Racial demographics (up for debate)
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Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 02:25 PM EST
I have compiled a list of the currently known characters from the fighting game series and divided them into different lists. Some of the characters are obviously up for debate.

If I forgot anyone please add them to the list!

WHITE (13)
Johnny Cage
Sonya Blade
Kano
Stryker
Kabal
Smoke
Jarek
Reiko
Kobra
Kira
Taven
Daegon
Sareena (Human form)

BLACK (6)
Jax
Jade (Edenian black)
Cyrax
Kai
Darrius
Tanya (Edenian black)

ASIAN (19)
Liu Kang
Scorpion (Japanese, pre-death)
Shang Tsung
Kung Lao
Kitana (Edenian Asian)
Mileena
Sektor
Sindel (Edenian Asian)
Rain (Edenian Asian)
Fujin
Quan-Chi (human form)
Kenshi
Li Mei (Outworld Asian)
Bo Rai Cho (Outworld Asian)
Hsu Hao
Drahmin (pre-death)
Dairou
Hotaru
Shujinko

NATIVE AMERICAN (1)
Nightwolf

MIXED (2)
Sub-Zero (Chinese-American)
Noob (Chinese-American, pre-death)

UNCONFIRMED (11)
Raiden
Shao Kahn
Ermac
Shinnok
Ashrah
Mavado (his name is a play on the Spanish word ‘Malvado’)
Frost
Meat
Havik
Skarlet

NON-HUMAN (9)
Reptile (Sauron)
Chameleon (Sauron)
Khameleon (Sauron)
Baraka (Tarkatan)
Sheeva (Shokan)
Motaro (Centaur)
Nitara (Vampire)
Moloch (Oni)
Goro (Shokan)
Kintaro (Shokan)
Onaga (Dragon)
Blaze (Elemental)
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 03:37 PM EST
No.

Many of these characters come from a realm other than what you consider white or black.

Yes. This list displays what WOULD be their ethnicity if they WERE all from Earth.

As debated before, their skin color does not make the African or Asian American. Their realm determines their ethnicity. You can't call Jade or Tanya African American when they aren't from Africa. they're Edenian.

I dare anybody to argue against that.

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 04:06 PM EST
MK_Fanatic_ Wrote:
a lot



Race only applies on Earth.

If the person is not from Earthrealm, race does not apply.

Also, You have a flawed 'non-human' list, as the majority of characters in Mortal Kombat are not human. Only those from Earthrealm can be considered human.

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 06:46 PM EST
Why is race only an issue on Earthrealm?

There is clearly a difference between races in Edenia ex. Kitana, Jade, Li Mei, Tanya and Orderrealm ex. Dairou, Darrius, Hotaru
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 07:03 PM EST
Basically put it this way-

Only people from Earthrealm are Humans. Only people from Earthrealm have real demographic reasoning as ethnicity because every other race is a different species.

And don't try to deny me that. If you think somebody like Sindel, at least 40,000 years old is human, boy do you need a wake-up call...
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 07:37 PM EST
legoslayer10 Wrote:
No.

Many of these characters come from a realm other than what you consider white or black.

Yes. This list displays what WOULD be their ethnicity if they WERE all from Earth.

As debated before, their skin color does not make the African or Asian American. Their realm determines their ethnicity. You can't call Jade or Tanya African American when they aren't from Africa. they're Edenian.

I dare anybody to argue against that.



See,there is your problem,you can't distinguish ethnicity,race or jusst the color of the skin.

African-Americans are not the only black people in the world and OP didn't include Jax,Jade,Tanya,etc. in the group categorized as African Americans. They are just black,regardless of world.

So Jade is Edenian human,while Jax is Earthrealm human. Both are considered black,because of their skin tones.

I think the only term the OP used not correct is Asian,as you don't have Asia in Edenia for example,but I really don't know any term on how to describe people who look like Asians on Earth,because anything else applied sounds offensive like "people with yellowish skin,small eyes and dark hair",so you might argue that.
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 09:37 PM EST
Noobsmoke92 Wrote:
legoslayer10 Wrote:
No.

Many of these characters come from a realm other than what you consider white or black.

Yes. This list displays what WOULD be their ethnicity if they WERE all from Earth.

As debated before, their skin color does not make the African or Asian American. Their realm determines their ethnicity. You can't call Jade or Tanya African American when they aren't from Africa. they're Edenian.

I dare anybody to argue against that.



See,there is your problem,you can't distinguish ethnicity,race or jusst the color of the skin.

African-Americans are not the only black people in the world and OP didn't include Jax,Jade,Tanya,etc. in the group categorized as African Americans. They are just black,regardless of world.

So Jade is Edenian human,while Jax is Earthrealm human. Both are considered black,because of their skin tones.

I think the only term the OP used not correct is Asian,as you don't have Asia in Edenia for example,but I really don't know any term on how to describe people who look like Asians on Earth,because anything else applied sounds offensive like "people with yellowish skin,small eyes and dark hair",so you might argue that.
Actually, you pretty much just explained everything I was trying to say. You can determine skin color. Not ethnicity.

Now, on the otherhand, if regions in other realms were already desgnated as having natives of a certain skin tone, then yes, we could label them.

Just for example, let's make our own region of Edenia. Let's call it "Mascaria" just because of it's suffix making it easier. Say that people from Mascaria are usually black-skinned. We can call the "Mascarian Edenians".

Does anybody even understand what I'm trying to say.
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/04/2013 11:12 PM EST
Noobsmoke92 Wrote:


So Jade is Edenian human,while Jax is Earthrealm human. Both are considered black,because of their skin tones.



We cannot call Jade human, because humans are from Earthrealm.

Jade is Edenian, and until we receive confirmation of any other identity, that's all she is.

MK_Fanatic_ Wrote:
Why is race only an issue on Earthrealm?



Race is an exclusively human factor; it has no place in any other world in the universe, real or fiction.

Therefore, since humans are from Earthrealm, anyone outside of Earthrealm cannot be identified by race. With that, one cannot say that Tanya is a black Edenian, but simply an Edenian with dark skin.

In a more in-game perspective, there has yet to be any confirmation of any character outside of Earthrealm having any form of identity other than their species or homeworld. Therefore, we technically cannot identify them in any other way, as it will be inaccurate.



I honestly do not understand why people are trying so hard to implement race to human-like characters in this game. It doesn't have to go that deep; we know where they are from, shouldn't that suffice?

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/05/2013 01:24 AM EST
You can clearly SEE it with your fucking EYES in many works of fiction where aliens come in different skin colors and ethnicities just like humans do. Just because you don't know what they call their ethnicities doesn't mean they don't exist.

Hell, we actually DO know what the Shokan call their two different ethnicities, and that their society even has racism/segregation that's a defining part of Kintaro's backstory! So that throws your "only humans have races" bullshit in the trash right there.

And that's just Mortal Kombat alone. Do you have any idea how many Sci-Fi and Fantasy books and movies and TV shows in the world have aliens with their own races and racism? DO you?! Because it's an awful LOT. Ever heard of "Dark Elves"? How about DC Comics' "Green Martians and White Martians"? Star Trek has always loved having Kirk or Picard meet aliens being racist to themselves and tell them to cut it out and act civilized. Just tip of the iceberg here, throwing things out I think you may have heard of. Perhaps there's an easier way to list them...

And besides the fact that fiction with aliens who have ethnicities already exists...there's also real world science. By which I mean do you even know why Earth has different races? The environmental factors that cause people to have different pigments, different shaped eyes, etc? Y'know, like how people that lived closer to the equator thousands of years ago had darker skin because of all the sun while people who moved further north got lighter? If we assume intelligent alien life does exist, why wouldn't that happen to other species on other planets the same as it has happened to us on Earth? And we're not even the only species on Earth that comes in multiple colors and shapes, most species of animal come in multiple breeds due to adapting to the environment, that's essentially the same thing. Humans are just animals with better brains after all.

For someone who's so sure of your argument that you post it every single fucking time someone makes a thread about it, to the point where you dominate those threads and turn them into arguments, maybe you should do a little more actual research instead of getting by on stubbornness alone. Ignorance doesn't tend to win arguments too often.
So now that I've established just how false the phrase "Race is an exclusively human factor; it has no place in any other world in the universe, real or fiction" is, let's talk about why threads like these are important to some people and keep being made, shall we?
Appearance is a vitally important defining part of a character's identity. To everyone but the blind, what you look like is part of telling who you are. (And even then, some blind people like to feel faces to learn what they look like.) In order to ensure that the character looks the same from one game to the next, that adaptations get them right, etc., we need to have a stronger idea of what a character's physical features are supposed to be.
That said...ethnicity is not ALWAYS the best way to describe a character's appearance.
It works really well with skin color, because that's an area where the answer is always obvious. A color is a color, you can just eyeball it. (We will for the moment ignore the fact that calling brown people "black" and peach people "white" is stupid, because we don't get to make the rules of the English language...)
Others...not so much. Many ethnicities are identified only by the shapes of their facial features. This does not work for people not from Earth.
Sure, it's easy to go "Bo' Rai Cho and Li Mei look like Asians". You can acknowledge that Outworld has no such place as Asia yet still recognize that the creators' intent is obvious in their designs and the spelling of their names as being inspired by Chinese kung fu movies.
But for example...Kitana's movie actor Talisa Soto is Latina and Kitana's face in MK4 and Deadly Alliance/Armageddon is modeled to look like her. But does that make Kitana "Latina"? Of course not. "Latina", unlike "Black", is a term that refers to a LOCATION of origin on the planet Earth. And how do you define what a latin/hispanic person looks like, anyway? The common traits are way more vague for some ethnicities than others.
Hell, the TC called her and Sindel "Asian". Where the hell is that coming from?
And then there's the fact that she looks completely different in all the other games because of, y'know, different bluescreen actors in the 2D era and constant remodelling in the 3D era. Which is part of the problem with MK that causes this conversation to keep occurring. People wouldn't want to talk about what "ethnicity" the characters look like so much if they could keep the characters' appearances straight from one fucking game to the next, so the fans wouldn't have to try so hard to define their physical features in categorical terms. Nobody would ask if Jade's supposed to be black or not if they hadn't cast an Asian chick in Annihilation and could keep her the same fucking color from game to game (they WERE consistent with her until MK9 though, to be honest).
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/05/2013 01:30 AM EST
Just so nobody gets butthurt or OVERLY politically correct, here is the list with only Earthrealm humans

WHITE (9)
Johnny Cage
Sonya Blade
Kano
Stryker
Kabal
Smoke
Jarek
Kobra
Kira

BLACK (3)
Jax
Cyrax
Kai

ORIENTAL (Japanese, Chinese etc) (10)
Liu Kang
Scorpion (Japanese, pre-death)
Shang Tsung
Kung Lao
Sektor
Fujin (technically "FROM" Earthrealm)
Kenshi
Hsu Hao
Shujinko

NATIVE AMERICAN (1)
Nightwolf

MIXED (2)
Sub-Zero (Chinese-American)
Noob (Chinese-American, pre-death)

UNCONFIRMED (11)
Raiden (again, technically "from" Earthrealm)
Ermac (possibly made up of some Earthrealm souls)
Mavado (his name is a play on the Spanish word ‘Malvado’)
Frost
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/05/2013 07:46 AM EST
RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
You can clearly SEE it with your fucking EYES in many works of fiction where aliens come in different skin colors and ethnicities just like humans do. Just because you don't know what they call their ethnicities doesn't mean they don't exist.


Hell, we actually DO know what the Shokan call their two different ethnicities, and that their society even has racism/segregation that's a defining part of Kintaro's backstory! So that throws your "only humans have races" bullshit in the trash right there.


And that's just Mortal Kombat alone. Do you have any idea how many Sci-Fi and Fantasy books and movies and TV shows in the world have aliens with their own races and racism? DO you?! Because it's an awful LOT. Ever heard of "Dark Elves"? How about DC Comics' "Green Martians and White Martians"? Star Trek has always loved having Kirk or Picard meet aliens being racist to themselves and tell them to cut it out and act civilized.
Just tip of the iceberg here, throwing things out I think you may have heard of. Perhaps there's an easier way to list them...


And besides the fact that fiction with aliens who have ethnicities already exists...there's also real world science. By which I mean do you even know why Earth has different races? The environmental factors that cause people to have different pigments, different shaped eyes, etc? Y'know, like how people that lived closer to the equator thousands of years ago had darker skin because of all the sun while people who moved further north got lighter? If we assume intelligent alien life does exist, why wouldn't that happen to other species on other planets the same as it has happened to us on Earth? And we're not even the only species on Earth that comes in multiple colors and shapes, most species of animal come in multiple breeds due to adapting to the environment, that's essentially the same thing. Humans are just animals with better brains after all.


For someone who's so sure of your argument that you post it every single fucking time someone makes a thread about it, to the point where you dominate those threads and turn them into arguments, maybe you should do a little more actual research instead of getting by on stubbornness alone. Ignorance doesn't tend to win arguments too often.

So now that I've established just how false the phrase "Race is an exclusively human factor; it has no place in any other world in the universe, real or fiction" is, let's talk about why threads like these are important to some people and keep being made, shall we?

Appearance is a vitally important defining part of a character's identity. To everyone but the blind, what you look like is part of telling who you are. (And even then, some blind people like to feel faces to learn what they look like.) In order to ensure that the character looks the same from one game to the next, that adaptations get them right, etc., we need to have a stronger idea of what a character's physical features are supposed to be.

That said...ethnicity is not ALWAYS the best way to describe a character's appearance.

It works really well with skin color, because that's an area where the answer is always obvious. A color is a color, you can just eyeball it. (We will for the moment ignore the fact that calling brown people "black" and peach people "white" is stupid, because we don't get to make the rules of the English language...)

Others...not so much. Many ethnicities are identified only by the shapes of their facial features. This does not work for people not from Earth.

Sure, it's easy to go "Bo' Rai Cho and Li Mei look like Asians". You can acknowledge that Outworld has no such place as Asia yet still recognize that the creators' intent is obvious in their designs and the spelling of their names as being inspired by Chinese kung fu movies.

But for example...Kitana's movie actor Talisa Soto is Latina and Kitana's face in MK4 and Deadly Alliance/Armageddon is modeled to look like her. But does that make Kitana "Latina"? Of course not. "Latina", unlike "Black", is a term that refers to a LOCATION of origin on the planet Earth. And how do you define what a latin/hispanic person looks like, anyway? The common traits are way more vague for some ethnicities than others.

Hell, the TC called her and Sindel "Asian". Where the hell is that coming from?

And then there's the fact that she looks completely different in all the other games because of, y'know, different bluescreen actors in the 2D era and constant remodelling in the 3D era. Which is part of the problem with MK that causes this conversation to keep occurring. People wouldn't want to talk about what "ethnicity" the characters look like so much if they could keep the characters' appearances straight from one fucking game to the next, so the fans wouldn't have to try so hard to define their physical features in categorical terms. Nobody would ask if Jade's supposed to be black or not if they hadn't cast an Asian chick in Annihilation and could keep her the same fucking color from game to game (they WERE consistent with her until MK9 though, to be honest).


Stop trying to apply human concepts to non-human entities.

The only reason these fictional creatures are this way is because they were created by humans, and at extension, because they look like humans.

Race is man-made concept, and does not even apply everywhere on Earth. You can't just call Tanya or Jade black because they have dark skin, and you can't call Li Mei Asian because she has almond-shaped eyes.

Hell, even in real life, you can't always identify someone by race simply by how they look.

The application of racial identity to non-human fictional characters only shows just how stereotypical and racist humans can be. You only call Jade black because dark-skinned humans are called black. The use of race has nothing to do with Edenian, or the game itself. It is strictly a human concern. Stop trying to apply race and just accept the identities they already have.

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/05/2013 08:31 AM EST
First of all, we have to distinguish which game/movie we are referring to...

For example Jade has gone from black, to pure Asian, to a hint of Indian/Arabic, to half-black, and back again.

It's not like the MK team has ever given us a very detailed and artistic render of most characters for us to be able to determine with certainty the "racial demographics" (based on Earth Realm's races).

Besides, what does it matter?

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/05/2013 10:11 AM EST
Riyakou Wrote:
Race is man-made concept, and does not even apply everywhere on Earth.


What were your biology grades like in school? I'm betting it wasn't your strong suit.
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/05/2013 12:45 PM EST
RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
Riyakou Wrote:
Race is man-made concept, and does not even apply everywhere on Earth.


What were your biology grades like in school? I'm betting it wasn't your strong suit.


You obviously know nothing about biology.

The scientific label of the human being is homo sapien, sapien identifying our species. All humans are sapiens; there is no biological identification more specific than that. Africans are not a different species from Asians, as Europeans are not a different species from Africans.

Our difference in appearance is purely geographical. Our location ultimately determines our appearance.

Human is human. There are no various breeds of human, because sapien is a species, not a genus. There is only one kind of a species. There is only one kind of human.

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/05/2013 01:38 PM EST
Why do you always go down that tangent whenever we talk about this? It has nothing to do with the conversation. The fact that "Race" has two different meanings, "species" and "ethnicity", is not relevant to a discussion about whether or not aliens would have ethnicities.

If we ever meet alien life, they're not going to come from an "all desert" or "all ice" planet like in Star Wars and all look the same as a result, they're gonna come from a world that has as much biodiversity as Earth does. Any world that can sustain life is likely to have something similar to cold poles, a warm equator, deserts and jungles and tundra and oceans and so on all on the same world, which would produce multiple breeds of the same species because that's how ethnicity works, it's not an artificial construct of society or psychology, it's a genetic adaptation to environmental factors.

So aliens would be WAY more likely to come in multiple ethnicities than they would to all look homogenous.
And again, I have to point out that, as it pertains to Mortal Kombat, it's already canon that the Shokan have an ethnic minority. So "Only humans have races" sounded stupid the moment you said it.
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/06/2013 12:40 AM EST
RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
The fact that "Race" has two different meanings, "species" and "ethnicity", is not relevant to a discussion about whether or not aliens would have ethnicities.



Race does not have two meanings; it has one.

Furthermore, race and ethnicity are two completely different concepts. Race deals with appearance and ethnicity deals with culture.

Also, I never said race had two meanings.

RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
"Only humans have races" sounded stupid the moment you said it.


You keep forgetting that humans created Mortal Kombat.

Humans are giving these characters human-like traits. It's called anthropomorphism.

You are so eager to hold on to something, you deliberately ignore the truth in front of you. Race is man-made. It holds no actual weight in nature. Much like the lion, whose appearance differs from Africa to Asia, a human's appearance differs by location. That difference cannot and does not separate the species.

If you refuse to believe me, then believe this:


Kingdom: Animalia

Phylum: Chordata

Class: Mammalia

Order: Primates

Family: Hominidae

Tribe: Hominini

Genus: Homo

Species: sapien



That is the scientific classification of the human species, and as you can see, sapien is at the end of the set. There is only one kind of human.

Let me repeat, there is only one kind of human.

There is no black human, white human, asian human, Indian human, Russian human, Alaskan human. There is only one human.

Again, there is only one human.


Nothing you say can change this. This is nature itself. Race is man-made. We are all the same being. We are humans.

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/06/2013 10:41 AM EST
Dude, we all KNOW black people and white people are the same species. Species has NOTHING to do with a discussion about ethnicity!
Y'know, you can't keep coming into threads about ethnicity and try and tell people there's actually no such thing as ethnicities. That's insane. You literally sound like you've lost your damn mind. I'd say you've "gone cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs", but I half expect your comeback to be "there's no such thing as cocoa, all puffs are the same"!
if you don't like this subject of discussion so much that you're going to post the same crap every time someone makes a thread about it and be so impossible to reason with about it, then why don't you just IGNORE these threads and not post in them at all instead of doing this garbage that ruins them for the rest of us who have RELEVANT things to say?
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/06/2013 01:36 PM EST
RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
Riyakou Wrote:
Race is man-made concept, and does not even apply everywhere on Earth.


What were your biology grades like in school? I'm betting it wasn't your strong suit.
Whoa, what the fuck?!?
It's not like that's flaming or anything man, and besides, he is right. There are some places on Earth that do not define demographics.

And the point here is this that we've all been arguying about when there is only one answer possible that we ALL have explained anyway.

Demographics exist. but we can't name them because we don't know what they would be called. Do not call Jade African-American when she is obviously no from Africa, and being from Africa doesn't necessarily make you black, nor does being black mean you are African-American.

Maybe a peaceful resolution is in order...

Basically put, Earthrealm demographics do not apply to other realms. That's the best way i can think to put it.
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/06/2013 01:50 PM EST
RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
Dude, we all KNOW black people and white people are the same species. Species has NOTHING to do with a discussion about ethnicity!

Y'know, you can't keep coming into threads about ethnicity and try and tell people there's actually no such thing as ethnicities. That's insane. You literally sound like you've lost your damn mind. I'd say you've "gone cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs", but I half expect your comeback to be "there's no such thing as cocoa, all puffs are the same"!

if you don't like this subject of discussion so much that you're going to post the same crap every time someone makes a thread about it and be so impossible to reason with about it, then why don't you just IGNORE these threads and not post in them at all instead of doing this garbage that ruins them for the rest of us who have RELEVANT things to say?


You are changing your words around, and mines as well, because of your unwillingness to admit the truth.

Stop changing words.

I never said anything about ethnicity, with the exception of stating race and ethnicity are two completely different concepts. Once again, race deals with appearance; ethnicity deals with culture.

We are not discussing culture; we are discussing appearance.

Stop trying to make ethnicity synonymous with race, because they are not the same. The only person being irrelevant is you.

On the subject of race, it is man-made. It does not exist in nature.


If you are going to reply to this, reply to exactly what is in this post. Do not change any words, and do not mention ethnicity, because we are not discussing culture.

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/06/2013 02:56 PM EST
I'm waiting for that moment where we a purple-skinned creature roaming around. I don't know why purple, but I'm waiting for that moment.
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/06/2013 07:40 PM EST
Let's make this easier...

Jade is "Edenian brown"

Li Mei has a Chinese-like name and looks Oriental so let's say she is "that Outworld native that looks like an Asian person from Earthrealm"

Hotaru has a Japanese name but is obviously that "Orderrealm native that looks similar to Japanese samurai"
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/06/2013 07:57 PM EST
As far as "changing words", all I've done was use the word "ethnicity" more instead of "race" because of your psychotic insistence that they're not the same thing. But if you'd rather I pretend we're having the argument YOU want to have, rather than the one the thread was ACTUALLY ABOUT before you got to it, then here's a newsflash, jackass: YOU don't get to make up the English language, you have to accept the same dictionary definitions the REST of us are familiar with.
Riyakou Wrote:
On the subject of race, it is man-made. It does not exist in nature.


That's insane. A complete rejection of reality. Do you even realize how you sound? Are you making shit you think sounds funny up just to troll, or do you actually believe this is something you can say to other people and have them not look at you funny?

Any fucking dictionary or encyclopedia in the world will tell you that ethnicity is among the many valid definitions/synonyms of the word race, and of course it exists in nature, nature is the REASON humans come in multiple "races". "Race", by which I mean eth-fucking-nicity, is based on PHYSICAL characteristics.

You might as well be trying to tell a dog owner that there's no such thing as a "breed" and there's no scientific difference between a German Shepard and a Poodle because they're both classified as the same species, Canis Lupus Familiaris.
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/07/2013 12:09 AM EST
RazorsEdge701 Wrote:

That's insane. A complete rejection of reality. Do you even realize how you sound? Are you making shit you think sounds funny up just to troll, or do you actually believe this is something you can say to other people and have them not look at you funny?



I am not trolling; I actually know what race is.

You are so used to the known definition of "race" that you refuse any information that states otherwise, much like the word "ignorant," which is very often used incorrectly.

I could tell you the black panther is not an actual animal, and you could look at me like I'm a fool. I could also tell you that "black panther" is just a name for any black-furred leopard, jaguar, or eyra.

This is synonymous to "black" being the name for any dark-skinned human.

RazorsEdge701 Wrote:


Any fucking dictionary or encyclopedia in the world will tell you that ethnicity is among the many valid definitions/synonyms of the word race, and of course it exists in nature, nature is the REASON humans come in multiple "races". "Race", by which I mean eth-fucking-nicity, is based on PHYSICAL characteristics.



Again, those physical characteristics are based on location, not millenia of mutation and development of multiple subspecies, like the dogs you mentioned, but we'll get to that.

Here are your definitions.


The two you refer to, being linked with ethnicity, are at the bottom; take notice to that. Also, take notice to the first three definitions, particularly the third. Refer back to the my statement made on the black panther, and connect it here.



I also gathered an excerpt on the word "race," detailing how it came to be used, and its link to racism.


This is your first set of proof that race is man-made.


RazorsEdge701 Wrote:

You might as well be trying to tell a dog owner that there's no such thing as a "breed" and there's no scientific difference between a German Shepard and a Poodle because they're both classified as the same species, Canis Lupus Familiaris.


Canis Lupus Familiaris is not a species, it is a collection of subspecies, derived from the grey wolf. Domestic dogs are genetic mutations of the Canis Lupus Lupus. Each breed possesses a different mutation, but yes, they all belong to the same collection of subspecies, because they are all members of the same ancestral species. Since they are, they are able to produce generations of offspring with each other; the core indication of whether two individuals are a part of the same species.

As for humans (you may need to click on it):


The synonymn you speak of is actually the replacement of the word "race," given that no actual subspecies of human exists. "Ethnicity" is used to refer to elements that are not natural to the human existance, this most recently includes what was formally known as race. Nevertheless, ethnicity is founded on culture (religion, language, social customs, etc.), not appearance.

The above excerpt is your second set of proof that race is man-made.


Now, on the subject of Mortal Kombat, you should see now why one cannot refer to Jade and Tanya as black, or Hotaru and Li Mei as Asian. Race is exclusive to humans.

What the Shokans have are subspecies, much like dogs. The tigris subspecies of Shokan is socially inferior to the draco subspecies.

As for Edenian, there are no known subspecies within the Edenian species. Therefore, there are no classifcations beyond species, and as such, we cannot identify them beyond species. This also applies to both Seidans and whatever species Li Mei belongs to.

I feel this is all coming full circle, but that depends on whether you are willing to take in the information in this post.

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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/07/2013 01:35 AM EST
Kintaro's ethnicity is "Tigrar", not "Tigris".

That's the only part of your post that I feel deserves a serious response.
See...here's the thing: I can tell you why I disagree with your definitions of words and make counter-debates about genetics, and you can do the same right back, for days and days.
But that wouldn't address the ACTUAL problem I have with you. The ACTUAL problem, the thing that makes me mad about your posts, which I keep trying to tell you but you have no interest in hearing, is that what "races" are, and whether it's a "real" thing or a social construct, is not what people want to talk about when they make these threads!
You can tell people they're using the word "race" wrong all you like, but this isn't a science or social studies class, this is a message board about a video game, and in that video game, the aliens look like human beings and come in different skin colors just like human beings do, and at the end of the day nobody actually fucking cares that you don't think Edenians with dark skin should be called "black", we actually want to talk about what the characters are supposed to look like. Jade LOOKS like a black chick. Li Mei LOOKS Asian. We ALL know there's no god damned Asia in Outworld! IT'S JUST A FUCKING SHORTHAND!
The sooner you realize this, the sooner you'll stop DERAILING other people's threads. Why don't you make your OWN thread about what the word "race" means instead of mucking up other people's conversations, and see how many people care to post in it?
Quite frankly, I actually think this "every time someone makes a thread about character races, I'll drive it off-topic with a discussion about the scholastic meaning of the word race!" behavior of yours should be a matter for the moderators, but I guess they don't pay much attention to the MK General board since it ain't that busy, and I'm not the sort of person who goes crying to Mick over something so trivial, I know if I were him and people were firing off whiny PMs to me all the time, I'd hate it. So instead I keep thinking maybe I can just reason with you, explain how this avenue of discussion is a goddamn dead end nobody wants to go down, but this is the second time in two months it hasn't worked, so clearly I'm the crazy one because after all, insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results...
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RE: Racial demographics (up for debate)
04/07/2013 08:29 AM EST
RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
Kintaro's ethnicity is "Tigrar", not "Tigris".

That's the only part of your post that I feel deserves a serious response.

See...here's the thing: I can tell you why I disagree with your definitions of words and make counter-debates about genetics, and you can do the same right back, for days and days.

But that wouldn't address the ACTUAL problem I have with you. The ACTUAL problem, the thing that makes me mad about your posts, which I keep trying to tell you but you have no interest in hearing, is that what "races" are, and whether it's a "real" thing or a social construct, is not what people want to talk about when they make these threads!



Actually, you spent the majority of this discussion calling me an idiot, more or less, for my words on race.

It is only now that you want to make a strong statement on my being off-topic, and I know why: the information in my previous post cannot be challenged. You now know the truth on race, but you refuse to admit it.

It's okay, I've done my part. Even better, I managed to connect my information with the topic of this thread.

Now that you know, we can go on with the MK series truly understanding the identities of these characters, as they are.


Thank you for having this discussion with me, and please know that I meant no offense to you whatsoever during this discussion.