Dude, that's awesome!

I haven't listened to it yet, but just based on the subject matter, I will. I love breaking down all things Halo, especially the multiplayer maps. In 3, Reach, and definitely in 4, I'll be searching Forge for good remakes of previous maps, because I love revisiting past experiences in the current metagame.

For sure man. Definitely agreed. I love the maps throughout the series, so many awesome memories from CE-Reach. So it's fun to get together with some friends, play them once again and discuss them in review fashion. If people are looking for high level play, technical analysis, MLG styled, this probably isn't your cup of tea. We cater more to the people who have fun, but still like to be competitive, ultimately having a good time. So yeah, if that's your style, this is right up your alley. Whether you agree or disagree with our opinions is irrelevant, listen and we'd love to hear yours as well. It's awesome to see how different experiences can lead to different feelings on each of them.

If you dig what you hear/see subscribe, because we've got plenty more coming. :) We're all huge gamers, and as you can see by my visits, i've been coming here since 2001. Even though I bleed MK, Halo, and Mario, we love discussing it all, so many awesome memories with the franchises we love. So if you don't already have enough content to look at on a weekly basis, check us out. :P

Can't wait for Halo 4! I'm right with you there on Forge. I'm hoping for some awesome remakes. I hope Valhalla isn't the only remake in Halo 4 when everything is all said and done, after the DLC maps are all out. I'd love to see a couple more return from 2 or 3.

Really couldn't have said it better myself. I used to run a league during Halo 3's run (also did one for Reach, but it was much smaller), and I was able to make use out of just about every map in some way. The ones I'd most like to see return are:

The Pit
Backwash
Waterworks
Orbital
Longshore
Turf

Notice that I didn't put anything from Reach, because just about every map was shit in that game... even the remakes. When over half the maps have the exact same color palette, it doesn't work. I'm looking forward to a legitimate effort this time from 343.

Just to name my favorites from each title:

Halo: CE - Blood Gulch, Boarding Action, Prisoner, Wizard
Halo 2 - Lockout, Midship, Backwash, Turf, Sanctuary
Halo 3 - The Pit, Construct, Guardian, Isolation
Halo Reach - ... ... ... Asylum by default, but nothing else was really enjoyable.

I'm really looking forward to trying out what Halo 4 has to offer, both in maps and overall gameplay. The new progression system looks cool and while I dislike the idea of loadouts and moving away from the arena style that Halo is known for, I don't think that necessarily ruins gameplay.

All this talk about Halo does make me want to revive the old league...

Yeah, the Reach maps were by far the worst, not one of which I would like to see return. I won't say anymore, otherwise i'll spoil the whole review of the maps when we get to them next week, but yeah...Reach was easily the worst in the series when it comes to the maps.

Halo 4's look really promising. They have gone on record saying they are made with competitive multiplayer in mind, and from the videos i've seen of each map shown, they definitely look much more promising, closer to Halo 3 and 2's standards etc.

We'll see what happens. You are welcome to add me on live: Aggressive Sock

Having more people to play with is always a plus. Hope you enjoy the series, and i'd love to get your individual ratings on each map to see if you had different feelings on all of them compared to what we thought. It's always interesting to see when someone really loved a map that the majority disliked, or vice versa.

Alright, you've been added to my friends list. My tag is Eirewolf10, if you were wondering.

I've decided to put together lists for each game (excluding remakes unless drastically different):

Halo: CE
1- Blood Gulch 9.5/10
2- Boarding Action 9.25/10
3- Prisoner 8.75/10
4- Wizard 8.5/10
5- Sidewinder 8/10
6- Battle Creek 7.5/10
7- Chill Out 7/10
8- Hang 'Em High 7/10
9- Longest 7/10
10- Derelict 6.75/10
11- Rat Race 6.5/10
12- Chiron 6.5/10
13- Damnation 6/10

Halo 2
1- Lockout 10/10
2- Midship 9.75/10
3- Backwash 9.25/10
4- Turf 9/10
5- Sanctuary 9/10
6- Ascension 8.75/10
7- Waterworks 8.5/10
8- Foundation 8.5/10
9- Ivory Tower 8.25/10
10- Gemini 8/10
11- Colossus 7.5/10
12- Headlong 7.25/10
13- Burial Mounds 7/10
14- Containment 6.75/10
15- Zanzibar 6.5/10
16- Terminal 6/10
17- Relic 5/10

Halo 3
1- The Pit 9.5/10
2- Construct 9.25/10
3- Guardian 9.25/10
4- Isolation 8.75/10
5- Orbital 8.5/10
6- Longshore 8.25/10
7- Snowbound 8.25/10
8- Narrows 8/10
9- Foundry 7.75/10
10- Sandbox 7.25/10
11- Ghost Town 7/10
12- Valhalla 6.75/10
13- Rat's Nest 6.5/10
14- Assembly 6.5/10
15- High Ground 6/10
16- Citadel 6/10
17- Epitaph 5.5/10
18- Standoff 5/10
19- Sandtrap 5/10

Halo Reach
NOTE: I don't have anything past the first DLC pack. Also not ranking Firefight maps.
1- Countdown 7/10
2- Powerhouse 6.5/10
3- Zealot 6/10
4- Anchor 9 6/10
5- Boneyard 5.5/10
6- Tempest 5.5/10
7- The Cage 5/10
8- Breakpoint 5/10
9- Boardwalk 3/10
10- Paradiso 2/10
11- Sword Base 1/10
12- Spire 0/10

Yep, Spire gets a 0. It's that retarded. Sword Base only gets a 1 instead of a 0 because King is fun on it.

Definitely some interesting ratings. I can already say there will be some times where you listen to our ratings and completely agree, and other times where you are screaming at the screen wishing you could express your opinion as well out of disagreement. :P

We had a lot more varying ratings. Yours are mostly 5 or above, at least for CE-3, whereas we definitely gave a few 2-4 if we just didn't think it was up to standards(5 being completely average of course, not good or bad). So yeah, it's be interesting to get your thoughts on what we had to say and our ratings. Because on know for Halo: CE we gave at least 3 beloe average ratings, same with 2 and 3. I can also see that some of the maps you rated 8 or higher, some of us just dispised, and some you rated lower around 5 or 6, that we thought were 8 or 9. So yeah, makes for some good discussion. Difference in opinions can be good in that regard. I know we on the podcast(there's 4 of us) definitely didn't agree all the time with our ratings and reasonings, so it's fun to see other's opinions as well.

Halo 3 map Retrospective is uploading now, prob won't be finished until tomorrow morning, but be on the look out for it.

When appropriate, I tried my best to take all the gametypes into account... that's why you don't see too many low ratings from me. A lot of the CE-3 maps that I rated 5s and 6s aren't good for more than a couple of gametypes and even then aren't as fun (imo), hence the lower scores.

Examples:

Relic, High Ground - 1 Flag/Bomb
Terminal - Big Team Heavies
Standoff - CTF Classic

Not much else is playable on those maps, for various reasons. For instance, on Standoff, there aren't any snipers on the map, which is criminal for a map of that size, especially one with turrets and vehicles. Bungie goofed big time when designing that map. Nothing really stands out as a signature gametype on Terminal, and on Relic the base is nigh-impenetrable for all but the best teams. High Ground scored so low because Bungie never really got the spawns right on it.

The Reach maps are almost universally worthless (better illustrated if the remakes are included... man are Pinnacle and Reflection bad), hence the terrible scores. Anything that scored 5 or better did so because it's worth playing in Multi Team and its random array of gametypes.

Yeah I understand your reasonings. I guess I just see it a little different. I do agree that map versatility is very important, but if a map plays something really well, so much so that it rarely gets boring on the gametype(s) it was designed for, I think that makes for a great map overall. High Ground being one of those maps. I think for 1 Flag, 1 Bomb, 1 Sided Territories, and even Infection, it is right up there with the best of them that are designed for 1 sided games. Also, it plays extremely well with equipment, with all the equipment on the map serving a nice purpose and put in decent spots to be tactical. Lastly, it has a great interactive concept that plays into strategy, in the gate being openable and the hatch etc. That's my reasoning behind wy I would rate High Ground pretty high. It may only be well suited for 1 sided gametypes, but it plays them so well that it makes it so great.

I guess that's just how I look at things though. I don't mind if a map isn't made for multiple gametypes in mind, as long as what it's meant to play, is so well catered to it that it makes for some awesome games. Obviously maps that can do just about everything are great, but those don't come around very often. Most of the time, the ones that are crafted for multiple different gametypes, are the ones that play all of them "ok" or "decent" but none of those gametypes are "amazing". So I guess i'd rather a map play a couple of gametypes amazing, rather than a bunch just ok, is the way i'm looking at it.

Standoff is one I really enjoyed too. You see the sniper not being on there as a bad thing, but to me that's a good thing. Not because I don't like the sniper, I love it, but most BTB maps have a sniper on it, so it makes this one a unique experience. I also enjoy it because I dig the layout in general, and it makes for some fun Neutral Bomb, as well as Multi Flag and Assault etc. I like the 2 bases facing each other, as it reminds me of a large scale Beaver Creek to a degree.

I see your points though. That's what I love, seeing/hearing what others feel about these maps, and why they do. Just shows what different things people look for in a map. One for me that you rated higher that I absolutely dispised, was Isolation. I just found so many things to dislike about it, and it rarely made for a fun game. I appreciate some of the things it does, but it seems to just have so many things I didn't think played well.

I'm the type of guy who prefers versatility over just about anything else, so that's why I tried to stay well-rounded with the rankings.

I'm probably the only person who likes Isolation. To me, it works for Slayer, King, Ball, Neutral Bomb, and Land Grab. That, and it's one of those maps that I always seem to do really well on. I rarely if ever had a bad game on that map.

Yeah, i'm just the opposite. Never really had a good experience on the map. Seemed to always be a bad game. Although Isolations is disliked by the majority it seems, but there's a few every so often that enjoy it. One of my friends on the podcast actually enjoys it, and explains why.

I manage to enjoy the map by pretty much never going underground. If you stay topside with a shotgun/battle rifle, you can't lose. It's also very, very easy to spawn trap on Isolation if you're smart about positioning. Speaking of, positioning is a really underrated aspect of Halo that I rarely see implemented by anyone other than MLG pros. If you know what points to control and how to maintain them, that's half the battle. Defense definitely wins in Halo.

Personally, I just don't think it plays any gametype that well. Some are ok, but none stand out as being "fun", imo of course. It had a couple of interesting parts, the bases being underground with windows is cool, but ultimately i'm just not a fan of how things play out. Seemed the high ground could dominate so easily, and I disliked how the bases had regens in them, as well as disliked the overall look of the map. Idk, it just never seemed enjoyable to me beyond being "ok" at times. My least favorite in Halo 3 for that reason. It's one of the few maps from CE-3 that I would rather not play on at all. It's not that it has nothing to offer, but I don't think the unique layout and interesting parts make up for just how broken the experience felt for each gametype. As I said, I enjoy maps that play something good-amazing, even if it's just a couple gametypes. To me, this just played multiple gametypes "ok", nothing which stood out amongst the rest of the maps. I can't think of 1 gametype that I would choose to play on this map over many other maps that are better suited for them.

Yeah, I never got into spawn traps, or anything that technical about the gameplay. I love being competitive and learning strategies on the map, but I kind of take everything at face value and use the tools given to try and win. Never really analyzing things or studying spawns etc. in order to effect how I play. That's the level I guess I never really cared to get to, just because to me it takes away from the fun I have when I get that serious and technical. Same with rate of fire on each weapon, kill times, and all that stuff MLG level players get into. To me it's not a study or sport, it's still a game, and I ultimately I just want to enjoy it for what it is. It's like with anything in life, some people enjoy diving deep and knowing everything there is to know and picking things apart to study what the best way is to go about things to win etc. Whereas for others, that kind of takes away the magic spontaneous feeling of fun just figuring out your own strategies and techniques based off basic knowledge from experience on the map. Same reason I never got into flag juggling, when i'd rather just walk it stealthfully or make a vehicle run etc. Just more fun for me personally.

I'm definitely with you on flag juggling and in some ways I'm glad that they're forcing flag carriers to hold onto the flag this time around. Sure, it does eliminate some great teamwork opportunities, but it's an interesting new spin on the gametype.

During the H2 days, my friends and I thought that we were good enough to try an MLG event if only we had the means to make it happen, so that's where my love of strategy and tactics comes in. Now I'm not as serious about or good at Halo, but it still comes into play. There are steps you can take to play smarter and win more games, which this time around will help you progress quicker.

Yeah, the only thing I'll miss at all when it comes to the CTF changes is the ability to pass it to a teammate. I didn't care for juggling because it effectively let the flag carrier run at full speed not giving the other team any sort of chance to catch up, or throwing it down to defend yourself etc. I always felt it was intended to be walked stealthfully, choosing the right paths and overtaking the other team long enough to hopefully make it back to the base. Or, using a vehicle to quickly grab and go. I didn't mind passing to teammates through windows or to a higher level, as that was still part of what I felt was intended. Now they eliminated that, but ultimately, I think it's all for the better if it means no more juggling or flag guy throwing down the flag to kill someone with his rockets, effectively not needing any teammates. Teamwork should be key, and I think the new CTF looks to improve upon encouraging that.

Yea, I think that what you said is exactly what they intended. Plus, this time the flag carrier will now have a magnum (or possibly whatever their sidearm is, not sure if you can take a PP or boltshot with the flag) so that they can try to defend themselves. Of course, I heard that this version of the magnum is the worst that it's ever been, so perhaps self-defense is out of the question here. It's still much better than what CoD does, where you're still fully able to do whatever you would do normally while you have the flag.

CTF Classic has always been my favorite variant of flag games, and since Reach didn't really have a good symmetric map big enough for flag (Hemorrhage was TOO big), I'm interested to see how they work in terms of making 2-flag ready maps. I really hope that the Valhalla remake isn't the only one of its kind, because the poor sightlines on that map really hampered its overall quality. With Dominion being a new gametype as well, I'm sure they've had to think long and hard about how to make maps play well for multiple variants.

I believe they said the Flagnum, has a 20% damage increase compared to the standard magnum you can normally use without the flag. So it should at least be usable.

Halo 3 map retrospective is now up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnyw8a-DECM&feature;=plcp

Cool, will check that out tomorrow. Definitely bed time now.

And it's nice to know that the flagnum will get a buff. It'll at least give carriers a chance to notch a kill or two without having to go for broke with a flag beatdown.

Here's the Halo Reach Map Retrospective:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4ggEKE1zP8&feature;=plcp

Good stuff dude, and let's just hope that the maps will never, ever, be that poor again.

Finishing up the lead up to Halo 4, here's our impressions on the Halo 4 maps.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Uz5r2ZXS0o&feature;=g-upl