Well, evil for the sake of evil, rather.

pfft. practically the Shemp of the group.

Shit I dont remeber scorpion begging, gonna have to youtube that shiyat (also i dont know how to do that whole say what the person said im new to the boards ... do you just copy and paste what they said?)

I don't know how well you remember that boss fight, but at the "Finish Him" point, Scorpion drops to his knees and says something like "Please, spare me!"

Shit watching some youtube stuff now, he does say spare me but he takes a while to do it i must have killed him befor he had the chance to say it... Subzeros not the dick WE ARE!

You can actually spare him to (obviously non-cannon but still cool)

(sorry if i didnt do the paste what people said thing correct, like i said im new )

Younger sub zero is the one with the scar and we're not exactly sure who did it. In mksm it was kung lao but nobody really knows

You hit "reply" then you hit the "add original" button. Also, there's an edit button, so you don't have to double post.

On topic: I never saw Elder SubZ as all that much more evil the younger SubZ. They both killed people for a living. The only difference is that Younger SubZ apparently didn't kill non-targets (the person Scorpion saw him spare in 2), and when he got a chance to turn his life around in 3 he took it.

I'm absolutely loving this thread. I do have a weird feeling though. What if in some weird way Elder Subby did retire and turn his life around? Maybe during that attempt some weird shit happens and parts the "taint" from his soul but the taint ends up being alive (or at one point attaches itself 2 1 of shang tsungs many stolen souls) and goes to the netherrealm and turns into noob regardless. Then one of the Sub-Zeros(preferably the young one) get automated by the Lin Kuei and converted into Hydro. Then you have Sub-Zero, Hydro, and Noob.

That's the point. Elder didn't change his ways and as a result, when killed, was sent to the Netherealm and his soul was fully corrupted.

Younger Z changed his ways, leaving and then later leading/reforming the Lin Kuei into a clan of higher honor and respect.

In my mind the Elder Sub-Zero was a killer. That by definition in many religions and cultures equals evil.

True almost all of the characters in Mortal Kombat are killers in one form or another and are tainted somewhat. This includes Liu Kang, Kung Lao, Raiden, etc. But the reason behind the killing determines how much of a taint it causes. Killing just for the sake of killing, refusing to give mercy when asked, killing for money, etc taints your soul more than say killing to save a life, killing in the defense of your country/world, etc.

The 'Elder' Sub-Zero killed for money/payment (in a sense) for his clan and refused to give mercy. He is more tainted than the 'Younger' Sub-Zero who from what we can tell has only killed when fighting to either save lives and the Earth (I could be wrong, my Sub-Zero lore is no-where complete as my Raiden lore).

You can argue that was how the Elder Sub-Zero was raised, but the Younger Sub-Zero was raised the same way. Each was given the same choice to continue their current path or change. Elder Sub-Zero stayed on his darker path where Younger Sub-Zero worked to change to the brighter one. This to me means that the Elder has earned the right to be called the 'Evil' Sub-Zero the same way the Younger one has earned to be called the 'Good' Sub-Zero. Oh 'Good' Subby is no saint, but he is a great deal less Evil or Tainted than his older brother.

My guess is the Younger had a stronger will or greater sense of self than the Elder. I don't see Elder Sub-Zero, who was completely loyal to his clan, to refuse to be converted to a cyborg like the younger, more 'rebellious' one did. Or have the foresight? Courage? To try to change the Lin Kuei from a group of heartless killers to a force of good. Although how a group of assassins can be considered a force for 'Good' I really don't know. They are still killing, but maybe only killing to ensure the greater good? (shrugs)

Now for me to slightly move away from the topic to a related one. Why is it that some people want to have two...count them two Sub-Zeroes in the game? Aren't we suppose to get away from cookie cutter, rainbow ninjas? I know this is a 're-boot' of the series but multiple Sub-Zeroes in a game was bad enough in UMK3 and Trilogy.

My opinion is that the only good way that the Elder Sub-Zero stays in the game without becoming Noob is if one of the Sub-Zeroes becomes a Cyborg. And to be honest, I see the Elder one following orders and accepting it than the Younger one. Then if Elder Sub-Zero does not become Noob Saibot, then someone else might have too. History can not be easily changed. If there is a need for a Noob, there will be a Noob. Whether this is going to be Elder Sub-Zero, the moron Shujinko, (or I hope its this guy, he deserves to burn in the Neatherrealm), or someone else its all up to the Elder Gods. (Which I will rant on why the hell are they allowing Raiden to muck up time somewhat later.)

Here's a topic of discussion...
He kills Scorpion after Scorpion begs him for mercy. Yet he spares Sareena for some reason. Did it ever explain why?

Nope. The game just expects you to do it to get the better, more canon cutscene.

Maybe there should've been some dialogue there like "Wait, I can help you!" something like that would've been nice.

On the other hand, maybe he just let her go 'cause she's hot.

She was a 'hot' female in skimpy clothes. He was hoping to get...some private time with her later. Basically, he fell for her.

Basically what i was driving at in an above post. I just want 1 sub-zero, but idk what the mk team is gonna do. I figure if anything like this were to happen that we wouldn't really have a different character turn into noob but a soul calibur style thing where Siegfried(sp?) and nightmare split into two seperate people w/o messing up any other fighters. So perhaps with the help of a sorcerer or something elder subz taint(sounds wrong on so many levels) ends up floating around the netherrealm w/ a voice or some shit like damashi, and quan chi or shinnok or whomever can convert the taint into a living spectre

God, I hated that. SC3, and that part in particular, marks the exact moment where Soul Calibur decided to stop having a storyline and just keep status quo forever, and I consequently completely lost all interest in the franchise.

Same thing here. I didn't care for it after that. However random shit always seems to happen in mortal kombat so it would be right up their alley

Splitting Noob and Sub-Zero would be like splitting Anakin and Vader. I vote no on that.

Though splitting Nightmare and Siegfried in Soul Calibur itself didn't bother me. We knew early in the series that Soul Edge was its own consciousness anyway. Though there was no need to incarnate him as Nightmare (other than fan service); they should have just kept him as Inferno.

But Soul Calibur has always had trouble with progress. Character relations mean nothing in that game.

This is getting dangerously off-topic, but I consider Soul Calibur III to be pretty much the closure the series needed. Nightmare became its own entity, and its ultimate, ultrapowerful Nightterror form is encountered in that game. Siegfried defeats his curse and redeems his past. Everyone in the game pretty much finds some pretty significant closure, depending on the ending they received. By comparison, SCIV felt entirely aimless, with a story that had no transition from the previous game, lots of gaps in the plot, and a pitiful story mode that barely explained anything and had some rather terrible endings. As far as I'm concerned, SCIII ended the main saga's storyline, and did so very effectively.

I agree, too, that Noob existing as the fated outcome for Sub-Zero. In a way, it's tragic to know that he'll be killed, and even more tragic to know he'll reemerge as a far more powerful, evil, and ruthless individual. Whether his brother can ever "redeem" him like Luke did for Darth Vader remains to be seen, but I'll also say that the Noob vs. Sub-Zero dynamic, brother against brother, good against evil, is absolutely compelling and I seriously hope it remains a main theme of their character development.

In Scorpion's MK1 ending it said he left behind a wife and son when he died [meaning his wife and son were still alive] His wife and son and the clan being killed off wasn't until MKM:SZ and MK4. I do agree that the MK team seemed to have lost track of their characters and their own in-game continuity.

Actually when Sub-Zero 2 took over the clan they changed from being a clan of assassins to a group that Sub-Zero was training to defend Earth from people like Shao Khan. Plus the members voluntarily joined unlike previous members like the S-Zs, Smoke, Cyrax and Sektor that were most likely taken from their families when they were infants.