem?".

The problem is that Scorpion's rivalry is supposed to be with the Older Sub-Zero, NOT the Younger Sub-Zero.

In MK Mythologies: Sub-Zero, Older Sub-Zero comes across Scorpion in the Netherrealm. The Ninja Specter is enraged not only at Sub-Zero killing him mercilessly but also accuses that the Lin Kuei warrior assassin killed his family and his fellow Shirai Ryu Ninja. Older Sub-Zero denies that accusation, explaining to Scorpion that Quan Chi was responsible. Scorpion doesn't believe Sub-Zero and attacks him, which led to his defeat.

In the beginning of the Ice Shaker mission in (Younger) Sub-Zero's Konquest story, it states the following:

"Many years ago, Sub-Zero's brother was manipulated by the sorcerer Quan Chi to retrieve for him an amulet from it's hiding place in Earthrealm. The sorcerer later framed Sub-Zero's brother for the death of Scorpion's family and clan, which led to his demise at the hands of the enraged ninja spectre, Scorpion."

This states that Scorpion is angry at the Older Sub-Zero for the same reason he's angry at the Younger Sub-Zero. What I wonder is, why?

It has to be one of the following conclusions:

1. He blames the Lin Kuei clan as a whole for the death of his family and clan.

2. During MK4, Quan Chi made Scorpion believe that the Younger Sub-Zero was also responsible for the death of Scorpion's family and clan.

3. Scorpion is simply unaware of the fact that there are/were two Lin Kuei warriors both called Sub-Zero.

If it's conclusion 1, it pretty much retcons Scorpion's MK2 story, something that isn't hard to believe. If so, that also retcons Scorpion's MK3 story, which takes away a lot of the depth in his story and character. During Shao Kahn's tournament in MK2, Scorpion watched as Sub-Zero spared the life of his opponent, which confused him. He eventually learns that this is actually the younger brother of the Sub-Zero he killed during Shang Tsung's tournament. However, if Scorpion has been after this Sub-Zero for many years, believing him to be the murderer of his family and clan like his MKDA primary bio states, those events either never took place or have been retconned out of the story.

If it's conclusion 2, it's kind of hard to believe considering that Scorpion's MK4 bio states that he has ulterior motives for joining up with Quan Chi and Shinnok, which was of course to go after the Younger Sub-Zero. So conclusion 2 doesn't make sense.

If it's conclusion 3, then Scorpion can officially considered a dumbass as he would've wasted several years going after the wrong person without really doing much else.

So either Scorpion has little depth in his story and character, got duped by Quan Chi, or is a total moron. In the end, his story is fucked. He basically went after Sub-Zero, only to never come to fight him or to get his ass whooped.

Let's move onto MKDA itself, where he basically goes after Quan Chi, which makes sense and all. He has a bit of obstacles with Drahmin and Moloch. Overall, his story was very straight-forward and lacked depth. One thing that should be noted however was that Scorpion's action of taking Quan Chi with him to the Netherrealm did in fact have a strong impact on the story. Had Quan Chi been smarter, he probably would've succeeded in conquering the realms.

Then we have Scorpion's MKD story, which would've flowed very nicely with his MK1-MKT personality, which is referred to by some as his "pre-retcon" self. What I mean is, while Scorpion had pretty much been the neutral-aligned loner, there were times in which he would step up and fight for things bigger than his goals, namely the events that took place in his UMK3/MKT ending.

So he becomes the Champion of the Elder Gods, sent to destroy Onaga so that he won't merge the realms and take ultimate power. This is definitely a nice change from his usual revenge-based story. Even though he aids Shujinko in Onaga's destruction, he was not the one to deliver the final, finishing blow. It is revealed in MKA's Konquest that Scorpion and the Elder Gods made a deal that if he slew Onaga, his family and clan would be resurrected. However, since Scorpion half-assed the job, the Elder Gods resurrected his clan as specters like him. Whether his family become resurrected like that is uncertain, but either way, Scorpion got what he deserved, in a way.

However, Scorpion was of course enraged at the Elder Gods, so guess what? That's right. He wants to get REVENGE on them! How? He wants to kill Taven and Daegon, because he thinks that by killing them, that'll be bad for the Elder Gods. Right.....

Then we have his MK: Shaolin Monks story, which was of course horrible as well. Basically, he lures Sub-Zero and perhaps Liu Kang and Kung Lao as well, into the Netherrealm. It seems strange that Scorpion would not play the aggressor, and it's stupid that it seems that he can travel in and out of the Netherrealm when he wants, which retcons his MK2 story for sure.

It also seems like he was working for Shang Tsung and/or Shao Kahn as he one of the warriors that Liu Kang and Kung Lao have to fight and defeat in order to get a "Tournament Victory". When Liu Kang and Kung Lao enter the Netherrealm and talk to Sub-Zero, Sub-Zero tells them that Scorpion is after the two and that he wants to kill them. There is no explanation as to why that is.

In conclusion to his story and personality, he really needs to go back to the way he was in MK1-MKT.

I'd like him to kill Quan Chi during Armageddon and later on reflect on that and his past actions.

Costumes

There isn't too much to say here other than that his MKD alt/MKA primary costume is ridiculous as it has that very tight leather type look to it. Sure, it may have been bearable to me in MK4, but I feel his costumes should really draw a lot more Japanese influence. His MKD primary/MKA alt is his best costume, imo as it had less yellow and had that nice-looking armor feel to it. I think the designers should look at historical Ninja Yoroi and maybe even some Samurai Yoroi and draw inspiration mainly from there for his costume designs.

Fighting Styles

For someone who is the only Japanese Ninja character and is/was a member of a Japanese Ninja clan that's supposed to be the very first Ninja clan, it's very puzzling as to why his unarmed style is NOT any of the Ninjutsu traditions.

As we all know, Scorpion is a Ninja from the Shirai Ryu, the very first Ninja clan in Japan. It was founded by Takeda (whose surname had to have been Shirai for it to make sense) during the feudal era, which I'm pretty sure refers to the Sengoku Jidai (Warring States Period). It was Takeda who also created Ninjutsu, which he developed from the fighting and stealth methods that he learned from the Lin Kuei.

But what's this? From what it seems, the trademark fighting style of the Shirai Ryu is....Hapkido, a relatively modern Korean martial art founded in the early-mid 1900s. It is derived from a Korean striking/kicking based style called Tae Kyon, a Japanese martial art called Daito Ryu Aikijujutsu, and some influences from Western Boxing.

In addition to that, Scorpion also knows Pi Gua Zhang and Moi Fah Kuen (known in the Mandarin language as Mei Hua Quan), both of which are traditional Chinese martial arts.

I find this very strange indeed.

Then there's the whole issue with his weapon. Not only does he have 2 Ninja To on his back, which is historically inaccurate as far as I know, but the Ninja To themselves are short, straight-bladed and have square tsuba (hand guards), which is also inaccurate. The Ninja have always used curve-bladed swords as that blade design was used for swords in Japan during the time that the Ninja were around.

Maybe for those that some consider as Proto-Ninja, then yes, they would've more likely used straight-bladed swords. Tsuba in Japanese swords are round, not square. As for the length of the sword, when it comes to the Ninja To of Ninjutsu traditions such as Togakure Ryu, that's accurate. This is to make the Iai strike faster and to make the sword more useful at closer quarters.

One good thing was that the stance he used in MKDA is definitely used in actual Japanese swordfighting schools.

However, I can't say the same for MKD, in which he pretty much has the same sword but his style is now called Mugai Ryu.

Mugai Ryu is the name of a traditional school of Kenjutsu and Iaijutsu that uses the Odachi. It was founded in 1695 by Tsuji Gattan Sakemochi, and this school is of course one of the many used by the mainstream Samurai elite.

I don't exactly have too much of a problem of Ninja-type characters using some of the mainstream Samurai fighting arts. I just don't like how inaccurate Mugai Ryu was. They could've easily kept the same stance from MKDA or simply use a different stance like Seigan no Kamae, which looks like this or Kasumi no Kamae, which looks like this.

In MKA's intro, Scorpion can be seen wielding his sword in Kasumi no Kamae.

But nooo...they gave him some very inaccurate stance.

I guess I am kind of sounding anal when it comes to fighting styles, but that's kind of how I am. However, don't get the idea that I want the styles to be 100% accurate, because that's not the case.

Overall Gameplay

Scorpion's gameplay has never really been bad. I just think that with the way he's quite cheap in MKDA-MKA that he needs to be toned down in the future MK games.

The Spear is too slow, imo. It needs to have the speed it had in the older MKs. The roped Kunai thing is the right idea.

In the MK Mythologies website, it states that Scorpion has mastered Shurikenjutsu yet he has never had a special move involving the Shuriken.

I think that in the future, he should have a Shuriken projectile that hits low, and it should be called something like Shirai Shuriken. I was thinking that the type of Shuriken he would use would be more of the Bo Shuriken (needle type Shuriken), which is used in Shirai Ryu Shurikenjutsu, an actual traditional style.

Here are pictures of what the Shuriken in Shirai Ryu look like:

http://www.secrets-of-shuriken.com.au/images/shirai_blades.gif

http://www.secrets-of-shuriken.com.au/images/robert9_lg.jpg
-----------------------------
In conclusion, Scorpion needs to go through several changes, mainly in regards to his story and overall character. He used to be a favorite of mine, but now, I really don't like him. Then again, I guess you could say that I like pre-retcon Scorpion (MK1-MKT) but dislike post-retcon Scorpion (MKSM and MK4-MKA).
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TheSilverSurfer
04/09/2007 03:19 AM (UTC)
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Shinnok-fan64 Wrote:
yeah, i still love Scorpion for his look, moves, specials, and fatalities, but story is key to making a good character.
Yes wink
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UlcaTron
04/10/2007 03:32 AM (UTC)
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Sub-Zero_7th Wrote:


I believe posting something that long should get him DP's?
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Sub-Zero_7th
04/10/2007 09:36 PM (UTC)
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UlcaTron Wrote:
Sub-Zero_7th Wrote:


I believe posting something that long should get him DP's?


Just because someone posts something quite long doesn't exactly make it DP worthy. And besides, I'm a Shadow Priest, so I can't get DPs. I can give them or Skull Points though. wink

I would like to see some feedback on my post.
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chaosorder
05/07/2007 02:50 PM (UTC)
0
Also in mk 2 (i think thats the one) in scorpions ending he finds out that the other sub zero is the younger brother and vowes top protect him. which makes no fukin sense at all seing as in the other games hes always trying to kill him. Of course this rivalry is what makes mk so great.

in shaolin monks the reason scorpion is after liu kang and kung lao is that scorpion was under the control of either shao kahn sincce hes is like a soul sorcerer or shao kahn who is a fallen god. im not 100% on this one so dont attacke me if i get it wrong

i mean no offense to scorpion hes is my 2nd fav character next to sub-zero
furiousfuriousfurious
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ErmacFan
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About Me

"Bad stuff happen and things go wrong, but just remember; life goes on."
~Humus~
05/09/2007 06:14 AM (UTC)
0
Sub-Zero_7th Wrote:
This is going to be a lengthy post, but here goes...

Story/Character

The main thing I hate about Scorpion is how they changed him from someone that had a compassionate heart, which is an important characteristic to the Shinobi no Mono, into an angry, vengeful, idiotic, trouble-making, and overly 1-dimensional imbecile that goes around trying to start fights with people, only to get his ass handed to him.

Everything that was wrong about Scorpion, from his attitude to his silly costume, was proudly broadcasted in MK: Shaolin Monks.

His story is STILL a big mess, and it needs to be resolved before the MK team moves onto making the next-gen MK games.

What is this mess I'm referring to? Well, it all goes back to his MK4 storyline, where his bio states that he accepts Quan Chi's offer to fight for him and Shinnok but hides under alterior motives. What are those ulterior motives? It's of course to find, fight, and defeat Sub-Zero, who he believes killed his family and clan.

His MKDA primary bio starts off with this line: "The ninja spectre Scorpion had assumed for many years that Sub-Zero had killed his family and clan, only to later discover that the true murderer was the sorcerer Quan Chi."

This pretty much backs up his MK4 story, right? Yes, it certainly does.

Then there's also a line in one of Sub-Zero's MKDA Konquest missions that states the following:

"Scorpion has hunted Sub-Zero for years. He believed that Sub-Zero murdered his family and clan. Now he believes Quan Chi to be the true murderer, and will not harm Sub-Zero."

This goes along with what has been mentioned already, thus reinforcing it.

Some of you might we wondering, "Then what's the problem?".

The problem is that Scorpion's rivalry is supposed to be with the Older Sub-Zero, NOT the Younger Sub-Zero.

In MK Mythologies: Sub-Zero, Older Sub-Zero comes across Scorpion in the Netherrealm. The Ninja Specter is enraged not only at Sub-Zero killing him mercilessly but also accuses that the Lin Kuei warrior assassin killed his family and his fellow Shirai Ryu Ninja. Older Sub-Zero denies that accusation, explaining to Scorpion that Quan Chi was responsible. Scorpion doesn't believe Sub-Zero and attacks him, which led to his defeat.

In the beginning of the Ice Shaker mission in (Younger) Sub-Zero's Konquest story, it states the following:

"Many years ago, Sub-Zero's brother was manipulated by the sorcerer Quan Chi to retrieve for him an amulet from it's hiding place in Earthrealm. The sorcerer later framed Sub-Zero's brother for the death of Scorpion's family and clan, which led to his demise at the hands of the enraged ninja spectre, Scorpion."

This states that Scorpion is angry at the Older Sub-Zero for the same reason he's angry at the Younger Sub-Zero. What I wonder is, why?

It has to be one of the following conclusions:

1. He blames the Lin Kuei clan as a whole for the death of his family and clan.

2. During MK4, Quan Chi made Scorpion believe that the Younger Sub-Zero was also responsible for the death of Scorpion's family and clan.

3. Scorpion is simply unaware of the fact that there are/were two Lin Kuei warriors both called Sub-Zero.

If it's conclusion 1, it pretty much retcons Scorpion's MK2 story, something that isn't hard to believe. If so, that also retcons Scorpion's MK3 story, which takes away a lot of the depth in his story and character. During Shao Kahn's tournament in MK2, Scorpion watched as Sub-Zero spared the life of his opponent, which confused him. He eventually learns that this is actually the younger brother of the Sub-Zero he killed during Shang Tsung's tournament. However, if Scorpion has been after this Sub-Zero for many years, believing him to be the murderer of his family and clan like his MKDA primary bio states, those events either never took place or have been retconned out of the story.

If it's conclusion 2, it's kind of hard to believe considering that Scorpion's MK4 bio states that he has ulterior motives for joining up with Quan Chi and Shinnok, which was of course to go after the Younger Sub-Zero. So conclusion 2 doesn't make sense.

If it's conclusion 3, then Scorpion can officially considered a dumbass as he would've wasted several years going after the wrong person without really doing much else.

So either Scorpion has little depth in his story and character, got duped by Quan Chi, or is a total moron. In the end, his story is fucked. He basically went after Sub-Zero, only to never come to fight him or to get his ass whooped.

Let's move onto MKDA itself, where he basically goes after Quan Chi, which makes sense and all. He has a bit of obstacles with Drahmin and Moloch. Overall, his story was very straight-forward and lacked depth. One thing that should be noted however was that Scorpion's action of taking Quan Chi with him to the Netherrealm did in fact have a strong impact on the story. Had Quan Chi been smarter, he probably would've succeeded in conquering the realms.

Then we have Scorpion's MKD story, which would've flowed very nicely with his MK1-MKT personality, which is referred to by some as his "pre-retcon" self. What I mean is, while Scorpion had pretty much been the neutral-aligned loner, there were times in which he would step up and fight for things bigger than his goals, namely the events that took place in his UMK3/MKT ending.

So he becomes the Champion of the Elder Gods, sent to destroy Onaga so that he won't merge the realms and take ultimate power. This is definitely a nice change from his usual revenge-based story. Even though he aids Shujinko in Onaga's destruction, he was not the one to deliver the final, finishing blow. It is revealed in MKA's Konquest that Scorpion and the Elder Gods made a deal that if he slew Onaga, his family and clan would be resurrected. However, since Scorpion half-assed the job, the Elder Gods resurrected his clan as specters like him. Whether his family become resurrected like that is uncertain, but either way, Scorpion got what he deserved, in a way.

However, Scorpion was of course enraged at the Elder Gods, so guess what? That's right. He wants to get REVENGE on them! How? He wants to kill Taven and Daegon, because he thinks that by killing them, that'll be bad for the Elder Gods. Right.....

Then we have his MK: Shaolin Monks story, which was of course horrible as well. Basically, he lures Sub-Zero and perhaps Liu Kang and Kung Lao as well, into the Netherrealm. It seems strange that Scorpion would not play the aggressor, and it's stupid that it seems that he can travel in and out of the Netherrealm when he wants, which retcons his MK2 story for sure.

It also seems like he was working for Shang Tsung and/or Shao Kahn as he one of the warriors that Liu Kang and Kung Lao have to fight and defeat in order to get a "Tournament Victory". When Liu Kang and Kung Lao enter the Netherrealm and talk to Sub-Zero, Sub-Zero tells them that Scorpion is after the two and that he wants to kill them. There is no explanation as to why that is.

In conclusion to his story and personality, he really needs to go back to the way he was in MK1-MKT.

I'd like him to kill Quan Chi during Armageddon and later on reflect on that and his past actions.

Costumes

There isn't too much to say here other than that his MKD alt/MKA primary costume is ridiculous as it has that very tight leather type look to it. Sure, it may have been bearable to me in MK4, but I feel his costumes should really draw a lot more Japanese influence. His MKD primary/MKA alt is his best costume, imo as it had less yellow and had that nice-looking armor feel to it. I think the designers should look at historical Ninja Yoroi and maybe even some Samurai Yoroi and draw inspiration mainly from there for his costume designs.

Fighting Styles

For someone who is the only Japanese Ninja character and is/was a member of a Japanese Ninja clan that's supposed to be the very first Ninja clan, it's very puzzling as to why his unarmed style is NOT any of the Ninjutsu traditions.

As we all know, Scorpion is a Ninja from the Shirai Ryu, the very first Ninja clan in Japan. It was founded by Takeda (whose surname had to have been Shirai for it to make sense) during the feudal era, which I'm pretty sure refers to the Sengoku Jidai (Warring States Period). It was Takeda who also created Ninjutsu, which he developed from the fighting and stealth methods that he learned from the Lin Kuei.

But what's this? From what it seems, the trademark fighting style of the Shirai Ryu is....Hapkido, a relatively modern Korean martial art founded in the early-mid 1900s. It is derived from a Korean striking/kicking based style called Tae Kyon, a Japanese martial art called Daito Ryu Aikijujutsu, and some influences from Western Boxing.

In addition to that, Scorpion also knows Pi Gua Zhang and Moi Fah Kuen (known in the Mandarin language as Mei Hua Quan), both of which are traditional Chinese martial arts.

I find this very strange indeed.

Then there's the whole issue with his weapon. Not only does he have 2 Ninja To on his back, which is historically inaccurate as far as I know, but the Ninja To themselves are short, straight-bladed and have square tsuba (hand guards), which is also inaccurate. The Ninja have always used curve-bladed swords as that blade design was used for swords in Japan during the time that the Ninja were around.

Maybe for those that some consider as Proto-Ninja, then yes, they would've more likely used straight-bladed swords. Tsuba in Japanese swords are round, not square. As for the length of the sword, when it comes to the Ninja To of Ninjutsu traditions such as Togakure Ryu, that's accurate. This is to make the Iai strike faster and to make the sword more useful at closer quarters.

One good thing was that the stance he used in MKDA is definitely used in actual Japanese swordfighting schools.

However, I can't say the same for MKD, in which he pretty much has the same sword but his style is now called Mugai Ryu.

Mugai Ryu is the name of a traditional school of Kenjutsu and Iaijutsu that uses the Odachi. It was founded in 1695 by Tsuji Gattan Sakemochi, and this school is of course one of the many used by the mainstream Samurai elite.

I don't exactly have too much of a problem of Ninja-type characters using some of the mainstream Samurai fighting arts. I just don't like how inaccurate Mugai Ryu was. They could've easily kept the same stance from MKDA or simply use a different stance like Seigan no Kamae, which looks like this or Kasumi no Kamae, which looks like this.

In MKA's intro, Scorpion can be seen wielding his sword in Kasumi no Kamae.

But nooo...they gave him some very inaccurate stance.

I guess I am kind of sounding anal when it comes to fighting styles, but that's kind of how I am. However, don't get the idea that I want the styles to be 100% accurate, because that's not the case.

Overall Gameplay

Scorpion's gameplay has never really been bad. I just think that with the way he's quite cheap in MKDA-MKA that he needs to be toned down in the future MK games.

The Spear is too slow, imo. It needs to have the speed it had in the older MKs. The roped Kunai thing is the right idea.

In the MK Mythologies website, it states that Scorpion has mastered Shurikenjutsu yet he has never had a special move involving the Shuriken.

I think that in the future, he should have a Shuriken projectile that hits low, and it should be called something like Shirai Shuriken. I was thinking that the type of Shuriken he would use would be more of the Bo Shuriken (needle type Shuriken), which is used in Shirai Ryu Shurikenjutsu, an actual traditional style.

Here are pictures of what the Shuriken in Shirai Ryu look like:

http://www.secrets-of-shuriken.com.au/images/shirai_blades.gif

http://www.secrets-of-shuriken.com.au/images/robert9_lg.jpg
-----------------------------
In conclusion, Scorpion needs to go through several changes, mainly in regards to his story and overall character. He used to be a favorite of mine, but now, I really don't like him. Then again, I guess you could say that I like pre-retcon Scorpion (MK1-MKT) but dislike post-retcon Scorpion (MKSM and MK4-MKA).


Referring to Mr. Sub #7's Scorpion's storyline, in MK1, the main reason that Scorpion came back as a spectre was because Sub-Zero killed his clan, and yes we all know that. Bear with me here. He supposedly killed the older brother. Remember, he's working for Shang Tsung so that he could fight Sub-Zero.

In MKII, after the disappearence from the older Sub-Zero, the Lin Kuei called forth the younger brother, which Scorpion thought was some ressurection of the original Sub-Zero. So, he goes after the guy again to finish him off, only to find out that it was the younger brother and swore to protect him. In this series, he fights for the name of Shao Kahn. After he saw he was going after someone else, he ends his relation with Shao Kahn and beats him in Mortal Kombat.

In UMK3/MKT, the return of the older brother came back. The Classic Sub-Zero (that was unlockable via UKK,) came back. Scorpion, now realizes there are two Sub-Zero's, he goes after the older one. In this series and onwards, he becomes a neutral ally.

In MK4, recalling back to UMK3/MKT that the ending of the original SZ was that he was to return in the forth mortal kombat tournament. This was the original SZ and he died at the hands of Scorpion via Quan Chi's manipulation. Because Sub-Zero died at the hands of Scorpion, he was corrupted with Shinnok's amulet and became Noob Saibot.

In MK:DA, Scorpion had accidentally purposely killed the original Sub-Zero, which turned him into Noob Saibot. Scorpion, now hunts down
Mr. Richard Divizio aka. Quan Chi for manipulating Sub-Zero into killing the spectre's family and clan, and for manipulating him into "killing" the older brother. So, again, he goes after Quan Chi,

In MK:D, Scorp becomes the enraged Elder God's Champion. He does only half his job, however, and he gets a spectre-fied clan, which he gets pissed about. He and Sub-Zero had nothing to do with each other in this part of the series, unless im mistaken.

And finally, in MK:A, he fights everyone. He fights Taven for being a half-god. He goes after Sub-Zero in the intro movie. Assuming that he's the winner of the Blaze vs. Scorpion match, he has his clan ressurected. Then again, Quan Chi takes his son and runs off. Scorp gets pissed again and goes after the guy he should've gone after since the first MK. Which then leaves a wierd cliffhanger for MK8.

In conclusion, he mainly goes after the original Sub-Zero and Quan Chi, cuz they were the only ones that had a serious vendetta against or with Scorp. Scorp has no beef with Liu Kang, unless u count MK: Annihalation or the first MK movie with the fight against Cage, but he dies in that one, so it doesnt really count. Overall, he has a complex story in my opinion and my way of interpreting his storyline. I hope i covered the basics of what Mr. Sub#7 was saying about Scorp's storyline. About his background with the Shirai Ryu and stuff, i dont really have a good grasp about it.


Thats about it....
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Sub-Zero_7th
05/17/2007 04:24 PM (UTC)
0
chaosorder: Please read or re-read what I had said in my other post regarding Scorpion's post-retconned story. I don't see how the Scorpion/Sub-Zero makes MK great. We don't know what Shao Kahn is, only that he's a native of Outworld.

ErmacFan: I don't know how you got those ideas, but that's way off. A lot of what you're saying is either some kind of speculation or just plain made up.

In MK1, Scorpion was allowed to leave the Netherrealm so he can destroy Sub-Zero, whom he believes killed his family and clan. Scorpion was of course also still angry at Sub-Zero mercilessly killing him. Scorpion did not work for Shang Tsung in MK1. That's made up. Scorpion did not supposedly kill the Older Sub-Zero in MK1. He DEFINITELY killed the Older Sub-Zero.

In MK2, Scorpion does not work for Shao Kahn. Why would we? He doesn't fight Shao Kahn as he has no reason to do so. Basically, Scorpion, who had returned to the Netherrealm after killing the Older Sub-Zero, learned of Sub-Zero's return, and he was granted to leave the Netherrealm again. He takes part in Shao Kahn's tournament in Outworld.

In the pre-retcon storyline, Scorpion notices Sub-Zero spare the life of his opponent, which puzzles him and makes him realize that this is not the same person he killed. After learning that this is actually the younger brother of the Sub-Zero he killed, Scorpion, who felt guilt and shame for his actions, vowed to protect him and make sure that this Sub-Zero does not follow the same path as his older brother did.

In the post-retcon storyline, Scorpion enters Shao Kahn's tournament in Outworld. He either fights Sub-Zero and loses, or he doesn't fight him at all.

In MK3, Shao Kahn tries to take souls from the Netherrealm, which backfires on him. This attempt enables Scorpion to be free from the Netherrealm. Since Earthrealm and Outworld are in a merging process, he can't go back to the Netherrealm. He is basically a wild card in the war between the Earthrealm heroes and the Outworld forces.

In the pre-retcon storyline, Shao Kahn offers Scorpion a job as one of his warriors and assigns Scorpion the task of eliminating the Chosen Warriors. However, Scorpion learns that Sub-Zero, the warrior he vowed to protect, is one of the Chosen Warriors, so he leaves Shao Kahn's side and possibly even somehow helps the heroes defeat Shao Kahn's forces. He returns to the Netherrealm after this.

In the post-retcon storyline, Scorpion either fights and loses to Sub-Zero or he never comes across him.

The Classic Sub-Zero character is non-canon to the storyline and had been retconned out. I think that John Tobias was trying to bring back the Older Sub-Zero, but with the revelation that the deceased Sub-Zero had become Noob Saibot, the Classic Sub-Zero's appearance is non-canon.

In MK4, the younger Sub-Zero donned the same (or similar) costume to the one that his older brother wore in order to honor him as someone who defied Quan Chi and Shinnok, not due to loyalty to the disbanding Lin Kuei clan, which he left after MK2. Scorpion was offered life outside of the Netherrealm in exchange for his services to Quan Chi and Shinnok. Scorpion accepted the offer, but hiding under ulterior motives, which is namely to kill Sub-Zero, who he believes killed his family and clan.

The problem with this is that Scorpion is angry at that older Sub-Zero for the same thing and that it had been stated that Quan Chi framed the older Sub-Zero, not the younger one.

Perhaps there had been plans to truly bring back the Older Sub-Zero in MK4 thus the nature of Scorpion's ending. Maybe Scorpion had mistaken the younger Sub-Zero for the older one due to the costume, but that would've been a bit silly.

It really seemed to me that Scorpion had planned on getting at younger Sub-Zero, which could mean that Quan Chi may have really convinced Scorpion that the younger Sub-Zero was also responsible for the death of Scorpion's family and clan. But since that Scorpion had been after Sub-Zero for many years and that Scorpion's agreement to help Shinnok and Quan Chi had ulterior motives behind it (Sub-Zero's demise), it seems to me that Scorpion's MK2 and MK3 stories had been retconned, making him into a very 1-dimensional and ignorant moron.

In MKDA, Scorpion did not kill the original Sub-Zero. He did that in MK1. Scorpion is after Quan Chi now since he learned the truth that Quan Chi was the true murderer. Scorpion and Quan Chi make it to Outworld and they fight in the Acid Bath. Quan Chi uses his Rising Star Kick to knock Scorpion into the acid moat. Scorpion returns later on, only to be ambushed by Drahmin and Moloch, who defeat him and throw him into the Soulnado. He escapes into the Void and sets his sight on the Elder Gods.

In MKD, when he sees the Elder Gods, they all watch the events unfolding in Shang Tsung's Palace, with the return of Onaga and the deaths of Shang Tsung, Quan Chi, and Raiden. The Elder Gods spot Scorpion and they strike a deal. If Scorpion agrees to become their Champion and destroy Onaga, his family and clan would be resurrected. Scorpion aids Shujinko in Onaga's destruction, but he is not the one to deal the killing blow.

In MKA, Scorpion, not being the one to kill Onaga, does not get his reward. Instead, his fellow Shirai Ninja are brought back as specters like him. Scorpion decides to get his revenge on the Elder Gods by killing Taven and Daegon, the two who are the ones who can put a stop to Armageddon. So Scorpion fights Taven and is defeated by him. A bit later, Scorpion and the various other kombatants fight in the Edenian crater.

His fight with Taven is not because Taven is a half-god. That makes no sense and is not true at all.

In conclusion, you are either not being serious in your post or you simply do not have a real understanding of the storylines as what you have said has no basis in facts.

His pre-retcon story has depth to it. His post-retcon story does not have depth to it.

About the Shirai Ryu, are you referring to Scorpion's Ninja clan, the actual Ninjutsu tradition, or the actual Shurikenjutsu tradition?
I don't think Scorpion was ever supposed to be a shinobi. The MK ninjas are based on the American movie ninja stereotype, and are far from anything historically accurate.

Also, iirc, Ninja To were fictional BS, and no evidence of their existance has been verified.

I'm wondering why Chrome hasn't chimed in with his extensive knowledge yet.



Ka-Tra
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Sub-Zero_7th
05/19/2007 03:03 AM (UTC)
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Tetra_Vega Wrote:
I don't think Scorpion was ever supposed to be a shinobi. The MK ninjas are based on the American movie ninja stereotype, and are far from anything historically accurate.

Also, iirc, Ninja To were fictional BS, and no evidence of their existance has been verified.

I'm wondering why Chrome hasn't chimed in with his extensive knowledge yet.



Ka-Tra


Yes, I know. But even from fictional Ninja standards, Scorpion isn't much of a Ninja. But I would like Scorpion to at least go back to his pre-retcon self, in which he kind of had Ninja-like qualities to him. It would at least be nice to see him use some actual Ninjutsu tactics.

About the Ninja-To thing, it's a complicated issue. I can confidently say that the Ninja never used swords that had straight blades and square tsuba (hand guards). Although, if you want to get into those who some consider to be "Proto-Ninja", then they might've used straight-bladed swords.

Traditions like Togakure Ryu used Ninja Ken, but they weren't straight-bladed, nor did they have square tsuba. They were basically wakizashi-length swords fitted on a katana-length handle with a katana-length scabbard.

I'm sure that Chrome hasn't come in here due to his hatred for Scorpion and almost all other Ninja-type characters.
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RaisnCain
06/16/2007 01:46 PM (UTC)
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Well, I have read this post before. Sub-Zero_7th makes a very valid point.

It wasn't the whole hell spawn reincarnation that bothered me. It was his constant thirst for revenge and his failure to be more ninja

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Nightcrow
06/16/2007 04:29 PM (UTC)
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sub zero_7th you'r the man! or you really made a huge historical and martial arts search, or you do have a huge knowledge about martial arts. and yes, i want scorpion to change aswell. his storyline is turning a little strange. like, if after his death he entered the Netherealm, that's because his soul was evil, he may have been a good man in life, but for being an assassin his soul had to be sent to the netherealm. then, several years after his ressurection, he is chosen by the Elder gods to be their champion.. this is a little strange.. why would the elder gods choose a spectre to be their champion? a soul that was sent to the Netherealm, and so is probably tainted with evil?? it would be much more probable the Elder gods to choose a pure soul, of a warrior that served the good, and not a neutral being with evil nature. it would be much more acceptable the elder gods to choose Liu Kang for their enforcer. but Liu Kang's time is passed, and giving him an important role now would be bad for the time passing and storyline of Mortal Kombat. i hope Liu Kang's corpse to be re-burried after Armageddon, and so he rest, and give his role as main character to another warrior, maybe a new one. but, returning to scorpion, i would like him to kill Quan Chi, and then gain his human shape again. returning to life, and so, revolutioning the character and giving him new objectives. Or even another idea: scorpion becomes the new leader of the Shirai Ryu (although they are specters), and raises his son as one (human Ninja, not specter). after years of training, scorpion's son would become a great Ninja, and would reform his clan by training living humans. scorpion would then fade away to the afterlife, because his revenge was completed, and his objectives in life too. then, his son takes his costume and code-name (having the same name but being another character would also resemblance to Sub Zero's story), and becomes the new leader of the Shirai Ryu. the clan would be a mercenery clan, like it was in the past. The Shirai Ryu/Lin Kuei war would be part of the past too. this change, would be good for the character, because this way, scorpion would continue in the MK Games and storyline, but would have a new purpose and bio. this revolution, could also leave scorpion to join the earth good warriors (the ones that survive armageddon), or to stay neutral but in both cases he would have new special moves, fighting style, story line etc..
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Sub-Zero_7th
06/16/2007 05:49 PM (UTC)
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Nightcrow: The reason why the Elder Gods chose Scorpion as their Champion was because he was there, they were desperate to save the realms without directly interfering, and Scorpion made a deal with them. I agree with you about Liu Kang.

I do think that Scorpion should kill Quan Chi, but I don't know about him regaining his human form and becoming the new leader of the Shirai Ryu. Given how his post-retcon storyline makes him into a character who hasn't developed, hasn't matured, gives me the impression that he is not worthy of being a leader. I mean, imagine following the orders of a leader whose mind and heart are consumed with anger, hatred, and vengeance. That's not leadership material.

If he's going to become a leader, it has to be later and he must first develop into someone with honor, wisdom, and things like that. Pre-retcon Scorpion had some semblance of honor, thus why I prefer him. For his family, I would personally rather leave them dead as that is something that should be left in Scorpion's past.
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Nightcrow
06/16/2007 06:51 PM (UTC)
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ohh, yes now i see. the Elder gods must never directly interfer with the battles of mortals. hmm, thanks for the explanation sub. but look, i agree with you when you say that he would not be a good leader, but his warriors would be specters aswell, and IF scorpion kills Quan Chi and becomes leader of the Shirai Ryu, maybe his sence of honor and his wisdom will changed, because his revenge will be fullfiled. or not, he may remain a blood thursty maniac ... lets just hope that scorpion suffers a deep revolution.. for his own sake..
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Sub-Zero_7th
06/16/2007 08:12 PM (UTC)
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Nightcrow Wrote:
ohh, yes now i see. the Elder gods must never directly interfer with the battles of mortals. hmm, thanks for the explanation sub. but look, i agree with you when you say that he would not be a good leader, but his warriors would be specters aswell, and IF scorpion kills Quan Chi and becomes leader of the Shirai Ryu, maybe his sence of honor and his wisdom will changed, because his revenge will be fullfiled. or not, he may remain a blood thursty maniac ... lets just hope that scorpion suffers a deep revolution.. for his own sake..


I think that when he kills Quan Chi, he should feel empty inside as his soul has not rest. This should be the starting point of him eventually forging his own destiny and learning from his past mistakes, namely that revenge didn't do anything to reunite him with his family. I feel that it's best that his development and evolution be rather gradual and that we start to get much closer to his pre-retcon self.
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fighter666
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About Me

figther666

07/11/2007 04:45 PM (UTC)
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I dont he is the best . i hate reptile &subzero I like to blow F*#$ing head off . run over andthen shred them up
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Sub-Zero_7th
07/11/2007 10:10 PM (UTC)
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fighter666 Wrote:
I dont he is the best . i hate reptile &subzero I like to blow F*#$ing head off . run over andthen shred them up


In the words of Jack Sparrow, "You're not making any sense."
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Iori9
07/12/2007 08:53 AM (UTC)
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fighter666 Wrote:
I dont he is the best . i hate reptile &subzero I like to blow F*#$ing head off . run over andthen shred them up

Your definitively Japanese. Your probably the only active one here that is one, thats cool. smile


I think scorpion don't really need a good storyline, he is really cool character to play as and he is a favorite by alot of MK fans who play for the blood
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Sub-Zero_7th
07/12/2007 04:37 PM (UTC)
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Iori9 Wrote:
fighter666 Wrote:
I dont he is the best . i hate reptile &subzero I like to blow F*#$ing head off . run over andthen shred them up

Your definitively Japanese. Your probably the only active one here that is one, thats cool. smile


I think scorpion don't really need a good storyline, he is really cool character to play as and he is a favorite by alot of MK fans who play for the blood


Well, some people, such as myself, care about the characters and their stories. I'm not saying that everyone has to or should care about those things. It's just that I think his story should be done well so that Scorpion will be of some value. Right now, he's just a gimmick that appeals to those that only care about surface things.
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Sharpeye
07/13/2007 01:49 PM (UTC)
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there is nothing wrong with scorpion, he is my favorate character of all time!Other than Barakagrin
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QueenSindel(TheBitch)
07/15/2007 01:45 AM (UTC)
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I actually don't hate Scorpion in the 2-D era.

I hate him ever since Deadly Alliance cuz they have him all souped up and taking the whole spotlight just because he says "get over here." That is sooo stupid and annoying to me.
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