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Mortal Kombat X

Discussing Mortal Kombat X and all things Kontemporary to it.
Page of 2

Venkman28Posted: 06/06/2015 07:23 PMStatus ::


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What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

I was watching my roommate throughout the day play the Story Mode of Mortal Kombat (2011) and Mortal Kombat X throughout the past few weeks. It got me to thinking the impact of Rayden's time travel decisions. This is a long post, so bear with me.

Through Kitana's ending and one of Rayden's intros, Shao Kahn won Armaggedon, killed Rayden and destroyed Earth. Kitana survived the Pyramid Battle and united the remaining realms to kill him (apparently he wasn't invulnerable) according to Jade's ghost and Kitana is pissed at Rayden for his actions. In a mirror match, Rayden says he protects Chaosrealm perhaps a result of Earth getting destroyed.

Rayden's visions from Rayden in the old timeline in MK (2011) results in 95% of his defenders getting killed by Sindel and under Quan Chi's control. The ones who were revived are still helping Earthrealm, but are more reluctant.

Rayden does take a more reserved role but he maintains his time travel actions done in Mortal Kombat were correct to save Earth from destruction and Liu Kang (as a a revenant) mocks his visions and the scene when he gets pushed around by revenants like bullies he still stands by it.

The period of MK 1- Armageddon of a decade have been up to 30 years (from Jax's bio the MK 1 tournament was 30 years ago). Most of the realms Shao Kahn conquered are still Outworld even by Kotal Kahn and Mileena's actions. Earthrealm wasn't invaded since Shinnok's invasion.

I think in some ways, Rayden saved his realm but at the cost of his own defenders and the other realms. The combatants don't trust him. Getting corrupted by Shinnok's influence in the tainted Jinsei made him just like the Dark Rayden in the old timeline. But now he will be on the warpath while in some endings Kenshi and Takeda wake up Taven and stop Daegon. Shang Tsung comes back and the One Being could return. Mortal Kombat 11 could go anywhere from here.

But were his actions enough to stop Armageddon or has he simply moved it further into the future? Could the next game have a Battle at the Pyramid to end the franchise and some of the old and younger generation of fighters die and maybe perhaps close the Mortal Kombat franchise.

Just some food for thought.


I know what I have given you. I do not know what you have received.
DAEGON1Posted: 06/06/2015 07:33 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Arcade endings are not necessarily canon.

Windy_ThunderstormPosted: 06/07/2015 11:46 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

The common belief if not fact is that all things must end eventually.a Armageddon will happen regardless,a but it's the god's job to postpone this as much as possible. That's what Raiden did in mk9. With Shao Kahn dead, they won't end up like they did before and people are still alive around that parallel timeline. (Since no one is old in Armageddon I'm assuming Mkx is years after the time Armageddon was suppose to happen.)

We don't know what endings they will use as canon in the next game not to mention as someone else once said Jade could have been showing Kitana false visions since revenats have a such a strong hold on hatred.

The only one who is untrusting and reluctant to help Raiden is Hanzo...but...that's Hanzo.

Chaosrealm Raiden could have been from another universe or just the writers having fun with the dialogs maybe.

a"Rayden saved his realm but at the cost of his own defenders and the other realms."
aIt was kinda hinted that Kotal is capable of unmerging the realms or at least finding a way, but he refuses and said that Outworld must stand strong,aor something like that. With Shao gone there is no reason why they can't. That's not up to Raiden. As for his warriors, it was a sacrifice for the greater good. That's what they fight for. I'm sure more nameless Shaolin warriors died in the first mk tournament than in that cathedral.

Kitana's ending kontradicts the whole game of Armageddon and the first cut scene of mk9. Shao Kahn was suppose to end everything,a even if Kitana did survive how would she have found enough formidable people to take down Shao Kahn when people from all over the realms couldn't do that for thousands of years and with all the greatest warriors that kould have been a threat to Shao Kahn dead?

One more thing. There is a fan theory I've seen mentioned in numerous forums that Shinnok has been manipulating these events from the old and new timeline to work in his favor. We see some proof of this at the end of mk9.

Just my two cents on the matter.

This beautiful sig was made by MINION.
SJWMegatronPosted: 06/08/2015 12:00 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

**IT WAS DARK RAIDEN THAT SENT THE MESSAGE TO THE PAST**

Declaring War on the Elder Gods was the goal. All is going according to plan.

PaletteSwap40000Posted: 06/08/2015 12:14 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

The franchise?

ChromePosted: 06/08/2015 04:18 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

They are making shit up as they go from each game to the next.... or haven't you noticed that Raiden was originally not giving a flying fuck about humanity in MK1?


Sig1 photo Chrome-sig_zps5a62b1b1.jpg
ChillyfirePosted: 06/09/2015 07:17 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

I think he stopped The Deadly Alliance from happening... To create another one

ScorpionEater12Posted: 06/09/2015 09:20 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

I was honestly wondering that too. IMO, they just kinda skipped over that part and went with the MKX story we have now.

As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about.
shrairyuwarriorPosted: 02/07/2016 04:17 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Norhing really lolits worse in ways because more died. ARmegfedden could still happen.

oh and in reply to how much time was armeggeedden? Well the 3d trilogy basic happens right afterone another at least with DA and D A maybe a month later or something. Its said that DA is 10 years after mk1. In the new timeline the neatherrealm invasion happens two years after mk2011 25 years later is current rimeline. So yeah years wise its way past the original timelunes fiight with Blaze

PSN:athlos23
Blade4693Posted: 02/07/2016 04:56 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Nothing really. He has not done anything that would have altered Taven, Deagon or Blaze. All he has really done is made it so that Shao Kahn can't win the pyramid battle if/when it ever happens...That message being sent back should not alter anything that happens before the message arrives in the past, so Taven, Daegon, and Blaze shouldn't be affected at all since they technically exist before MK1 even takes place. The only things that should change are things that happen when/after Raiden's message arrive.

The_TooCool_MasterPosted: 02/08/2016 09:47 AMStatus ::


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Nationality::Canada
RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Blade4693 Wrote:
Nothing really. He has not done anything that would have altered Taven, Deagon or Blaze. All he has really done is made it so that Shao Kahn can't win the pyramid battle if/when it ever happens...That message being sent back should not alter anything that happens before the message arrives in the past, so Taven, Daegon, and Blaze shouldn't be affected at all since they technically exist before MK1 even takes place. The only things that should change are things that happen when/after Raiden's message arrive.


Well it did prevent Armageddon, or at least delay it. The Armageddon story relies on the characters getting too numerous and too powerful. The stretch from MK Gold to MKD had as lot of fights all over the realms that took its toll on everything.

In the new timeline Shinnok was quickly disposed of by Johnny Cage then 25 years later by Cassie. There was no multi-realm conflict in between(except for the Kamidogu story from the comics).

Taven is still asleep in MKX.

Blade4693Posted: 02/08/2016 10:27 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

True, but he, Daegon, and Blaze all still exist, and Armageddon can still happen. Mainly all Raiden did was prevent Shao Kahn from winning it if it ever does. I doubt it will ever happen again because NRS likely doesn't want it to, but it definitely could lol

unleash_your_toungePosted: 02/08/2016 11:03 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

What throws me for a loop is that obviously NRS weren't prepared to ditch everything correlated to MKA. Namely, the entire main plot point of the game.

If MKX arcade endings are anything to go by, Taven and Daegon are still around. Argus and Delia were still murdered by Daegon. That alone is enough to conclude that the brother's quest is still a go in this timeline. And even if one wanted to refute this theory with "but it's an arcade ending...", it must also be considered that both characters appear in more than one ending.

I'm aiming at Takeda with this one. He's a new character, a kombat kid no less, and we all know how much importance was placed on them in this game. Now, if Taven and Daegon are mere canon fodder, why was Daegon placed at the epicenter of both Kenshi's and Takeda's story in MKX? Just to be eliminated? If so, where does that leave Takeda and Kenshi after Suchin is avenged?

Scorpion is still heading the Shirai Ryu so Takeda won't be inheriting that anytime soon. Shinnok is no longer a threat. So really, the only thing keeping Takeda and Kenshi relevant now is their Daegon vendetta.

"Life, for all it's anguish, is ours Miss Ives. It belongs to no other." - Ferdinand Lyle
The_TooCool_MasterPosted: 02/08/2016 11:07 AMStatus ::


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Nationality::Canada
RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Oh, it can still happen. It might still happen.

Raiden tried to prevent Shao Kahn from getting the ultimate power. He wasn't really trying to prevent Armageddon.

Blaze was still corrupted by Onaga's Holy Men. Of course, he could have cleanse himself since then.

Still, I don't think they'll go the Armageddon route again. I personally think it was a bit clunky. A deity forsaw the destruction of the realms, so she created a fire being, put her sons to sleep, and when the time comes they are awaken and must race to kill the fire being. It's really.... weird.

The creation of Blaze to monitor the realms, but getting corrupted by Onaga's holy men, and becoming a monster when he tries use his god-like energy to stop Armageddon would have been fine. I'm not sure why Taven and Daegon had to be put to sleep, then put throught a series of tests that ends with them killing Blaze. Blaze alone would have been enough.

Or maybe they could have had Deliah wanting one of her sons to save the world. Blaze would have been meant to give his essence to the winner of the tests, making him a god and giving him the tools to end Armageddon.

But... it ended up being very clunky.

frabnPosted: 02/08/2016 11:13 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Raiden definitely screwed a lot of things up, but he did so in favor of Armageddon being postponed, or not happening at all. Shao Kahn is now dead, so he cannot win Armageddon. No one was able to beat Shao Kahn during Armageddon, and it took the combined power of the Elder Gods fused into Raiden for him to even stand a chance against him at the end of MK9. It even seemed that the only reason Liu Kang was able to beat him prior to that was because Shao Kahn was arrogant and underestimated Liu Kang's ability.

Raiden's actions ultimately protected earthrealm at the cost of many of its warriors, and at the expense of other realms. However, removing Shao Kahn ensures that he will not win Armageddon, and possibly guarantees that Earthrealm will win it (Raiden was the only one left, after all). He likely has insight to the return of the Dragon King, and can possibly even prevent that from happening as well, which in turn could counter the One Being from coming back as well.

He unwittingly produced new enemies through his actions, but what he did was steer the outcome of Armageddon...for now at least...toward Earthrealm's eventual victory should it even come to that.

Oh, and...

Chrome Wrote:
They are making shit up as they go from each game to the next.... or haven't you noticed that Raiden was originally not giving a flying fuck about humanity in MK1?





NONE of the endings in MK1 other than Liu's were canon. The only other element taken from a character ending that was made canon was Scorpion killing Sub-Zero. Otherwise, the character of Raiden wasn't fleshed out until MK2.

Well, you all got your Tremor now. Can we finally move on?
The_TooCool_MasterPosted: 02/08/2016 11:18 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

To be fair, Raiden is the protector god of Earthrealm. Not the protector god of good guys. While he makes alliances and care about people, he did the right thing. Assuring Shao Kahn's death before Armageddon gives Earthrealm an edge if it ever comes to that.

Let's not forget Raiden has been figthing for Earhrealm for thousands of years. He has seen legions of champions come and go.

Which reminds me... not an original idea in the least, but we need a game set during the tournament that caused the death of the Great Kung Lao.

PickleMendipPosted: 02/09/2016 01:12 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Blade4693 Wrote:
True, but he, Daegon, and Blaze all still exist, and Armageddon can still happen. Mainly all Raiden did was prevent Shao Kahn from winning it if it ever does. I doubt it will ever happen again because NRS likely doesn't want it to, but it definitely could lol


This ^

BTW, Raiden hasn't been spelled with a Y since, like, 1995.

STATE FED LIES CHARM EMPTY EYES. Anon.
shrairyuwarriorPosted: 02/11/2016 08:10 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

Of course Armeggedden can happen. Its been established in MKX comic which is canon and he game itself that the Red Dragon exist. Taven and Deagon appearing game endings and the comic. Rain mentions his father Argus. It may happen but way later then the previous timeline since X already passed that time by many years. Heck before even blaze Onaga is reborn which as far as we know hasnt happened yet Shujinko is in endings and the comic likely still on his quest for the Kamidogu Sigils. Whatever raiden did all i want is new stories no more retread.

PSN:athlos23
TheRealJade98Posted: 02/12/2016 02:14 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

tbh you cant prevent the future events but u can take action 2 re-arrange them...

so Armageddon will happen but not wen it did the first time round. The Dragon King will still hatch but it will happen under different circumstances

Also, why did Raiden say his visions have stopped? In MK9 he received visions from his future self and his amulet cracked @ times the future hadnt been altered..... but if he doesnt get any visions now that kinda tells me Armageddon has been prevented? Hurm, or has it? Did they get rid of the time travel topic cos they ran out of ideas?

I watched terminator genysis and I love ANYTHING time travel related so i guess Im biased but I would have loved more time travelling mentions n Raiden receiving more visions n slowly goin crazy. Or perhaps in someones endin there cudda been ANOTHER time traveller

Maybe one of the kombatants is ALREADY a time traveller but we just dont know it yet? Like, they travelled themselves, found their younger self n imprisoned them n now they're in full knowledge of all the potential future events?

Im ramblin now haha OoO XD

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The_TooCool_MasterPosted: 02/12/2016 02:38 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

I wish they would have played on Shinnok also getting Raiden's visions, changing his plans for the original trilogy, which would explain Quan Chi being in the forefront and working hard to get Shao Kahn to make a mistake.

Then thinking he would be safe to take over everything since Liu Kang and most of the good guys would be is.

I think the visions stopped because the only message he received was to kill Shao Kahn. Once that was dealt with there was nothing else to receive.

Also, beyond the first message, I think the other "visions" he got throughout the games were just him remembering the vision. Like, he didn't receive a vision of Motaro killing Johnny Cage at that point. When Motaro was gonna deliver the blow he remembered he saw that at the beginning and rushed in for the save.

TheRealJade98Posted: 02/12/2016 02:56 PMStatus ::


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What did Raiden actually save with his time travel experience? [SPOILER ALERT]

The_TooCool_Master Wrote:
I wish they would have played on Shinnok also getting Raiden's visions, changing his plans for the original trilogy, which would explain Quan Chi being in the forefront and working hard to get Shao Kahn to make a mistake.



Then thinking he would be safe to take over everything since Liu Kang and most of the good guys would be is.

I think the visions stopped because the only message he received was to kill Shao Kahn. Once that was dealt with there was nothing else to receive.

Also, beyond the first message, I think the other "visions" he got throughout the games were just him remembering the vision. Like, he didn't receive a vision of Motaro killing Johnny Cage at that point. When Motaro was gonna deliver the blow he remembers he saw that at the beginning and rushed in for the save.


aw ok I understand..what do u think about alternate time lines, like in The Flash [earth 2]

Maybe Raiden sent visions to his former self in ANOTHER time line which explains why in this time line Quan Chi is @ Mortal Kombat 1 when we know he wasnt in the 1st game?

Just a thought XD

Either way I think they shud do more with the time travel side of things.

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mattteoPosted: 02/12/2016 04:39 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Raiden actually save with his time travel experience? [SPOILER ALERT]

TheRealJade98 Wrote:
The_TooCool_Master Wrote:
I wish they would have played on Shinnok also getting Raiden's visions, changing his plans for the original trilogy, which would explain Quan Chi being in the forefront and working hard to get Shao Kahn to make a mistake.





Then thinking he would be safe to take over everything since Liu Kang and most of the good guys would be is.

I think the visions stopped because the only message he received was to kill Shao Kahn. Once that was dealt with there was nothing else to receive.

Also, beyond the first message, I think the other "visions" he got throughout the games were just him remembering the vision. Like, he didn't receive a vision of Motaro killing Johnny Cage at that point. When Motaro was gonna deliver the blow he remembers he saw that at the beginning and rushed in for the save.




aw ok I understand..what do u think about alternate time lines, like in The Flash [earth 2]



Maybe Raiden sent visions to his former self in ANOTHER time line which explains why in this time line Quan Chi is @ Mortal Kombat 1 when we know he wasnt in the 1st game?



Just a thought XD



Either way I think they shud do more with the time travel side of things.



Noooooooo
Please, no alternate timelines. That's stupid even for comic books. What is this, Sliders tv series with Jerry O'Connell?
Screw alternate timelines and fake scientists like Michio Kaku supporting this common misconception. It's dumb

TheRealJade98Posted: 02/13/2016 10:25 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Raiden actually save with his time travel experience? [SPOILER ALERT]

mattteo Wrote:
TheRealJade98 Wrote:
The_TooCool_Master Wrote:
I wish they would have played on Shinnok also getting Raiden's visions, changing his plans for the original trilogy, which would explain Quan Chi being in the forefront and working hard to get Shao Kahn to make a mistake.







Then thinking he would be safe to take over everything since Liu Kang and most of the good guys would be is.

I think the visions stopped because the only message he received was to kill Shao Kahn. Once that was dealt with there was nothing else to receive.

Also, beyond the first message, I think the other "visions" he got throughout the games were just him remembering the vision. Like, he didn't receive a vision of Motaro killing Johnny Cage at that point. When Motaro was gonna deliver the blow he remembers he saw that at the beginning and rushed in for the save.






aw ok I understand..what do u think about alternate time lines, like in The Flash [earth 2]





Maybe Raiden sent visions to his former self in ANOTHER time line which explains why in this time line Quan Chi is @ Mortal Kombat 1 when we know he wasnt in the 1st game?





Just a thought XD





Either way I think they shud do more with the time travel side of things.






Noooooooo

Please, no alternate timelines. That's stupid even for comic books. What is this, Sliders tv series with Jerry O'Connell?

Screw alternate timelines and fake scientists like Michio Kaku supporting this common misconception. It's dumb
]

O..k Im really glad u thought out ur reply! "it's dumb" :\

Thanks anyway

Spoilers: (Highlight to reveal)
ur dumb.. jokin! thanks for @ least replyin.

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johnny1upPosted: 02/14/2016 05:06 PMStatus ::


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RE: What did Rayden actually save with his time travel expierience (SPOILER ALERT)

MK9 in and of itself retconned a lot of stuff. Firstly, Armageddon in the originally timeline was about to be caused by too many powerful fighters fighting too intensely throughout the ages weakening the barriers between realms; essentially all of existence was about to collapse in on itself. In the Konquest mode of Armageddon we see it was indeed Taven who beat blaze and ended up getting the godlike power as reward, although winning didn't cause all the warriors to lose their powers or die like it should have, so he was left to figure it out himself. MK9 essentially retconned out Taven and had Shao Kahn win, with Blaze's power acting as a catalyst rather than a solution to Armageddon. The idea of the realms collapsing was more or less forgotten (Although Shao Kahn having ultimate power now probably meant he would join all the realms into one now).

The arcade endings also forget the cannon completely and pretty much exist in their own mini universes (well, most do anyways). Some even ignore the plot of their own game. Kitana's ending directly retconned the events of MK9, where every warrior was killed in the battle of Armageddon. You can indeed see Kitana's dead body in the intro of that game among everyone else's. I would just dismiss this one as non-canon (along with every other one). I would say the same thing about the intro dialogues; they're just for fun.

So overall, in my opinion, Raiden did prevent Armageddon, as far as we're concerned. The parts that don't sync up, chalk it up to mistakes made by the writing team/throwing away story elements to make it simpler.

hey
mattteoPosted: 02/15/2016 03:49 AMStatus ::


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RE: What did Raiden actually save with his time travel experience? [SPOILER ALERT]

TheRealJade98 Wrote:
mattteo Wrote:
TheRealJade98 Wrote:
The_TooCool_Master Wrote:
I wish they would have played on Shinnok also getting Raiden's visions, changing his plans for the original trilogy, which would explain Quan Chi being in the forefront and working hard to get Shao Kahn to make a mistake.









Then thinking he would be safe to take over everything since Liu Kang and most of the good guys would be is.

I think the visions stopped because the only message he received was to kill Shao Kahn. Once that was dealt with there was nothing else to receive.

Also, beyond the first message, I think the other "visions" he got throughout the games were just him remembering the vision. Like, he didn't receive a vision of Motaro killing Johnny Cage at that point. When Motaro was gonna deliver the blow he remembers he saw that at the beginning and rushed in for the save.








aw ok I understand..what do u think about alternate time lines, like in The Flash [earth 2]







Maybe Raiden sent visions to his former self in ANOTHER time line which explains why in this time line Quan Chi is @ Mortal Kombat 1 when we know he wasnt in the 1st game?







Just a thought XD







Either way I think they shud do more with the time travel side of things.









Noooooooo


Please, no alternate timelines. That's stupid even for comic books. What is this, Sliders tv series with Jerry O'Connell?


Screw alternate timelines and fake scientists like Michio Kaku supporting this common misconception. It's dumb
]



O..k Im really glad u thought out ur reply! "it's dumb" :\



Thanks anyway



Spoilers: (Highlight to reveal)
ur dumb.. jokin! thanks for @ least replyin.




There's really not much to say about alternate realities as they have been portrayed in media. It's just dumb, that's the only word for it. From a physical and intellectual point of view, there's nothing to discuss about a universe in which there are alternate versions of the people in our world.
And please don't get into the infinity timelines where one such reality is definitely possible. You will lose the argument

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