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Mortal Kombat X

Discussing Mortal Kombat X and all things Kontemporary to it.
Page of 1

tgrantPosted: 06/11/2005 03:45 PMStatus ::


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Aerial Kombat

I've always loved the idea of being able to fight within the air. Aerial Kombat would allow for a new form of fighting for those characters who possess the ability to fly. It would also allow for a new range of aerial techniques and could lead the way into aerial attacks. It'€™d be an all new side to the fighting in MK and would look incredible if done correctly. Of course, before any such idea is implemented, I’d want the fighting engine to be worked upon. These ideas would be an add on after the overall ground based work is done.

There are a select few characters in MK who we know have the ability to fly. Some can levitate, therefore they have the potential to be able to fly. Such characters are Raiden, Fujin, Sindel and Ermac. I will be using some of them in my examples. In aerial kombat, these characters would obviously take to the air and duke it out in the air. Of course, they would be able to do so against grounded opponents, however to keep things fair I believe the stuff that they could do against them should be limited or even the flight time can be restricted. They would have full flight abilities against other flying opponents.

Aerial Kombat


Movement, evasion, knockdowns and recovery

Movement whilst in the air would be free. You would not be restricted. Your forward movement would be faster whilst your backward movement could be slightly slower. You'd have the ability to move in 3d into the surroundings or towards the camera. You’d also be able to move diagonally upwards or downward in order to gain height, land, evade or advance whilst stepping over any incoming attacks. You can advance on the opponent from above, below or head on. Punches and kicks in the air would perform differently. Kicks cannot be done rapidly and would be more flip orientated due to being suspended in mid air.

To evade incoming projectiles, you can glide (replaces sidestep) towards or away from the camera. Gliding upwards or downwards would be slower than the sidewards glide. You can also dive under projectiles or rise above them and do a charge counter attack on the opponent.

When in close quarters and you hit the opponent hard, you will either send them flying backwards into a wall (unless you’re in open air in which case they’ll eventually slow down). If they hit a wall, then they’ll fall to the ground for extra damage. You can use the pad to stop your advance to wards the wall and recover. Direct knockdowns would see the opponent descend straight to the ground. Stunning the opponent would trigger this also. Uppercuts in the air would propel you on an upwards arc and a sudden descent. Again, recovery is possible before hitting the ground. The camera can zoom out if both opponents deliver powerful projectile attacks at each other and both connect. This allows you to see both players knocked back and their descent to the ground. If in close, both characters would be grounded instantly if their knockdown attacks connected simultaneously. This would return you back to normal ground based kombat.

To cover some ground and to appear behind the enemy, an aerial somersault would be possible by flying upwards and performing a mid air spin and coming down behind the opponent. This can be used to avoid projectiles or an opponent who tries to rush you down.

Project MKK: Coming soon...

Currently working on: MKD & MKA - The One Ring Theory
Dragon Points:
tgrantPosted: 06/11/2005 03:46 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

Spinning techniques, flying kicks and charge attacks

Due to being suspended in air, kicks become a little less effective up close. Flying kicks and spin kick attacks would be more effective for knockback and knockdown purposes. Plus, with the gliding effect in the air, you can multiple kick whilst charging and use some spin kick evades, combos etc whilst in close. Imaging being able to do flip kicks, dive kicks or punches followed by an effortless spin kick followed up by several more, lighter kicks for a combo.

Dive bombs

So you’ve knocked your opponent down to the ground and want to add some extra damage. You could try a dive bomb attack of some sort, whether it end in a punch or kick, or you can just fake the attack and land afterwards and surprise attack your opponent. If you missed with the attack, it will hurt you, especially if you attempted a punch. You could also slam the opponent if you can catch them on their descent to the ground. If you wanted an alternate finish, characters could toss multiple projectiles at the fallen body for extra damage.

Juggles and chain attacks

Combos performed on the ground cannot be performed in the air. If you remember the Smith vs Neo fight in the Matrix Revolutions, aerial kombat would be somewhat like that. There you can see how an in close battle would happen. With the addition of parries, counters etc the kombat in air could be achieved to some extent.

Given the knockback you can get in the air, and the free movement you should be able to rush at the opponent if you knock them upwards or backwards and gain some extra hits. Imagine knocking the opponent even higher up and advancing on their body and knock then towards a wall instead and then once again charge after them and deliver a spin kick from a above that sends them to the ground. Juggle attacks could involve the use of projectiles. Sindel can toss her opponent upwards and spit a fireball at them as they begin their descent to knock them upward again, giving her time advance and get in some extra attacks. Due to Raidens teleport abilities, he can simply teleport to continue his chain attacks, whilst Fujin can propel himself further with his wind powers.


Project MKK: Coming soon...

Currently working on: MKD & MKA - The One Ring Theory
tgrantPosted: 06/11/2005 03:47 PMStatus ::


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Nationality::England
RE: Aerial Kombat

Advanced attacks and throws

Such throws and attacks would have the usual knockback or knockdown effects. One such attack for Sindel would be with the user of her hair. She would grab you in it and spin you around before either launching you across the arena or sending you sailing to the ground. Such an attack could be used to end a juggle. Raiden can summon lighting bolts to juggle you around the arena before finishing with a final bolt that slams you against the floor. As a throw Raiden could toss you upwards and summon a small thundercloud to shock you in the peak of your ascent. Such attacks would not be possible on the ground and would be designed specifically for aerial use.

Effects of the wind

Wind (if weather effects were ever introduced) would play a part in aerial play. It’d increase or decrease movement speed depending on whether or not you were moving with or opposing the direction of the wind. It could send projectiles off balance, blow you out of the air and even speed the opponent up as they are knocked back increasing damage, or helping them recover quicker and minimise damage if they do hit any walls.

Movement will become unstable and erratic depending n how powerful the wind is. Fujin could have the upper hand in such extremes as he has the ability to control the wind. He could have immunity over its effects. The wind can also pick up objects from the ground and have them flying around in the air if you’re near enough to the ground to be hit by the. Being hit would cause damage.

All of the above shows the basics of the idea. Let me know your thoughts and ideas.

Project MKK: Coming soon...

Currently working on: MKD & MKA - The One Ring Theory
MKKitanaPosted: 06/11/2005 06:54 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

Hmmmmm Im not too sure on the ariel kombat thing. I do like the idea in general, but there are only like 6 characters who have the potential to fly: Sindel, Ermac, Kenshi, Nitara...and presumably Rayden and Fujin. It seems like a bit too much effort just for 6 characters, especially when they are kinda unlikely to be in the same game at the same time.

Its one thing to have them fly or levetate, like Rogue/Pheonix/Storm in X-Men Next Dimension, but to have all these different effects from wind etc, and have certain attacks have different effects too, seems a bit too complex. They should spend the time making a really good, solid fighitng engine.

Im not completely writing off the idea, but for me it seems a bit of a waste since its a very small number of characters who would be used with.

Dragon Points:
tgrantPosted: 06/12/2005 06:07 AMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

MKKitana Wrote:
Hmmmmm Im not too sure on the ariel kombat thing. I do like the idea in general, but there are only like 6 characters who have the potential to fly: Sindel, Ermac, Kenshi, Nitara...and presumably Rayden and Fujin. It seems like a bit too much effort just for 6 characters, especially when they are kinda unlikely to be in the same game at the same time.



Its one thing to have them fly or levetate, like Rogue/Pheonix/Storm in X-Men Next Dimension, but to have all these different effects from wind etc, and have certain attacks have different effects too, seems a bit too complex. They should spend the time making a really good, solid fighitng engine.



Im not completely writing off the idea, but for me it seems a bit of a waste since its a very small number of characters who would be used with.


I understand what you're saying and though it may seem complex, not all of it would need to be done. Some of the effects, like the wind effects are simply there for realism. This being said, it's a case of incoporating the idea and then deciding how how in depth you want it to be. As you said, itmight seem a bit much for just a select few characters, but just because that is the case, it shouldn't mean that something for them ahs to be less worked upon than a full engine for everyone. And I also want the fighting engine worked upon first. It has to be the no.1 priority for MK7. Anything like this shouldn't even be considered until the main engine is developed and thoroughly tested.

Project MKK: Coming soon...

Currently working on: MKD & MKA - The One Ring Theory
TheKryptPosted: 06/12/2005 07:34 AMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

I think those are great ideas, but as MKKitana pointed out that you are not going to have much characters. But other than that it would sound like a great game(gameplay wise) It would be really cool to have minor effects such as weather in the game because you have to see the small things DO make such marks in games.

GamePlay wise- I think the movements have to be sharp and sensitive to work, But it does seem a bit hard to have a fighting game to fight in the air. I would imagine you would have to use the D-Pad and the analoge sticks to have the movements you are imagining... But the fighting, you made it sound awesome. Yet again, controlls can "potentially" be hard to use.

Characters- As much as this game sounds awesome, the amount of characters are unpleasing. I mean they can also make new characters...But I doubt it(obviously they wont make a mass number of new characters to make) They can also be half-asses and use a jetpack as a key solution for the flight of flightless characters.

Story wise- I don't know about this cause you really haven't touched upon this. Would this follow the main story? or just be a group of side-stories of some sort?

Overall oppinion: 8/10. I am sorry but the lack of characters and the massive amounts of fighting used in effect with a controller... you have to think about how much you can do with one controller, about the flight moving around, fighting while flying, throws in air, specials while flying... It's overwhelming how great they seem to be, but seriosuly look down at a controller and it seems like the controlls are going to be hard to use.

If you want to, you can possibly add a story if you want to your description of the game to not make it only sound about the gameplay rather than the characters also...

Oh and It would be unique to make your own button format for the game to prove my statement is wrong about the controllers. If you do I take back about how hard the controlls may seem with all the options you have given..

(P.S: I am glad that you finaly posted your ideas for something, been a while bro )

Dragon Points:
MolochMonstaPosted: 06/13/2005 08:34 AMStatus ::


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Nationality::United States
RE: Aerial Kombat

http://mortalkombatonline.com/content/forum/showmessage.cds?id=42454

what did you mean by "new" kombat idea?

out of ninjas, cyborg thugs, evil ninja robots, martial artists, martial artists with sharp hats, princesses, bodyguards with more than 4 limbs, undead movie stars, native american shamans, evil emporrers, gods and secret service agents, you say Stryker didn't fit in MK3?
krsx66Posted: 06/13/2005 03:16 PMStatus ::


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Nationality::Japan
RE: Aerial Kombat

I don't understand why you guys are so close minded about such a concept, well I do, but you just have to think bigger and such an idea becomes plausible - and should be the type of concept Mortal Kombat should strive to achieve, especialy after the debacle that was MKD...

Personaly I believe Ariel Kombat is a fantastic idea, but probably would be more suited to MK8. Reason being, is that like you said Ty, they need to seriously revamp the fighting engine first. Once that is solid, then such elaborate suggestions could (and must if the series is to survive) be realized.

At first, when I read the topic, I was apprehensive to say the least. I recently saw the movie "Hero", which although was great, was downright spoilt by the over the top, aerial combat parts of the fighting scenes. The same went for the parts I saw of "Croutching Tiger, Hidden Dragon", good movie, spoilt by out of this word fighting abilities.
However, once I read all of the intricicies and the fact that it was only available for characters such as Raiden, Fujin, Nitara, Ermac, Kenshi, Sindel and Shang Tsung (have you guys forgotten MK1 already?) I began to think that it could work.

Now, the reason I believe it would be feasible for only those select few characters to posses aerial combat manuveurs, is because every other character should have a complex fighting ability (dependant upon their skills) also.
Tremor would be able to disrupt the arena to his advantage, with his powers of Earthquake manipulation. Yes, the aerial combatants would be able to ascend to avoid the tremors on the ground, but he could shake the entire arena, causing instability in the ceiling - and rubble to break off, creating hazards in the air that must be avoided. This would force the aerial combatants back to the ground, so traditonal combat could continue. Scorpion's / Smoke's spear could aimed at aerial opponents, in order to pull the combants out of the air, similarly - Sektor's homing missles and Cyrax's net could force the decendance from the air. Sub Zero's ice showers would now have a purpose in 3D combat, and could be intergrated quite nicely, as a formidable weapon. So even though it would seem that these select few combatants would have such a superior advantage over everyone else, the remaining "ground combatants" would have similar abilities, but relating to their own special moves from previous games. Scorpion could fill the arena with fire, which he would be immune too (since he is spawned from hell and all). Smoke could hinder his opponent by filling the arena with smoke, making it difficuly to see, and his special attacks would be suited to a Smoke filled arena, whereas everyone elses wouldn't be. Sub Zero obviously could use his ice powers to his advantage, and Sektor could also use fire - with his flamethrower, to make a hazardous stage.

Now, back to the aerial combat. I really liked the inclusion of the idea that the wind would play a significant role, and that Fujin (and probably Raiden too) would be immune to its effects. In such a wind affected arena, projectiles fired would become eratic, and possibly dangerous to yourself, as they could backfire, ending up damaging your character. Imagine the chaos of the fighting field, if the wind became strong, and the concepts that I just presented were in use. I can imagine Scorpion filling the arena with fire, which becomes uncontrollable when the wind picks up, making it hazardous for both combatants, and complete mayhem - all whilst you are trying to fight one another!

Mortal Kombat is supposed to a fight to the death. With such changes in the style of fighting, and full usage of the special abilities we know the fighters possess, MK could pull itself out of the hole it dug itself into with MK: Deception. And the only way to do that is with the inclusion of such elaborate concepts like Aerial Kombat.

I bet after MK: Shaolin Monks is released, more people will look to ideas such as tgrant's and hope to see them in MK7...I think it's great, and is exactly the forward thinking MK needs to implement to improve.

Dragon Points:
Sub_Zero_13Posted: 06/13/2005 07:45 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

MK started out as a Shaolin-Based tournament. It's not Dragonball Z, Aerial combat is a cool idea, it just doesn't belong in MK.

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tgrantPosted: 06/14/2005 02:21 PMStatus ::


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Visits::61704
Nationality::England
RE: Aerial Kombat

TheKrypt Wrote:
I think those are great ideas, but as MKKitana pointed out that you are not going to have much characters. But other than that it would sound like a great game(gameplay wise) It would be really cool to have minor effects such as weather in the game because you have to see the small things DO make such marks in games.



GamePlay wise- I think the movements have to be sharp and sensitive to work, But it does seem a bit hard to have a fighting game to fight in the air. I would imagine you would have to use the D-Pad and the analoge sticks to have the movements you are imagining... But the fighting, you made it sound awesome. Yet again, controlls can "potentially" be hard to use.



Characters- As much as this game sounds awesome, the amount of characters are unpleasing. I mean they can also make new characters...But I doubt it(obviously they wont make a mass number of new characters to make) They can also be half-asses and use a jetpack as a key solution for the flight of flightless characters.



Story wise- I don't know about this cause you really haven't touched upon this. Would this follow the main story? or just be a group of side-stories of some sort?



Overall oppinion: 8/10. I am sorry but the lack of characters and the massive amounts of fighting used in effect with a controller... you have to think about how much you can do with one controller, about the flight moving around, fighting while flying, throws in air, specials while flying... It's overwhelming how great they seem to be, but seriosuly look down at a controller and it seems like the controlls are going to be hard to use.



If you want to, you can possibly add a story if you want to your description of the game to not make it only sound about the gameplay rather than the characters also...



Oh and It would be unique to make your own button format for the game to prove my statement is wrong about the controllers. If you do I take back about how hard the controlls may seem with all the options you have given..



(P.S: I am glad that you finaly posted your ideas for something, been a while bro )


I can see where you're coming from with a lot of what you've said.

Firstly, I'm not sure if you view this type of kombat for a stand alone game where the entire game is just aerial kombat. I wouldn't want that. this would be in your normal MK game, and available to the characters who can fly as an alternate way to attack, defend etc. There is no need for a story for it.

As for the controls, it might be hard to input so many things, but they don't all have to be used. I doubt that the overall fighting controls would chage that much. You could use button combinations such as 2+4 to do a technique like the dive bomb. The 3d movement would be done via the stick, though I think you're right in the fact that the d-pad or maybe another stick would need to be involved. Throwing would be done with your normal throw button. The recoveries just down by holding forward or back. It wouldn't be too complex. Just the ful 3d movement would be, I think.

And as for non flying characters, you should see krsx66's post. Just because overs can fly, it doesn't mean they need to and it doesn't mean they're at any disadvantage.

Thanks for the reply, bro!

MolochMonsta Wrote:
http://mortalkombatonline.com/content/forum/showmessage.cds?id=42454

what did you mean by "new" kombat idea?


I never saw that topic, but that guy just mentions people flying and nothing else. My idea touches upon the use of flying to actually fight rather than flying around spitting fireballs and nothing else like Sindel used to in MK3-MKT.

Project MKK: Coming soon...

Currently working on: MKD & MKA - The One Ring Theory
tgrantPosted: 06/14/2005 03:57 PMStatus ::


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Visits::61704
Nationality::England
RE: Aerial Kombat

krsx66 Wrote:
I don't understand why you guys are so close minded about such a concept, well I do, but you just have to think bigger and such an idea becomes plausible - and should be the type of concept Mortal Kombat should strive to achieve, especialy after the debacle that was MKD...



Personaly I believe Ariel Kombat is a fantastic idea, but probably would be more suited to MK8. Reason being, is that like you said Ty, they need to seriously revamp the fighting engine first. Once that is solid, then such elaborate suggestions could (and must if the series is to survive) be realized.



At first, when I read the topic, I was apprehensive to say the least. I recently saw the movie "Hero", which although was great, was downright spoilt by the over the top, aerial combat parts of the fighting scenes. The same went for the parts I saw of "Croutching Tiger, Hidden Dragon", good movie, spoilt by out of this word fighting abilities.

However, once I read all of the intricicies and the fact that it was only available for characters such as Raiden, Fujin, Nitara, Ermac, Kenshi, Sindel and Shang Tsung (have you guys forgotten MK1 already?) I began to think that it could work.



Now, the reason I believe it would be feasible for only those select few characters to posses aerial combat manuveurs, is because every other character should have a complex fighting ability (dependant upon their skills) also.

Tremor would be able to disrupt the arena to his advantage, with his powers of Earthquake manipulation. Yes, the aerial combatants would be able to ascend to avoid the tremors on the ground, but he could shake the entire arena, causing instability in the ceiling - and rubble to break off, creating hazards in the air that must be avoided. This would force the aerial combatants back to the ground, so traditonal combat could continue. Scorpion's / Smoke's spear could aimed at aerial opponents, in order to pull the combants out of the air, similarly - Sektor's homing missles and Cyrax's net could force the decendance from the air. Sub Zero's ice showers would now have a purpose in 3D combat, and could be intergrated quite nicely, as a formidable weapon. So even though it would seem that these select few combatants would have such a superior advantage over everyone else, the remaining "ground combatants" would have similar abilities, but relating to their own special moves from previous games. Scorpion could fill the arena with fire, which he would be immune too (since he is spawned from hell and all). Smoke could hinder his opponent by filling the arena with smoke, making it difficuly to see, and his special attacks would be suited to a Smoke filled arena, whereas everyone elses wouldn't be. Sub Zero obviously could use his ice powers to his advantage, and Sektor could also use fire - with his flamethrower, to make a hazardous stage.



Now, back to the aerial combat. I really liked the inclusion of the idea that the wind would play a significant role, and that Fujin (and probably Raiden too) would be immune to its effects. In such a wind affected arena, projectiles fired would become eratic, and possibly dangerous to yourself, as they could backfire, ending up damaging your character. Imagine the chaos of the fighting field, if the wind became strong, and the concepts that I just presented were in use. I can imagine Scorpion filling the arena with fire, which becomes uncontrollable when the wind picks up, making it hazardous for both combatants, and complete mayhem - all whilst you are trying to fight one another!



Mortal Kombat is supposed to a fight to the death. With such changes in the style of fighting, and full usage of the special abilities we know the fighters possess, MK could pull itself out of the hole it dug itself into with MK: Deception. And the only way to do that is with the inclusion of such elaborate concepts like Aerial Kombat.



I bet after MK: Shaolin Monks is released, more people will look to ideas such as tgrant's and hope to see them in MK7...I think it's great, and is exactly the forward thinking MK needs to implement to improve.



Hey, bro! I’m really glad you like the idea. Thanks for defending it for me! Lol!

I saw both Hero and Crouching Tiger and I haven’t modelled these ideas off anything else. They’re just based on what I envisioned in my mind. A lot of my ideas work that way. I try to expand upon things rather than copy something else.

Now I love all of these counters to the aerial characters that you made and think they’d be perfect in game. I can definitely see the earthquakes and the landslides and ceilings crumbling through Tremors manipulation. And the effect doesn’t even have to be there to counter aerial players. It can just be used to add dangers and hazards to the arena.

Scorpion and Smoke aiming the spears upwards along with the ideas for Sub-Zero and Sektor rule. It would show that there still is balance in the game. Just because others can fly, it doesn’t mean they’re at an instant advantage. It was never the case with Sindel in MK3-MKT. She could be stopped.

I made a thread before MKD was released detailing the wind effects that could be used in game and they’re as you described. You’ll remember the thread. It was my Temple of the Elements stage concept. With what you said about Scorpion filling the arena with fire, the wind building up should effectively cancel it out. Flight would be limited and probably impossible and onscreen movement would be heavily erractic.

Hopefully aerial kombat will be considered in future MK games. I thinkit’d be a nice addition to the norm and could be pretty neat if done well.


Sub_Zero_13 Wrote:
MK started out as a Shaolin-Based tournament. It's not Dragonball Z, Aerial combat is a cool idea, it just doesn't belong in MK.


It did start of as a tournament, but you seem to forget about the god characters and those with the ability to levitate and fly. Surely that can do that whilst fighting. And MK doesn’t need to be anything like DBZ for it to work. The DBZ games are very poor imo. I wouldn’t want MK anything like them at all!

Project MKK: Coming soon...

Currently working on: MKD & MKA - The One Ring Theory
NikodemusPosted: 06/14/2005 04:32 PMStatus ::


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Nationality::Canada
RE: Aerial Kombat

I think that those are all good ideas, but I a™m not sure how well they would be executed if Midway attempt to implement an aerial combat system and it ends up as well executed as the deceptions combat engine. Also, like others have said only a select few in the MK universe are able to fly/float. Those who have this ability to fly in the air would only be able to do a limited amount of things to a combatant who is on the ground and can't fly. I realize this isn't a disadvantage for the characters that can't fly since you could just give them vertical projectile attacks and what not to compensate, but for the character that can fly his aerial combat abilities would be for the most part useless. It would be like creating a secondary combat system that will only get used 25% of the time (depending on how many of the characters can fly).

One idea I do like that could be modified slightly is the Dive Bomb. I have a game on my Sega Saturn called Nightwarriors. When you knock a fighter to the ground you can press up + punch (I think, it's been a while) and while your opponent is still on the ground your character will jump into the air and dive onto them with a unique attack for a little extra damage. I always thought it was a neat ability, and I think that could easily be added to a combat system without complicating things to much.

One way I think this aerial combat system could be incorporate would be with multi-tiered arenas. In Mortal Kombat Deception it was possible to punch/kick/push your opponent through a barrier down to another part of that arena. Another, possible thing they could add to this is a tackle through this barrier where both opponents fall at relatively the same time. This would allow both characters to engage in some sorta aerial combat while they are freefalling to the next level of the arena. This wouldn'™t limit the characters with no flying abilities to engage in aerial combat. That's about the only way I would like to see this aerial combat system used in MK.

These ideas are all really good though and I think if they were used to create a completely new game it would be better. That way you could create reasons why everyone in the game is able to fly.

Dragon Points:
SmokeNc-017Posted: 06/14/2005 09:44 PMStatus ::


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Nationality::United States
RE: Aerial Kombat

I don't think there should be aerial kombat as much as there could be short lock-ups in mid air. So instead of having the full fight above the ground, when two players jump at eachother with strike and both meet in the center at the same time then there should be a 5 second aerial suspension where the fighters could go at it before coming down to the ground. It can have the same principal as Budokia 3. When two characters lock up in mid air, they can go at it with either rotating the joysticks and who ever is faster wins, or they can do it like a QTE from Shenmue where a series of buttons comes up and who ever hits them first lands the strike. it doesn't have to last long but it can a nice touch.

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tgrantPosted: 06/15/2005 02:18 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

Nikodemus Wrote:
I think that those are all good ideas, but I am not sure how well they would be executed if Midway attempt to implement an aerial combat system and it ends up as well executed as the deceptions combat engine. Also, like others have said only a select few in the MK universe are able to fly/float. Those who have this ability to fly in the air would only be able to do a limited amount of things to a combatant who is on the ground and can't fly. I realize this isn't a disadvantage for the characters that can't fly since you could just give them vertical projectile attacks and what not to compensate, but for the character that can fly his aerial combat abilities would be for the most part useless. It would be like creating a secondary combat system that will only get used 25% of the time (depending on how many of the characters can fly).



One idea I do like that could be modified slightly is the Dive Bomb. I have a game on my Sega Saturn called Nightwarriors. When you knock a fighter to the ground you can press up + punch (I think, it's been a while) and while your opponent is still on the ground your character will jump into the air and dive onto them with a unique attack for a little extra damage. I always thought it was a neat ability, and I think that could easily be added to a combat system without complicating things to much.



One way I think this aerial combat system could be incorporate would be with multi-tiered arenas. In Mortal Kombat Deception it was possible to punch/kick/push your opponent through a barrier down to another part of that arena. Another, possible thing they could add to this is a tackle through this barrier where both opponents fall at relatively the same time. This would allow both characters to engage in some sorta aerial combat while they are freefalling to the next level of the arena. This wouldn’t limit the characters with no flying abilities to engage in aerial combat. That's about the only way I would like to see this aerial combat system used in MK.



These ideas are all really good though and I think if they were used to create a completely new game it would be better. That way you could create reasons why everyone in the game is able to fly.



Thanks for the reply, man. I’ve already addressed the character limit, so I won’t do so again. I do like the idea of the modified dive attack. This would allow all characters to possess such an ability and it’d be great to see the many various ways in which it could be executed.

Your idea of a small bit of aerial kombat during the tier level falls is brilliant! Though I don’t know how that’d work considering one player is knocked through and the other follows later, so they probably wouldn’t get time to fight in the air at all. Both characters falling at the same time as you said more than likely wouldn’t happen unless it was a stage like the Falling Cliffs.

I’m glad you liked my ideas though. Thanks man!

SmokeNc-017 Wrote:
I don't think there should be aerial kombat as much as there could be short lock-ups in mid air. So instead of having the full fight above the ground, when two players jump at each other with strike and both meet in the center at the same time then there should be a 5 second aerial suspension where the fighters could go at it before coming down to the ground. It can have the same principal as Budokia 3. When two characters lock up in mid air, they can go at it with either rotating the joysticks and who ever is faster wins, or they can do it like a QTE from Shenmue where a series of buttons comes up and who ever hits them first lands the strike. it doesn't have to last long but it can a nice touch.


I’m not sure about what you mean by lock-ups. Though your overall idea sounds similiar to the one Nikodemus has, though yours starts off with the jump. I’d hate to see an idea like this that could be so widely used only have a minimal play in the game. Your idea also seems to imply that there’s be no overall damage and only one successive hit and then a drop to the ground to continue the main fight. I think that’d be pretty basic. It reminds me of the fight scene in Big Trouble of Little China though! Lol!

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krsx66Posted: 06/15/2005 02:29 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

Nikodemus Wrote:
One way I think this aerial combat system could be incorporate would be with multi-tiered arenas. In Mortal Kombat Deception it was possible to punch/kick/push your opponent through a barrier down to another part of that arena. Another, possible thing they could add to this is a tackle through this barrier where both opponents fall at relatively the same time. This would allow both characters to engage in some sorta aerial combat while they are freefalling to the next level of the arena. This wouldn'™t limit the characters with no flying abilities to engage in aerial combat. That's about the only way I would like to see this aerial combat system used in MK.


SmokeNc-017 Wrote:
I don't think there should be aerial kombat as much as there could be short lock-ups in mid air. So instead of having the full fight above the ground, when two players jump at eachother with strike and both meet in the center at the same time then there should be a 5 second aerial suspension where the fighters could go at it before coming down to the ground.


I like these ideas, and if most people think the full on aerial combat is too elaborate, then maybe this is the way to go. But if the mid-air freefall combat was used, I'd still like characters with flight ability to have the advantage in the air. Say a non-flight character wins the brief mid-air battle, and sends say, Raiden, plummeting to the ground, I'd like to see something implemented where Raiden (or Fujin, or Nitara etc.) could lessen or even avoid the extra damage of slamming into the ground by using their ability of flight. To compensate for the non-aerial fighters, all in-air moves done by Raiden, Ermac and co. could do less damage, so although they can avoid damage by utilizing their added capabilities, the damage they inflict during the aerial combat is reduced...

So that's my idea. The concept of mid-air battle, especialy when falling from a higher tier to a lower one in, is great - very innovative.

tgrantPosted: 06/18/2005 10:06 AMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

krsx66 Wrote:
Nikodemus Wrote:
One way I think this aerial combat system could be incorporate would be with multi-tiered arenas. In Mortal Kombat Deception it was possible to punch/kick/push your opponent through a barrier down to another part of that arena. Another, possible thing they could add to this is a tackle through this barrier where both opponents fall at relatively the same time. This would allow both characters to engage in some sorta aerial combat while they are freefalling to the next level of the arena. This wouldn'™t limit the characters with no flying abilities to engage in aerial combat. That's about the only way I would like to see this aerial combat system used in MK.




SmokeNc-017 Wrote:
I don't think there should be aerial kombat as much as there could be short lock-ups in mid air. So instead of having the full fight above the ground, when two players jump at eachother with strike and both meet in the center at the same time then there should be a 5 second aerial suspension where the fighters could go at it before coming down to the ground.




I like these ideas, and if most people think the full on aerial combat is too elaborate, then maybe this is the way to go. But if the mid-air freefall combat was used, I'd still like characters with flight ability to have the advantage in the air. Say a non-flight character wins the brief mid-air battle, and sends say, Raiden, plummeting to the ground, I'd like to see something implemented where Raiden (or Fujin, or Nitara etc.) could lessen or even avoid the extra damage of slamming into the ground by using their ability of flight. To compensate for the non-aerial fighters, all in-air moves done by Raiden, Ermac and co. could do less damage, so although they can avoid damage by utilizing their added capabilities, the damage they inflict during the aerial combat is reduced...



So that's my idea. The concept of mid-air battle, especialy when falling from a higher tier to a lower one in, is great - very innovative.



Combining all of this, I think would be great. I like the idea of characters using their flight to minimise damage. I guess the recovery I mentioned can be used in such a way also. It'd be nice to see Fujin using guts of wind in the air and Nitara attacking with her wings maybe as some aerial attacks.

But what of the non flying players if they win the aerial bout? If they're falling from high up, surely they'll take some damage too. They can't just walk away unscathed.

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bleedPosted: 06/18/2005 01:20 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

Any character could be spared from the fall after an air combo like this.


1= tap block or press dd when you take the last hit to make your guy turn or flip in the air while falling and land on their feet. Like a cat

It could be called a Cat Recovery or just "cat-r"

Instead of a tec. roll you would land on your feet with a "cat-r"

2= Special recovery = specific fighters that can fly or levitate would be able to use the regular "cat-r" plus some special move like using their power to levitate or move while falling. Maybe do an air counter after recovering using their power to fly.

With scorpion you could do a special counter attack while falling.

disappear in to the ground and do a teleport punch or teleport combo from behind the opponent.

It would be a just frame move (limit 2-3 frames), Just before he lands on the ground, you would tap d+1+2 to (teleport punch) or d+3+4 to (teleport kick)

That makes me think of a new air throw for scorpion using his spear.

He throws the spear down at a 45* angle, yanks the opponent up hard then clotheslines them with the spear throwing arm. Scorpion would keep spinning like 2 times as he lands on the ground while the opponent flays around then landing on their head or front or back.

How the opponent lands after the throw depends on how high Scorpion is when he does it. If the opponent lands on their head, it causes more damage.

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tgrantPosted: 06/23/2005 04:13 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

bleed Wrote:
Any character could be spared from the fall after an air combo like this.





1= tap block or press dd when you take the last hit to make your guy turn or flip in the air while falling and land on their feet. Like a cat



It could be called a Cat Recovery or just "cat-r"



Instead of a tec. roll you would land on your feet with a "cat-r"




That is awesome. It reminds me instantly of Catwoman! Lol! I think they should take some minor damage though as they're not superhuman. the damamge would of course be less than normal. I would just love to see that in game. Hell, it doesn't have to be on falls of a high distance either. You should be able to do that out of juggle combos or uppercuts.

bleed Wrote:


2= Special recovery = specific fighters that can fly or levitate would be able to use the regular "cat-r" plus some special move like using their power to levitate or move while falling. Maybe do an air counter after recovering using their power to fly.



With scorpion you could do a special counter attack while falling.



disappear in to the ground and do a teleport punch or teleport combo from behind the opponent.



It would be a just frame move (limit 2-3 frames), Just before he lands on the ground, you would tap d+1+2 to (teleport punch) or d+3+4 to (teleport kick)




I like this idea. This would allow for some sort of wake up game to be added into the mix and byt mixing in the special technique with the cat one you could trick your opponent to block or attack whislt you do the opposite. I think a sweep could be added in there too just knockdown anyone who tries to advance on you as you fall or even a backwards flip/ those could be done with:

Sweep: b+1+2

Backflip: b+3+4

bleed Wrote:
Any character could be spared from the fall after an air combo like this.



That makes me think of a new air throw for scorpion using his spear.



He throws the spear down at a 45* angle, yanks the opponent up hard then clotheslines them with the spear throwing arm. Scorpion would keep spinning like 2 times as he lands on the ground while the opponent flays around then landing on their head or front or back.



How the opponent lands after the throw depends on how high Scorpion is when he does it. If the opponent lands on their head, it causes more damage.


My only problem with this throw is that Scorpions pulls them into the air. He can't fly so he shouldn't be able to do such a thing as he has no leverage within the air. He'd be falling as he tried to pull them up which would in the end result in them stumbling forward. If he can fly though, it's a different story and would amazing!

Awesome ideas, bro!

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Mk_FrEaKPosted: 06/23/2005 06:40 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

OK, after finally reading through all the thread, I've come to the conclussion that including Aerial combat would be too risky. It could make many characters godlike and it could make online gaming boring (due opponents turtling or abusing the distance powers). Many ppl would abuse the ability of this characters to their benefit, and even though the option is timed, the "Ground" characters would have a disadvantage.

Even though you will limit the amount of time and powers they will ahve in mid air, a ground character will ahve no choice but to defend, when a fighter gains higher ground, they have an advantage (So Star Wars), as they cannot jump towards them as they will be well recieved with a nice kick/punch/power .

Another disadvantage to air fighting would be deathtraps as tehy will be invulnerable to them, they would just fly out of the deathtrap or save themselves in mid-air.

Als oI think this resembles a lot with Dragon Ball Series where the action in mid air is quite heavey.

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krsx66Posted: 06/24/2005 03:36 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

Mk_FrEaK Wrote:
Also I think this resembles a lot with Dragon Ball Series.


No more than the MKD intro did...

tgrantPosted: 06/26/2005 10:28 AMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

Mk_FrEaK Wrote:
OK, after finally reading through all the thread, I've come to the conclussion that including Aerial combat would be too risky. It could make many characters godlike and it could make online gaming boring (due opponents turtling or abusing the distance powers). Many ppl would abuse the ability of this characters to their benefit, and even though the option is timed, the "Ground" characters would have a disadvantage.



Even though you will limit the amount of time and powers they will ahve in mid air, a ground character will ahve no choice but to defend, when a fighter gains higher ground, they have an advantage (So Star Wars), as they cannot jump towards them as they will be well recieved with a nice kick/punch/power .



Another disadvantage to air fighting would be deathtraps as tehy will be invulnerable to them, they would just fly out of the deathtrap or save themselves in mid-air.



Als oI think this resembles a lot with Dragon Ball Series where the action in mid air is quite heavey.


Other people have suggested ideas to help even the field between airborne and grounded opponents. Do you not think any of them would be useful?

I can understand what you mean by the abusal as it’d be a case of being airborne for the time period, evade and attack, land and then rinse and repeat. I did say earlier that against grounded opponents, full aerial flight wouldn’t be allowed, though it could be made that those who can fly can only take to the air against other flying characters.

Deathtraps shouldn’t be avoided if they’re on the ground when knocked into one. I would have it so that they could hover as the deathtraps should be only be avoided by careful evasion. Besides, when being knocked into the deathtraps, it’s usually by power hits and I would assume the opponent would b stunned and unable to recover in time anyway. Whilst in the air, some death traps could be made for those in the air. Imagine if they fly too high and a lightning bolt fries them to death.

krsx66 Wrote:
Mk_FrEaK Wrote:
Also I think this resembles a lot with Dragon Ball Series.




No more than the MKD intro did...


What you talking ‘bout Willis?

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takermkPosted: 06/26/2005 12:38 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

About the aerial kombat, meh. It's a great idea, but I don't think that it would quite fit into the MK universe. But I would like to see the ability to do special moves in the air, like air fireballs and stuff like that in the future MK's. Sorry, but I'm too tired right now to post any more stuff.

tgrantPosted: 06/28/2005 02:26 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

takermk Wrote:
About the aerial kombat, meh. It's a great idea, but I don't think that it would quite fit into the MK universe. But I would like to see the ability to do special moves in the air, like air fireballs and stuff like that in the future MK's. Sorry, but I'm too tired right now to post any more stuff.


Well, that looks like it's a no to the ideas here being implemented into the game, but at least you all like the overall concept. i agree it probably wouldn't fit intot he MK universe ona whole as it really is only for some characters, but that being said, it worked on the X-Men games and didn't damage the gameplay in any way.

Thanks for the replies everyone.

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bleedPosted: 06/28/2005 04:38 PMStatus ::


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RE: Aerial Kombat

tgrant Wrote:


My only problem with this throw is that Scorpions pulls them into the air. He can't fly so he shouldn't be able to do such a thing as he has no leverage within the air. He'd be falling as he tried to pull them up which would in the end result in them stumbling forward. If he can fly though, it's a different story and would amazing!



Awesome ideas, bro!



Doh!, I didn't think of that.

In that Case, give the throw to Ermac and replace the spear with telekinesis.

Either that, or have the throw be something that Scorpion can only do during a high tire change. = like when you knock someone off the roof top in the Sky tower.

It could be like a special multitire stomp attack. Any fighter can do multi tire stomp attacks and special attacks can be part of them.

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