I think its fucking stupid tbh.
It hasent solved anything.

It's stupid and should be abolished.

azazis Wrote: I think its fucking stupid tbh. It hasent solved anything.

I feel the same way... it hasn't done much!

TheTinMan2005 Wrote: The white topic made me think to post this. What is your position on Affirmative Action? For or against? Personally I am AGAINST it in it's current form. Although I believe there are still socioeconomic circumstances that stack the odds against a lot of minorities,these conditions can apply across the board. Today, I think this society is divided more on socioeconomic status, the haves and have nots, then it is on racial lines. Which is why I think Affirmative Action should be based on socioeconomic status, rather than ethnicity.

I agrre that it is flawed in it's present state and the socioeconomic status shuold be taken into consideration. However, those at live in low-middle class to poor class standings are African Americans for the most part.

I feel that there still exists an undercurrent of discrimination that still needs to be addressed. Also, the quality of jobs(Decent pay with benefits) and accountability for our failing schools should be addressed.


GD

isis13 Wrote: I feel the same way... it hasn't done much!

Please explain.


GD

Yes, please give some reasoning behind your opinions, or do not post. I don't want replies like 'its fucking stupid'.

ghostdragon, I agree. There probably is need for a certain amount of racial considerations, but don't be fooled. The real things holding people back is economics, there are millions of white kids who have trouble getting into college too.

Like in Dallas, there is this neighborhood called the Grove, which is a mostly white but very impoverished neighborhood.

I think the Conservatives who are making Affirmative Action a big issue saying it is discrimanatory against white people are distracting(probably on purpose) from the real issues. And I think the more relevent issues today are economics.

Society is more divided by the Haves and Have nots then White and Black, in my opinion. At least nowadays.

Well good thing the Board members opinions on this and many other subjects are obsolite.

DanteThePoetic Wrote: Well good thing the Board members opinions on this and many other subjects are obsolite.

Pertaining to this subject, how so?


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TheTinMan2005 Wrote: Today, I think this society is divided more on socioeconomic status, the haves and have nots, then it is on racial lines.

How many minorities do you know that own Football, basketball, or baseball teams?

Why are minorieties more poor than whites?

Why do white males get paid more than minorities and women for that matter?

Have you ever seen a black president?

But yeah come on, it is a bit ridiculous to say there aren't under-advantaged whites. There ae millions.

I myself will be the first one in my family to even graduate from High School.

I think telling someone who is in a bad position they don't count as being in that position because of their skin color is a slap in the face.

I agree with you that affirmative action is about as effective as prohibition, however its still very evident today that racism is around whether people like it or not and the White males still make the rules because they have the money. And because of that affirmative action is going no where fast.

Yes there is reverse discrimination, but thats the flaw in Equality.

LoganMK Wrote: I agree with you that affirmative action is about as effective as prohibition, however its still very evident today that racism is around whether people like it or not and the White males still make the rules because they have the money. And because of that affirmative action is going no where fast. Yes there is reverse discrimination, but thats the flaw in Equality.

Yes, white males do make the rules, but the ones I am talking of, who need affirmative action, are not the ones who do. I think these white males in charge gain a victory over ALL people in the 'underclass' by dividing them against eachother based on race. That is all.

okay, I don't agree, but thats alright.

LoganMK Wrote: okay, I don't agree, but thats alright.

I don't understand how. Do you REALLY think every white person is priveledged? Because that is just fucking ignorant if you do.

Like in Dallas for example, there is a neighborhood there known as the grove, which is very impoverished but its mostly white.

I myself come from an un-privledged background. Your stance on this is irrational. And I find it personally insulting.

They need to stop being so blind. Yeah people need to be helped definitly, but they shouldn't jeopardize other people to do so. They jus go about it so blindly cuz they don;t really give a fuck , they just tryna shut people up. Fuck em, cuz they gon end up startin some shit watch

My feelings on the subject were summed up by Chris Rock in his last stand up. I don't think a black man should get a job over a more qualified white guy, but if they're equally qualified, give it to the black guy.

I'm not saying white people got it all great, being a white guy myself I know that's not true. But it was less than a century ago that we were still lynching blacks, not letting them vote, and keeping them out of white areas. Whites have had a decent head start, let's try to level the playing field a bit.

I can agree with that Scarecrow.

But, I think at least when it comes to COLLEGE, affirmative action should be socioeconomic based. There are millions of white people not in a good position as far as college.

Think about it, right now the way things are..

I will be the first one in my family to get a High school diploma, now, if i apply to a college, and someone who's father and grandfather and so on went there applies, who do you think will have a bigger chance of getting in?

There are European-Americans who are in a disadvantaged position as far as the education system goes, who need this extra help as well, but they are denied of it because of their background.

Am I the only person who sees that as fucked up?

i hate affirmative action. Its trying to make things more fair for minorities but actually if they really need it then they are lower. I think affirmative action makes minorities look weaker rather than equal. We need a truly equal opportunity for everyone regardless of race, gender, religion, sexual orientation or anything because its illegal not to hire based on these it should be illegal to hire based on these attributes.

TheTinMan2005 Wrote: Yes, please give some reasoning behind your opinions, or do not post. I don't want replies like 'its fucking stupid'. ghostdragon, I agree. There probably is need for a certain amount of racial considerations, but don't be fooled. The real things holding people back is economics, there are millions of white kids who have trouble getting into college too. Like in Dallas, there is this neighborhood called the Grove, which is a mostly white but very impoverished neighborhood. I think the Conservatives who are making Affirmative Action a big issue saying it is discrimanatory against white people are distracting(probably on purpose) from the real issues. And I think the more relevent issues today are economics. Society is more divided by the Haves and Have nots then White and Black, in my opinion. At least nowadays.

Society is more divided by the Haves and Have nots then White and Black, in my opinion. At least nowadays.

That it very very true. Im always having to explain this to people. The people who make it about race aren't really in the struggle,they are trying to make themselves look like they are there because they are ashamed.For example, many african-americans I met when I moved to the suburbs

Here's a little secret not many people tell you about college, government grants. Ask your guidance counselor or whatever and they'll likely hand you a binder about six inches thick full of all these grants you can get from the government based on economic status (and other things). My girlfriend supports herself on shitty wages working in retail, so she knew she wouldn't be able to pay for college. But, through government grants, she got the entire thing paid for and the only money she had to spend was on books. And the beautiful thing about government grants as opposed to student loans is you don't have to pay them back. It's free money set aside for people going to college, starting their own businesses, etc. Ever see that guy late at night on television that wears the suit covered in question marks and is screaming about the government paying for you to start your own business? All about government grants, and they're open to anyone; and the lower down the economic level you are, the more you qualify for. Check into it.

TheTinMan2005 Wrote: I can agree with that Scarecrow. But, I think at least when it comes to COLLEGE, affirmative action should be socioeconomic based. There are millions of white people not in a good position as far as college. Think about it, right now the way things are.. I will be the first one in my family to get a High school diploma, now, if i apply to a college, and someone who's father and grandfather and so on went there applies, who do you think will have a bigger chance of getting in? There are European-Americans who are in a disadvantaged position as far as the education system goes, who need this extra help as well, but they are denied of it because of their background. Am I the only person who sees that as fucked up?

TheTinMan2005 Wrote: I don't understand how. Do you REALLY think every white person is priveledged? Because that is just fucking ignorant if you do.

Now you getting smart-ass with me.

Whats ignorant is believing there is some kind of program that has not been invented yet that will solve all financial problems for all races. Whats ignorant is believing that equality is a reality on earth. Whats ignorant is becoming embittered about the flaws in society.

Look don't bitch to me about Dallas, I live in Fort Worth. I grew up in East Fort Worth, better known as the ghetto. So the "my environment is crappier" bit doesn't really matter to me.

The fact of it all is that you will never find equality in america. You can bitch and moan and piss and kick and scream, but it just won't happen. And you wanna know why? Because money rules the country, whoever has the money rules the country. Right now its white males and no matter how much you talk about underpriviledge whites, there will always be MORE minorieties that are underpriviledged than whites as long as white males have the money.

I'm not saying it works, I'm not even saying its fair. What I'm saying is minorieties will always have the shorter end on the stick unless money transfers to another race. Thats how the world works, learn to live with it.

Because most people dont have adequate or accurate facts pertaining to this and most other subjects, people tend to view subjects like this in an "I got mine" light. Most.

DanteThePoetic Wrote: Because most people dont have adequate or accurate facts pertaining to this and most other subjects, people tend to view subjects like this in an "I got mine" light. Most.

Great point

Affirmative action? I say, 2 wrongs don't make a right.

Yeah, the government sanctioned wrong-doings committed over 100 years ago (slavery, loss of voting privileges, etc.) aren't the same as the government sanction wrong-doings committed today (hiring someone just because they're not a white male).

The effects of affirmative action are many. Let's say you call tech support, go shopping at the mall, whatever. You get someone who's really not qualified for that particular job but they got it anyway due to affirmative action. It's an insult to the public, because the public is probably who will suffer the most (not to mention the company who was basically forced to hire that individual).

Even more alarming is that it can cause or encourage more racism against minorities - exactly what it was supposed to fight against! Overall, pretty useless system that should be abolished. We should not look at race when making hiring decisions, and it flies in the face of equality to do so.