Because I still don't understand why being very intelligent user(trust me,he is one of the most intelligent users of Russian equivalent of MKO site) and CLEARLY understanding,that old continuity kicked new one in EVERY ASPECT(yes,Sumac,ты это сам знаешь!),he still defends NRS and their new timeline. I still can't understand it. If it is pure fanboyism,then I am okay,but knowing him,I still don't know the reason...

It is called personal preference.

It would be unfair to compare development that characters received in the last 15 years to the development that they received in the one single game (though this game could probably be accounted as "3 in 1"). Still it's encompass only like 40% of the story from the old canon, so comparision is still unfair.

WALL OF TEXT WARNING!!!
In order to make it fair you need to compare characters with they MK1-MK3 selves.

So in no particular order there how it goes in my opinion:
Scorpion - was fleshed a bit more as actually tragic hero for once. However he ended up as a lap dog for the Quan Chi. Generally he didn't change for worse much. Now he has defined role in the story, however a bit limited comparing to what he was in the MK1-MK3. I couldn't say if he became worse or not.
Liu Kang - finally stepped up form the role of the "hero by default". I hate this kind of characters so for me it's a big improvement.
Kung Lao - still jerkass from MKSM, but I bit toned down. This is one of the few cases that I support old incarnation of the character.
Sub-Zero - received a new spin to the old story. And finally his heroic side was shown in all its glory. I'd say for me it's the same as his old storyline. Just with more spins thrown in.
Sindel - finally shows her true potential as EVIL empress. Something that was never touched in MK3. I like Sindel, but after MK3 she was kind of like fifth wheel in the Edenia part of the story. In here she finally had purpose and was awesomely evil. I wouldn't consider that as an improvement, since it's basically what she whould have been in MK3 form the begining, just say that I absolutely love how she was played in this game.
Ermac - major improvement. He was one of the greatest Kahn warriors only on paper in the UMK3. And it's unknown what role he played in the conflict if any. In this game he not only have role in the invasion, albeit minor, but actually given new spin that upgrades him from "secondary character good / bad guy" to potentially one of the leading stars in the sequel.
Reptile - nothing special. Just like in the past games, MKDA aside.
Kitana - her whole arc was messed up pretty much. I'am not fan of the newborn Millena, nor of the woobie!Kitana. So it's one of the few things where new story fails short.
Johhny Cage - awesome improvement. From comedic fool who didn't nothing important in the past (save MK1 and MKA) he became truly valuable warrior for the Raiden's forces. Clearly writers continued with direction hinted in MKA and it really pays off here. And I like idea about his "special" origin. Don't see what could piss people of in that.
Jade - I don't like this take on a character. She became more arrogant and brash, not exactly how I think she was presented in the OT. Though given that it's my personal impression that could have nothing to do with what writers had in mind back then, I'd say I could accept such take on the Jade. Not that I must like it.
Millena - he lost her backstory that made her likeable and semi-tragic character and gain new crazy personality. Another instance where new take on the character fails. Though I like her new insane personality, I hope it wears off a bit in the next game, making way for the cunning strategist Mileena that I was rooting for in MKD.
Nightwolf - improvement. Instead of generic indian wiseman, he now one of the most important Earth warriors and have defined personality.
Cyrax - partial improvement. I like that he is now more of the guy of his own. However the idea that he voluntered to the automation himself gave his character an interesting twist. Though given how important such decision is, I can understand why this aspect was revised in the new storyline. Generally I like his new personality and story. I hope his arcade ending is canon.
Noob Saibot - improvement. While his role is a minor one, he is presented in a much more open manner than previously. In UMK3 he was essentially some shadow guy in the shadows (sorry). In NT he is basically takes Millena position that she held in UMK3 (active member of Kahn army secretly serving Shinnok). While I grief that Millena lost that part of the story I glad that Noob finally was more than just sideguy.
Smoke - improvement. He was walking Wangst in the OT. Now he has personality of his own without tragic story that dragged out for several games without any actual importance for anyone or payoff.
Sektor - improvement. More of the human!Sektor allowed to show what he was before automation. Very good thing.
Sonya Blade - same as OT pretty much. But I liked new part about her father.
Jax - same as OT. Standard secondary good guy. Only real change that his arms were ripped off. I kind of indifferent to that detail. It's not dealbreaker or anything.
Kano - the same as OT basically. Though I dislike this take on the character because I really dislike Kano from the first movie. But it has nothing to do with quality of his story in the new game. And I like how he saved Kabal.
Stryker - improvement. Major one at that.
Shang Tsung - demoted to loser. Not as big as Reptile, but anyway. Not an improvement. Essenatially after MK1 part he was just "there". He has cool moments, but really was downgraded to second fodder to the Quan Chi.
Baraka - the same as OT.
Kabal - improvement. Though I liked his old story too.
Raiden - new take on the character. Humanish god basically. I like it. Perfect infallible Raiden was boring in the OT since, well, forever practically. Here he has emotions and more sympathetic as a character in general.

I stiil don't understand why people blame him for what happened in the story - he is not god of time, naturally he couldn't see all possible outcomes of his changes. How he could know that killing Motaro will trigger chain reaction and ultimately will lead to death of almost all eartrealm warriors? That was completely unexpected development, and one where Raiden was once again put in position where he should do something. Of course sitting on his ass watching Cage die was a perfect solution to the situation (sarcasm). Besides it was clearly shown that he regreted what he had done. He is not self-important asshole who dished out changes because he could. He changed story because he was put in position where he should do something in order to avert MKA. It was situation where he should do something, anything. And given how events unfold there were no time for actually calculating what will happen in the future after certaing changes. Besides, given overall unpredictability of the time all calculations are more or less useless, since even small change could trigger unforseen and horrible consequences, cue Motaro example. The only way to not meesed up in this situation is not to do anything at all - choice that Raiden didn't had at the time.
In my eyes MK9 presented Raiden as a more interesting character, then he ever was before. And I like him being the main hero of the storyline. He is much more fitting fotr this role than OT!Liu Kang and Shujinko.

Sheeva - major improvement. Instead of secondary villain, she have much more defined role as a patriot of her race and possbily one of the Earth allies in the next conflict. It was unexpected turn, but all more welcomed.
Quan Chi - he became a marty sue of this game. Even more so than Sub-Zero in the MKDA-MKA. He outshined Shang Tsung on every possible ocasion and all plans and deeds that Tsung've done in the OT, now hilariously were written as Chi's plans and deeds. I like how he was presented in the story I just dislike how he was overshadowing Tsung. It was really too much.
Rain - improvement. More interesting origin.
Kenshi - the same as OT.
Goro - dumbed down seemingly. Though it's hard to say for sure since he has very little screen time. As of now looks like his role in OT was paased to the Sheeva. Given what she was in the OT (hated and barely remebered character) I personally like this change.
Kintaro - dunno. He never had any clearly defined character beside "warrior from Outworld" to begin with. Though his backstory fleshes out him much more than anything that was said about him in OT.
Shao Kahn - demoted to 2D classic evil tyrant. But that was basically done before in the MKDA-MKA, so I'd say it practically the same as in OT (well second part of OT that's it).

So total:
In my opinion MK9 imporved on 17 characters, dumbed down 6 characters and 8 characters stayed more or less the same as they were in OT with Scoropion in his own categpory.
Result: yes, MK9 improved on many characters, comparing it to the first three games.


I prooved in previous statement that most of the changes were beneficial to the characters in general (IMO). Of course I'd like to have straight continuation of the MKA, but what's done is done. I don't want to quit MK because developers have done something that I didn't like (it's not the first time and most likely not the last). Besides, as I said before, I generally like new storyline not because of "fresh and different" but because it opnes different possibilites to the development and interpretation, something that I like pesronally. So I don't see any reason to permanently being pissed of by MK9.
I have pretty open mind, when it comes to changes to what I like, so I could appreciate them. Sometimes I even like to see different take on the past story. And besides pointless anger with eternal bashing never was my specialty.


Only in your opinion. See past paragraph.


I don't see what so horrible in MK9 that could be considered ruining it in ground. For the first time in MK it had story presentation that fits it's grandeur and scope. There are some problems out there, but nothing too critical that could've be not worked out with some time and effort. If anything, convoluted and messed up story of MKD and practically non-story MKA did much more harm to the storyline of the MK'verse. And I'm not even talking about qulaity of this games in general...


You're right. We've been through this.
And I already stated that this game contains only like 45% of the old MK storyline. There is absolutely no sense to compare it to the old universe as the whole. Only to the first three games that MK9 retold.
And I don't like how OT ended, but what's doen is done. Your hatred will not change anything in the long run, except for maybe giving you more points of annoyance from people who tired to listen to the same complaints over and over.


While I'am not agree that characters (all of them) were dumbed down I agree that storyline could be recreated as it was in OT.
Though personally I'd prefer to see it in the form of the CGI movie.


MKSM-bad or MKvsDC-WTF crossover thing.
Perfection is a good thing to strife for, but being 100% perfectionist could lead to some serious problems. Like hating everything that doesn't go along your own idea of what canon should be or like over-hating things because of some minor annoyances.


More like two games, since whatever happened to Bi-Han had no effect on the MK9.


It's not like you are "changeling" either.
And why sould I change my opinion in what I actually believe (and could prove), just because some people disagree with me?


No, I don't believe that OT trumps MK9 in all aspects.
Simply because MK9 is like only half of the OT, so there is no sense to compare it to the 15 years of previous canon, like some people love to do.

MK1-MK3 for me is a some sort of "holy grail" of the MK'verse. The Begining.
It doesn't mean that I should cling to it and hatefully react every time, when new take on is introduced.

MK9 for me is an experiment - new take on the characters, events and so on. I like such things. As I said before I keep my mind open and I like to see different interpreatations of the old stories, be it MK9, Rebirth (that I really like) and so on. In my opinion there is fine line between holding old stuff close to your heart and being opened to the experimentation and holding old stuff close to your heart and being arrogant fan who do not appreciate new take on because it doesn't go along with his ideas of how things should be (quite a widespread sickness in old communitites that was "there" even before MK9, but this game made it all more obvious).

Being open to different interpretations is fine.

But the flaw in your argument is that MK9 is not a different interpretation, it's not an alternate continuity like the movie or Rebirth or Legacy.

The Raiden of MKA, in the original timeline, sent a message to his own past self, meaning this is SUPPOSED to BE the old timeline, no matter how many times they erroneously use the word "reboot". A reboot is when you start the fuck over fresh and that is not what they did.

THAT is the entire problem with Mortal Kombat 9. The things they changed would make plenty of sense in ANOTHER universe, but NOT in the first one, which is where the plot dictates this shit is SUPPOSED to be taking place.

The only way to fix it would be for them to state after the fact that MKA Raiden's message didn't go to his own past, it went to some parallel universe where things were never the same instead...which they haven't yet done and probably won't bother to do because they either don't see the necessity or don't care what the hardcore fans who've noticed shit don't add up logically think because we're just a small minority of a huge paying customer-base.

Sumac,you know your shit. I'm impressed.

You're on. :3


But still,there's still something to be said about the fact that this game just threw away all of the post-OT continuity like a used napkin. I mean,when you do something drastic like that,you better be ready to offer something that justifies such sacrifices,right?


He was a tragic hero in the OT,too. I will freely admit that loved what this game did to him in the MK1 arc. His reluctance to outright murder Bi-Han and his genuine regret and shame after he does so are some of the absolute best parts of the story.

On the other hand,his entire "vow to protect the new Sub-Zero" arc in MK2 is completely gone without a trace,and if memory serves,he just drops off the face of the earth after his one obligatory duel with Kuai Liang. I don't even think he gets an appearance during the MK3 arc at all.

That's not even touching on the fact that Quan Chi basically has him on a leash throughout the entire story.

So I'm counting this as a definite loss.


I have no qualms about Liu's role in the story. Every epic needs a hero.

That said,he was wonderful in this game. As far as I can tell,he actually turned a lot of haters around,and that's probably the best compliment to NRS.


I was one of the most outspoken critics of the new Kung Lao,but Razor brought up some good points in the other thread about his portrayal in this game:



Now that I'm rewatching some of the Story Mode cutscenes again,after you get past the initial "UGH" of his introduction in the MK1 arc,where he's brash,jealous and cocky,he's actually not that bad at all. After Liu beats Shang and becomes the Champion,he seems genuinely happy for him.

But I still don't quite buy him standing around gloating and showing off to the crowd in the Koliseum long enough for Kahn to just walk over and wring his fucking neck. Seems very OOC to me.

So it's a maybe on this one.


I cannot stress how much I disagree with this,but you already know that.

It's so bad it it ruined three other characters by proxy.


I agree on the first part. Regardless how you feel about the Sindel Massacre,it instantly propelled her into the "unstoppable badass" tier.

I do,however,have a problem with this part of her bio:



Couldn't she have just killed herself because the grief of losing her husband,the horror of seeing her people get slaughtered and her entire realm ravaged and the trauma of having been forced by Kahn to be his queen (and god knows what else he forced her to do) completely crushed her emotionally to the point where not even having to take care of her baby daughter (!) stopped her from ending her own life? That's something that add genuine tragedy and drama to her character. What is this ward bullshit we're getting instead?

Not to mention that her resurrection,the focal point of MK3's story,was anticlimactic as all fuck. They go to the desert,and Quan Chi pulls her skeleton out of the sand. =|

I agree with the fact that she becomes pretty much useless post-MK3,but like you said,we're not bringing any of the later games into this.

So I'm writing her down as another negative.


I'll give you that one. The Jerrod revelation might have an unfortunate side-effect of locking him in the Edenia subplot,which,if previous games are anything to go by,is kind of an dead end in terms of story progression. But overall,it's an great revelation,made even better by the fact that,like Razor said,it's shockingly obvious in hindsight.

I was really annoyed at the fact that he was actually a part of the tournament ladder in the MK1 arc,though.


As much as I hate to admit it,this. On one hand,he did get a couple of moments of awesome like the whole "crawlan up wall @ dodgan bullets" sequence. On the other hand,for someone who was the original secret character in fighting game history,having him show up as the first jobber to be defeated in Story Mode by Johnny of all people was just fucking pathetic.

On the plus side,he is one of the few people who survived MK9,and both of his masters are dead,so if rumors are to be believed,he'll be quite a major player in the sequel,finally making something of himself.


Agreed on all counts. I can't believe I forgot about Johnny,he was by far and away the best character in the game for me.


Actually,I didn't really mind her sassiness. If anything,it made her enjoyable to watch.

What I do mind is the fact that there is pretty much one thing and one thing only that Jade really does in OT - she gets ordered by Kahn to track down and kill Kitana. Torn between her loyalty to her master and loyalty to her friend,she finally makes her decision and saves Kitana's life from Reptile. It's kind of the breaking point of her character.

In MK9,there's not even a second of deliberation on her part. As soon as Kahn decides to dispose of Kitana,Jade immediately forgets all about the loyalty to the throne and basically defects to Earthrealm.

That was the one thing from the OT that they had to get right,and they fucked it up.

I do like the little tidbit added to her bio that suggests that she was given to Kahn when she was a child by her own parents as tribute. I really wonder what Jade has to say about that.

Probably more of a minus than a plus for me here.


Agreed on all counts. Empress Mileena FTW,but the inexplicable decision to make her a literal newborn was too destructive for her established character and backstory. And I actually like the new "psychotic child" Mileena.


Seeing him participate in MK1 was a massive WTF,but I think I'm slowly getting over that. I love how he instantly went from a borderline C-lister to a tremendous badass and a fan favorite.

g2g now,will add more later

That was one of my main gripes with MK9 reboot until I understood that it doesn't mean much in the end.
The old univesre is finished. No matter if it's the "future" of the MK9 or alternate world alltogether. Most likely there will be no new games set in it. So in this light it doesn't matter how new version of events doesn't go along well with the old timeline, since whatever happened in the old MK'verse - it's history now. I don't have many reasons to care how new timeline changes thing comparing to the old one since it's effectively was finished.

And besides the moment MK9 was anounced as reboot it was obvious that there would retcons, very many of them. It was strange to expect 100% exact rettelling of the MK1-MK3 after MKSM and vsDC. Both games take place in this timeframe and both made many things differently though there were no visible neccesity to do so. It was understandable that "reboot project" specially dedicated to this timeframe will change some things. Personally I expected much more changes in the MK1 part and was plesantly surprised that key parts of the were still there (except for Tsung's island destruction).
I expected some bullshit like Liu Kang beating Shang Tsung and becoming champion of the tournament, without fighting Goro.


Thanks. I like to study video game universes, especially fighting game ones. And besides as a founder of the Russian MK Wikia I feel myself obligated to be knowledgeable about MK storyline.


I answered it earlier in the post: old continuty is dead. As much as I hate it is now nothing more than a history of the past. So, I don't feel like clinging to it remorlessly. I'd better judge new story for what it worth, not for "how it compare with the old one". Though it would be very hard to evade it in this case.


It was finally done right in this game. Much more prounonced and more sincerely. In the past games his tragedy didn't feel that personal and sad. It was more of a factual statement that it happened with him and now he is on the road of the revenge. It was never shown how Scoropion exactly felt about the matter (save MKM, but as far as I remember he didn't mention death of his family and clan). And latter his personality deteriorated into crazy avenger without much of sympathy.

But I am agree with you that loss of MK2 and MK3 parts of Scorpion story certainly make his storyline weaker in MK9.


But the hero could (and I beleive must) have more of a personality rather than just being goody-two-shoes.


Agree with that. I liked Kung Lao in this game, but I just like his old incarnation a bit more. There are plenty of arrogant characters in MK and it was nice to have a quite character for a change.


Her resurection is another instance where Quan Chi stole the thunder from Shang Tsung. Though it was already retconned in MKM, but at least it was a joint effort of the two sorcerers. On the other hand the deal between Tsung and Chi still could have happened. But anyway Sindel's resurection was a bit anticlimactic as you said.

As for reasons for her to kill herself...I think for whatever reason NRS don't want to portray as a more epic hero of the story instead of victim of Shao Kahn. If only they give that much efforts in order to make Kitana more heroic rather then damsel in distrees...


Reptile is a looser - seemingly developers decided to go with this idea for a character, but on a bigger scale, hence more unfortunate beating for the lizard.
And even if try to do something in the next game on his own, he will fail.


I forget to mention that her interesting subplot form UMK3 was compltely absent from this game. Another point for why I dislike her portarayal in this game.


In the begining it was very strange for me to see such characters as Cyrax, Sektor, Nightwolf in the MK1. But if anything Nightwolf's presence during the MK tournament made a lot of sense, as someone said. He is the one of the most powerfull Earth mystics and warriors - obviously he should be present in the competition which can decide destiny of his world. I think the only reason why he was absent in MK1 - that was because he wasn't created back then.

My biggest problem with the whole "Sindel sacrificed herself to cast a spell" instead of committing suicide out of despair thing, besides what T-Rex said about it, which I completely agree with...is that it makes the MK tournament completely fucking pointless.

If the Elder Gods aren't the ones who enforce their own goddamn rules and keep Kahn from just walking into other realms and taking them over without a fight, then WHY does the tournament even EXIST? It destroys the most BASIC tenet of the ENTIRE franchise, which is that the evil archvillain can only invade worlds by winning a tournament, because the creators and guardians of reality, not some lowly mortal queen, said so.

I liked it so much better when "he found a loophole in the rules" was the explanation for MK3's plot instead.

Yes it is kinda lame that the saga only uses story as a cover, and not as an essential mechanic with narration.

Excuse plot. And I get the sense that MK9 revamped things into forms they originally intended. If that is the case, then I am not impressed with the storyboard, though the writing was at worst average. I kinda liked it.

That's kinda impossible since the guy who wrote MK1 thru 3 doesn't even work there anymore and everything's completely different now than the way he wrote it. More likely the opposite is true, that this is the current guys giving most of the stuff Tobias did the boot so they can have the sandbox all to themselves.

Well,that was a longer break than expected.

Now where was I?

Kinda split on this one. On one hand,he obviously had a tremendous amount of work put into him,what with having a whole new human model that is actually animated differently (!) than his robot form. I mean,that's fantastic. NRS guys went above and beyond the call of duty on this one. His expanded backstory about him being a Motswana warrior is great. Hell,he even got a whole chapter of his own in the Story Mode,where we actually got a feel for his actual personality. And I suppose that yeah,his arcade ending about him finding refuge among the Shaolin could potentially be at least comparable to his stint in the OIA in the old continuity.

Here's my problem,though:

THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN SMOKE'S STORY

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

All NRS did was have the Lin Kuei play a fucking game of musical chairs. Sub-Zero ended up with a slight variation of Cyrax's old story,Smoke ended up with Sub-Zero's old story,Sektor got the same thing as last time and Cyrax ended up with Smoke's old story. It's crap. It's doubly upsetting because they actually got it so RIGHT the first time.

The minus and the plus cancel each other out here.


Alright,I'll give you that one. No tears shed for Mileena's lost UMK3 story since that never went anywhere and was ultimately just another resurrection that made the story hard to take seriously. It does indeed make more sense for Noob to assume that role.

I dislike the fact that Sub-Zero discovered what his brother has become was too soon,though. They should've at least saved it for the next game.

He does get an overall plus for me simply because his Arcade ending brings Havik into the story,and that's awesome. :3


We're in complete disagreement on this one.

Smoke's "rape victim" subplot was the crucial final piece to the Cyber Initiative plotline. Without it,there is no tragedy or drama to be found there. It raised the stakes,it developed him as a character (forget Scorpion and Reptile - Robo Smoke was by far the most tragic figure in the OT) and it ended up catapulting Sub-Zero's character into awesomeness by association.

The new Smoke had a chance to make something of himself and he completely blew it. The few highlights of his personality (what little there is to speak of) establish him as some asshole who punches first and asks questions later. Oh,and then he dies like a bitch without really doing anything to move the plot along. It's nice to know his real name and the origin of his powers,but these things never factor into the plot and aren't built up to anything.

Smoke was a thousand times more of a sympathetic,compelling and useful character when he was a cyborg,and I'll stand by that.

A huge minus.


Not to mention that the revelation of him being the Grandmaster's son is already starting to pay off in his Arcade ending. I could argue that Cyber Zero bullshit cheapens even Sektor's story,since in the original continuity,the juxtaposition of Sub-Zero's humanity and Sektor's cold,mechanical ruthlessness made for a pretty great little subplot,but that's going more into MKDA territory.

A plus.


I'm really not sure where they expect to go with that plotline,though. I somewhat enjoy how it's implied that she blames herself for the deaths of her subordinates because she was the one who trusted Kano. A subtle change for the "HE KILLED MY PARTNER" in the OT. Not bad.


I'd actually argue that that scene was one of the most awesomely brickshitting moments in the entire Story Mode. Don't fuck with Ermac.


How could anybody possibly hate Trevor Goddard? He was fucking awesome!

Out of curiosity,though,how do you see Kano's character? I mean,he's supposed to be a thug - how much different from Goddard's portrayal could it really be?


That was great. Especially considering that Kano was the last person I expected to have any genuine character development in this game. I also liked the little bit in his bio about him having "military training".

On the other hand,I was really,really fucking annoyed that he didn't get a chance to have his final rooftop showdown with Sonya.

I'm also kinda torn on NRS basically giving him Hsu Hao's backstory. On one hand,it does give him more to do,but on the other hand,it basically writes Hsu Hao out of future games,unless they completely reboot his character,Stryker-style.

Okay,I'll actually be generous here and write him down as a plus.

And speaking of Stryker...


He got what is possibly the best makeover in MK history and was instantly jettisoned from joke tier to FUCK YEAH tier. I love it.

Personally,I would have liked to see a more human Stryker,the one who fought Kahn's extermination squads to his last bullet as his squadmates fell all around him and then wandered through the desolate,corpse-littered streets,scared and alone,going "WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON!!??"

Yeah,I don't think that'll happen with the current Stryker.


Not to mention that he got the second least dignified death in the Story Mode.

This was number one:



Pretty much agreed on all counts. Yes,even on the count of Raiden.


She was also established to be a noble warrior and a patriot of her people in the OT. As far as her actual role in the story is concerned,she's just another minor flunkie who gets slapped around numerous times during the story. It's kind of a shame.

But I agree that her future is looking pretty bright. She appears to be one of the few who survived Story Mode,and her Arcade ending opens up some interesting possibilities for the next game.


Fucking Quan Chi.

I still can't get over the fact that he OPENLY FIGHTS IN THE FIRST TOURNAMENT. What the fuck is that,seriously?


So here are my totals:

Improved - 13
Dumbed down - 9 + Cyber fucking Zero. Yes,he's so bad that I'm counting him separately.
Overall unchanged - 8.


...Huh.

This is actually somewhat better than I expected.

I'm kinda glad you made me do this. :3

No, he's supposed to be a crime boss. He should be the fighting skills of Deathstroke with the personality of Tony Soprano, not Joe Chill waiting in the alley to shoot you over a pearl necklace.

Not that they didn't do him justice in MK9, I'd actually say they nailed Kano pretty well by focusing on his mercenary training and selling arms to Outworld...(though I still don't understand what the fuck money he expects Shang to pay him in, considering his customers are from another dimension and intend to take his over, meaning the dollar ain't exactly gonna be worth much a week later...I guess gold coins? Shang's supposedly a treasure hoarder and wealth must have some use in Outworld despite the general wasteland-ness of the place. But I digress.)

I just don't like the public perception of Kano, and running around with a full wildman beard doesn't help. At least with Divisio's slicked back hair and stubble he used to look older and greasier.

I'm also extremely pissed the Sonya/Kano rivalry never got a climactic battle during the MK3 part of the story. Stupid character chapters. And another thing I'd have liked to see is someone use a WEAPON to fuck Kabal up, instead of Kintaro's fire breath, that way Kabal could be mad at Kano that it was indirectly HIS fault he got burnt, 'cause Kano gave them the weapons.

As for Raiden, nobody ever complained that killing Motaro or trying to change stuff was what made him the "God of Blunder".

What makes Raiden look shockingly unintelligent in MK9 is the things he does that DON'T MAKE SENSE for him to do, the things that have nothing to do with trying to change his visions or outright CONTRADICT his plan.

1) "What are we, chopped liver?" - He thinks someone other than Liu is supposed to win MK2, but he only takes Johnny and lets Jax, a perfectly viable fighter, walk the fuck home. *five minutes later* "We're losing! I need more fighters! Where is everybody?" A-durrrrr.

2) Saves Smoke, doesn't save Sub-Zero. Gee, I sure hope the "he" in "He Must Win" wasn't that guy I could've shot lightning at for five seconds and saved but decided not to 'cause Kahn is watching and oh god I'm afraid of what he'll do if I attack the intruders to his realm that he seems pissed off about! Oh...shit. Me not stopping them has actually led to the robots joining Kahn's army. Standing and watching was a great plan. *five minutes later* Hey Liu, why are you just walking right up to where Kitana's chained up and freeing her? Kahn's sitting right there! We're surrounded by badguys! They're...not stopping you? No one's doing anything? Aww...

3) Heals Jax, stands there and watches Kitana die.

4) Doesn't know the strength of his own lightning, is shocked when it kills Liu. How does that even happen? How does the GOD of electricity fuck up shooting electricity at a guy?

5) And the worst offender by a mile: TRYING TO SELL HIS OWN PEOPLE'S SOULS TO THE DEVIL! ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME?! There's desperate, and then there's EVIL. This is the line, and here's Raiden crossing it. Jesus fucking Christ, I can't believe this is an actual thing that happened in a Mortal Kombat game where Raiden was not Dark.

Like I said, NONE of those were something bad that happened because he couldn't forsee what would go wrong if he changed stuff. They're just decisions he made that were immediately dumb from the moment he made them.

Anyway, "desperate and confused" isn't really much of a personality at all, I still think Raiden is JUST as bland a character as he's always been. There's still only ever been two good Raidens: Dark Raiden, and Live Action/Cartoon Raiden.

Not bad. Haven't thought about that.

On the other hand,having Kano basically save Kabal's ass,even if he did it in order to ultimately make him rejoin the Black Dragon,brings a lot more moral ambiguity into the situation,and I like that.

That aside,I'm still sticking to my "Reptile should've totally been the one to fuck up Kabal" theory. :3


For the sake of an argument,let me play the devil's advocate here.


Maybe my memory's getting fuzzy,but didn't Jax go off on his own to rescue Sonya?


*Oh fuck,I really hate to defend this part...*

To be fair,Raiden really had no way of knowing how Kahn would react if he tried to interfere. But yeah,considering that he saved Smoke from the same robot fuckers not five minutes ago,this is probably more offensive to me than anything else he ever does.


Jax was slightly beat up,whereas Kitana was gravely wounded..? Or some shit?

..Yeah,I got nothing. How do you heal someone with lightning anyway?


Well,was it really Raiden's lightning per se that turned Liu into baked turkey or was it Liu's own FALCON PAWNCH that ricocheted off of Raiden's force field? Ladies and gentlemen of the jury,I'm pleading it down from murder 1 to manslaugter. :3


Well,to be fair,he was trying to bargain for what is potentially the lives of billions of Earthrealm inhabitants using the souls of,what,eight fallen fighters as a bargaining chip? I know they were his friends and allies,but they were already dead at that point anyway. Horrible choice to make,yes,but the guy really was running out of options here.


The world needs more Troll Raiden.

I really think they killed cyber subby "just in case" he didn't catch on. They knew they would need a way to bring him back as a human so they killed him off to say well his body doesn't mean anything now anyway. Even though his soul is cyber??? That's something I don't understand either. If Sektor or Cyrax were in this position I'd expect to see them human in the netherrealm as well. How do cyber demons even happen WTF???

I really wouldn't have minded cyber subby in this game, in fact, admittedly here. He would probably be my second main only to Sub-Zero if they would have went about it differently. Knowing that Cyber Sub-Zero is Kuai Liang though, i won't even touch the bastard because I know what they did to him.lol. That's what I don't get. with options like Bi Han's body, or the father being the cyber sub-zero, or perhaps even frost or hydro. That's four different options right there of who could have been cyber sub-zero and it worked out better, instead they chose, IMO, the worst possible option they could think of to introduce a new character. It really does make me wonder WTF were they thinking. I get the whole shock thing, but even then I would have had to looked back and said "Whoa guys, this isn't going to work we need to scrap this because it could piss a lot of people off."

I'm still with Razor in thinking the story was complete shiznit though, I'm not going to play devil's advocate at all. The devil can burn motherf**kers.lol

The two are not mutually exclusive. If Kano saves Kabal's life, but if it was one of Kano's weapons that injured Kabal in the first place, Kabal's rejection of the idea of working for Outworld and animosity for Kano would play that much stronger.



Reptile should've been hunting Kitana, fuck this random hench-shit. And while I'm complaining about Reptile, what the FUCK was that BLOCKING a spray of bullets with an acid MIST crap? That has to be the most unintentionally hilarious just for how derpy it looks visual moment in the whole storymode.
It just occured to me, y'know what would've been nice? If they had ever explained HOW the Lin Kuei found them in the church...they could've had Reptile turn invisible and follow them there after they rescued Kabal and Cyber-Sub from the street, eh? After all, last time we saw him he was knocked out on the nearby rooftop.



No, they had just got done saving Sonya when this conversation happens. Raiden was letting her and Jax go so...I dunno, so he could take her home? She wasn't injured though, there's no reason she couldn't have just stuck around and joined the damn tournament. Sure, the message says "he", not "she", but Raiden is in desperate need of fighters and he's actively telling at LEAST one them (the one who JUST won the first match of the tournament, no less!) that it's okay to just fuckin' leave.



Oh no! He might argue with me! He might call the match a disqualification! Please. What's the worst that could happen, Kahn calls the guards? On WHO? When interlopers interrupt the match in an Elder Gods-sanctioned Mortal Kombat tournament to attack one of the fighters, the protector-god of one of the competing realms HAS to be within his rights to step the fuck in.

Raiden has never before had any fear of enforcing the god damned rules in any other iterations of the franchise. In fact, being the guy who speaks up about it when Shang or Kahn cheats is his DEFINING character trait in most things!

Where are the "your sideshow freaks attacked my fighters, that is expressly forbidden outside the tournament, as your emperor well knows" moments in MK9? This Raiden is not doing his actual JOB. He's become a pussy who never uses his authority the way he's supposed to, to make sure people are playing fair, which makes him inferior to EVERY other version of Raiden we've ever seen before in any other media.



If we are meant to believe Liu's fire combined with the lightning to make it worse...

1) That's stupid. His OWN chi can hurt him? Liu can light his hand on fire any time he likes and be fine...but if it spreads to his whole body suddenly it's trouble? What, lighting and fire can combine to make Super Firelightning? Elements do not work that way!

2) The jagged wounds on burnt-Liu are consistent with what lightning scars look like in the real world. Why would they go to that much trouble to make the texture look realistic if it's not meant to be the lightning that killed him?

3) Raiden should STILL ALWAYS know what the effect of any given amount of electricity is going to be in ANY given scenario. It should literally be the one thing in all the universe he knows the MOST about. He's MADE of lightning, he's the GOD of it, it's the ENTIRETY of his existence and he's been alive and using it for millions of years. When he throws a bolt, he's not just using some wild mutant power, he's chucking portions of HIMSELF at people!

See, I can accept him zapping Liu...it's a dick move to attack your own closest friend or whatever you want to call their relationship...but Liu was about to give him the Fatality Punch, so I'll call it justified. But what I'm having trouble with is the shocked expression on his face when it happens, like how could he POSSIBLY not see that result coming? How could he not know it would end like that? This is the wisdom of the gods?

At the end of the day, if I was a fighter in the MK universe...Earth is where I live! I damn sure don't want this guy protecting MY realm, he's clearly dangerously incompetent and I no longer trust him with the job. And if Sonya or Johnny, after all they've been through BECAUSE of him, all they've seen him do, all the evil they've seen him repeatedly stand by and just watch, are still okay hanging with the guy, then I don't trust their judgment either.



But even if you did believe the ends justify the means, which I don't believe is even close to in-character for Raiden, since that was the very trait that MADE "Dark Raiden" so different from his past self in the first place, why would "ask the devil to fight our battle for us" ever even BE an option? Why did his mind even GO to that place?

And what the fuck does Quan Chi have to do with "He must win"? The "He" is Quan Chi now? A guy who's not even involved at the moment? I don't think so. No, after MK2 ended, he doesn't say it once or try to find out who "he" is until the END of his conversation with Quan, so it looks more like Raiden forgot the motto of his own god damned mission during the entirety of MK3!

So it didn't hit him that the Elder Gods would finally get off their asses and stop Kahn when the merger was a success...until Quan Chi reminded him the merger was gonna be a success. "Oh yeah! Kahn's gonna come through the portal and when he does, then the Elder Gods'll get 'im!" Really? It's just now hitting you? Even though in the previous scene, the Elder Gods TOLD you that's what it would take before they'd step in? Now that IS being dumb.

Yeah, Cyber Sub died of...an ordinary uppercut. It was the most nonsense death in the whole scene, at least everybody else was hit in a way that would actually be lethal. (Well...I still say there's no way Kitana should've been able to die from a soul steal that wasn't even completed, but I can see there being room for argument.)

He must have a fucking off-switch on his chin.

What irks me is that the dramaturgy of the story mode is alot better than what is to be expected. It is the plot that


On Raiden, perhaps they had some sort of Despair Event Horizon thing going on with him at the end, to quote Tvtropes. It really came off as balls to the wall stupid, because the only time Raiden ever was remotely acted "evil", was by choice (The imminent threat of the Dragon King) or was after he has been tainted by tangoing with Shang Tsung/Quan Chi in the ether.


But yes, there are certain moments where he simply falls into inaction and only furthers the negative outcome. The problem is, the script called for certain shock events: Kang turkey'd, Sub transformed into mecha-Sub, which are events that would have required perhaps more coverage.


- I can understand that Raiden perhaps dared not interfere with Sub's abduction because by all means he was participating in the tournament and Kahn could have called him out on some technicality that would have turned their chances to dust. Too bad no such thing ever was hinted at, we all know Shang bended rules but that was because h was the host of the tourney.

- Sub is magically cybernetized in a few hours? What.

- Kang being burned. It is fairly justified to think that Raiden being the personified power of thunder could control his power, the sole reason the accident happened was because the need for death called for Kang's crisp end. Perhaps their powers short circuited each other or there was some sort of chi feedback.... whatever, that scene happened because of direction not because of internal logic to the plot. And those things surely must go hand in hand.

It is like in Robocop: in RC2 he rides a motorcycle when it was clearly stated in the first movie's design document that there are three things Murphy as a cyborg cannot do: have sex, ride a bike due to his weight, and fly (apologies accepted Dekker, but that was fairly stupid, but at least a little bit childishly awesome).


Agree on Troll Raiden.

I disagree with a bit abpout Mileena ressurection. It was more plausible than most MK resurections and actually served some purpose. Maybe it was not developed into something worthy, but as standalone story it was not bad at all.
I actually like that Sub-Zero already knows the true identity of the Noob. Otherwise I'm afraid it could drag on for the quite amount of time.
I hope Havik will appear in the next game. Anyway his cameo in Noob's ending was an awesome "easter egg" for a people who liked his character. Though the ending itself was pretty generic, but at least not as random (to say the least) as most of the endings in the Arcade mode.


Somke was important for the cyber arc in MK3 and helped a lot to finalize Sub-Zero's transformation from ninja-assassin into rogue hero. However even in MK3 he was more like Sub-Zero's asset rather than character of his own. The same goes for all other cyborgs actually. He was a tragic character, no doubt, but his tragedy generally was muddled by the fact that there was nothing to him beside him being transformed into cyborg. No personality, no backstory. I'd like to sympathize him, but it's hard to do so, when character is more of a plot device rather than "real" character.
And whereas other cyborgs slowly, but surely made the name for themselves, Smoke generally was abandoned and when he returned he again was relogated into mere asset - this time for the Noob Saibot.
At least there is more to him this time and no matter what happens with in the future it would be easier to envision him as character as a whole, not someone's asset.


I didn't meant that I dislike this moment. It was an awesome moment (for the Ermac). I meant that I actually indifferent to the fact that Jax has now cyberhands rather than just implants.


Goddard's interpretation of Kano was good, for the movie.
In the games I always invisioned him as more of a strategist rather than slightly average thug, who scared of Tsung and acts like a troglodite. No matter how much I try, I just couldn't imagine movie!Kano succesfully comanding the whole Shao Kahn army. Heck, I couldn't imagine him comanding anything rather than small gang of robbers. In general I see Kano as a ruthless and very cunning man. He shouldn't be scared of anyone or anything. He should be natural-born opportunist, much like Tanya, but without her subtletyness.
In general his more of a opposite of the movie!Kano. Actually that's why I like MKL!Kano. He gave me impression of someone who cut to be the leader.
As for Hsu Hao...to heck with him. Given how developers themselves "like" him I didn't expect him to return to MK any time soon. Anyhow it's not as if anything important was lost with him.


I think Sheeva's noble side was more emphasized in this game, than before.
Pretty much agree with everything else.


Always glad to make people think. =)


1) I agree with that idea about how Kano should be portrayed.
2) Kano could work with Tsung for good realtion with the new regime. And beside "gold is always stays gold" (figuratevely speaking) no matter what world you're in. No matter where Kano could have end up, he could use his new treasures to acquire a good place for himself wherever he wanted to.


Sub-Zero's capture was sanctioned by Shao Kahn. More than that: Sub-Zero didn't participate in the tournament officialy. It was just Kahn's whim that allowed him to fight in the Tournament. So technically Sub-Zero was just some random guy who didn't much to do with neither Earth nor Outworld.
Even if Raiden wanted to save him how it looked like?
"Kahn don't touch this guy...he is a...Well I don't know who he is fighting for exactly, but don't touch him! OK?" Yep, very convincing.
However if Raiden tried forcefully save Kuai Liang, it most likely not only brought Kahn's allies wrath on his head, but also could be used by Kahn as a reason to disqualify Raiden and whoever assisted him in attack from tournament. While maybe not very honored deed, but the his not-interference was done for the higher purpose.


Agree with T-Rex. Jax wasn't gravelly wounded.


Most likely Liu's power "short circuited" with Raiden's.
Saying things like "elements don't work like that" is quite strange since we don't know how chi and gods energy would work in real life.


Once againg agreed with T-Rex.
Raiden was desperate and his allies were already dead.


There was much more to him in MK9 than just desperate and confused, IMO.


What?!
He was captured in MK2 segment and reappered only in MK3 one.
Given that we don't know how much time have passed between MK2 and MK3 segments it could have been from several month to several years.

Well I didn't see anything else to him. Any time he's not losing his shit over the cracks in his stupid god damned medal, he acts like the same bland, emotionless fucking cardboard cutout we saw every previous time he's ever had a voice actor from MK4 to now. You talk about Smoke being a plot device instead of a character in the old timeline, well I submit to you that Raiden has always been exactly that, only worse because of his constant prominence.
People list the top characters an MK game will never be without and they always go "Scorpion, Sub-Zero, and Raiden"...to make it that far with THAT character? That's a sad indictment of the whole franchise to me. MK always put more effort into having a story than the other major fighting game franchises...and yet they've never stopped to give one of their top three characters some nuance, not even an iota of style or charisma? Not even after a movie and two different TV shows already did it for them? Fuck me, man. How does that happen?

RedSumac, I disagree with a lot of your viewpoints, but for this?

Thank you. I'm glad that someone else sees him in this light. Really thought I was alone here.

I always assumed they haxx0red their way into Cyber-Zero's system and tracked his signal.

Would be nice if they actually said that,though.


Okay,out of all the arguments I've heard against Raiden's overall portrayal in this game,this one is probably the most spot-on.


Well,it's not like they have an alternative. Especially considering Shinnok's upcoming invasion. At least Raiden sort of has an idea of what the fuck is going on.


But there was always more to him than that.

PASTA INCOMING


I like the idea of Sub-Zero trying to honor the memory of his brother and following in his footsteps. Since he's the younger sibling,I always believed that he'd naturally look up to his brother and,hearing stories about his adventures,would build him up his mind to be this unstoppable badass who went to hell and back and lived to tell about it. In the OT,Kuai Liang spent most of his life trying to live up to the Sub-Zero legacy,prove his own worth and finally come out of his brother's shadow. And when he achieved all that,his disappointment was all the more dramatic and crushing when he finally faced what his brother has become and realized how much of an irredeemable asshole he is.

MK9 blew its load on this revelation way too soon,I think.


At least he was a good and effective plot device. In this game,you can't even say that about him. He has no personality aside from "that punchy asshole,"so there's nothing to relate to. "Rape victim" Smoke you could actually sympathize with.


I liked how he was basically the Anti-Jax. And hell,he did actually move the plot along,which is more than I can say about many other people.


That would make sense.

...If Raiden didn't just save Smoke not five minutes earlier,even though he really had no idea who he was either,because his hotflashes told him to.

I forget,did he have Deadly Premonitions about Sub-Zero? BECAUSE HE FUCKING SHOULD HAVE


Troll Raiden is fucking awesome,but there's one reason why I'm somewhat reluctant to suggest that Raiden should act like that from this point. And that reason is called Fujin.

See,I'm still hoping that at some point,Raiden will be permanently (lol yeah right) retired from the franchise,allowing Fujin to finally succeed him as Protector of Earthrealm (something that SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED FUCKING TWICE ALREADY). And if that ever happens,that's the kind of personality I want Fujin to have. He's a wind adept,so being somewhat more carefree and less SRS BSNS is something that I think would really fit his character.

I always imagined the difference between Raiden and Fujin, if either of them WERE to finally be given personalities with some actual charisma to them, would be inherent in the reason why Raiden was chosen to protect Earthrealm over all the other element-gods:

Raiden is "down to earth", both literally and figuratively. He cares about the mortals. He's always mingled among them and been emotionally invested in their plights. His sarcasm in the movie was a combination of losing hope that they'd ever win the tournament after 500 years in a row of losing, and tough love designed to push the heroes to figure things out for themselves instead of being expected to hold their hands through every struggle.

Fujin, on the other hand, would be detached from mortals because he was never attached to them to begin with and he's been living alone in a mountain guarding an amulet for thousands of years. He'd be less a "jerk with a heart of gold" and more just a plain old jerk. Still keen on doing his job and saving lives though because he's not evil, just bitter and abrasive. I like to think of Dr. House when I think of Fujin for some weird reason. I don't know why I started drawing that comparison, but it's been that way in my head for years.

Maybe because other people see Raiden as something more than bland character? Though most likely they like his hat. And powers. In that order. J/k.
On a serious note I have the very same sentiment about Liu Kang.
Personally I thik he finally had emotions in this game and was genuinely interesting as a character, rather than just stereotype.

So many walls of texts... They hurt my eyes!
But good reading though. Keep it up guys. ^^

have to add in my 2 cents about Kano..

Kano seemed like a real moron in this game. Why would somebody who has a very vast underworld network and countless resources decide to ruin all of that willingly? Also, I was always under the impression that Kano was a very resourceful and ingenious type of character whose actions always kept him alive and advanced his plot.

From the days of MK1 Kano was forced to withdraw from his activities as a crime lord due to the relentless efforts from Sonya Blade in his capture. These are the sole reasons on why he boarded Shang Tsung's vessel and pretty much inadvertently participated in the tournament hosted by Shang Tsung. Kano most likely discovered the intentions of the tournament with Shang Tsung's ability to consume souls. Being as cunning as a fox and his will to survive he decided that he would ease the tension of being hunted by Sonya and her team by enticing Shang Tsung with new souls to consume as well as offering an advantage for Outworld in winning the tournament by using Sonya's stubbornness against herself. I believe Kano did this not out of his own free will but because the situation he was in required him to do just that. I doubt that Kano was even aware of the consequences when Outworld would win their 10th consecutive tournament and blindly aided Shang Tsung until the good guys prevailed.

Kano in my opinion was just waiting for his moment to escape the island and go his own way but fate pitted him and his sworn enemy together when Shang Tsung's island collapsed in the sea and he was thrown in the vortex leading to Outworld. Kano at that point again was put in a situation with odds against him. I believe Kano should have been captured against his will along with Sonya and were just waiting to be killed at that point. I believe to insure his survival shared his knowledge of weapons and used his resourcefulness to convince Shao Kahn to spare his life which ultimately succeeded when Shao Kahn was defeated in MK2 and looked at Earth-realm as a threat to be taken seriously. After Jax saved Sonya and failed to capture Kano in MK2, Kano was stuck in Outworld while Sonya returned home, and with no other options turned to Shao Kahn and had to do what he felt was necessary to keep himself alive, even if it meant destroying his own world.

MK9 Made Kano seem like a real asshole and idiot who just sold out his entire planet because he was a generic "bad guy" and was doing it just to fulfill that role, which is pretty lame compared to his original story.