I'll IM you accurate info when I get the chance.

Honestly, as much as the online experience changes things a bit, the tier list ultimately comes out mostly the same. Sareena, Dairou and Scorpion are still fantastic offline, while Shujinko, Kai and Shang Tsung still blow. It's just an issue of getting a sense for which characters get a bit better or worse online.

Here are a few characters who are a bit better online:

Noob
Mavado
Kabal
Liu Kang

And here are a few that get a bit worse:

Li Mei
Kitana
Kung Lao

Sareena isn't as good offline I heard. Her F,F+1 is supposed to be a lot less safe offline.

everybody claims shinnok is low tier.

my buddy doug is unstoppable with shinnok.

i am unstoppable with meat. apparently he is high tier.

basically the tiers are crap i think.

some people are just better with certain characters than with others.

None of you guys know anything of Tier lists.

For you to say that Kung Lao is worse online, is a joke. Kung Lao is top 10 online and top 5 offline.

Heres the top 10 offline list for you.

1.Dairou
2.Scorpion
3.Drahmin
4.Sub
5.Kung Lao
6.Tanya
7.Noob
8.Quan Chi
9.Kenshi
10.Sareena

i have a question about scorpion, everyone i see using him online ued f+1 in weapon and they say its the best poke he has, im wondering whether or not this is true offline since it seems a lot less safe offline than online. Scorpr is one of my favorites if not my favorite character and im wondering whterh you guys would advise hapkido or mugai ryu offline? (if they are used for different things like, hapkido for punishers and mugai for poking and turtleing, plz say so).

Hey Karate don't be such a stupid douchebag next time before you post? This set of statements that you posted is self-contradictory. The fact that you just said that Kung Lao is top 10 online but top 5 offline is PERFECTLY in line what I said about Kung Lao getting a little worse online. Depending on how laggy the game is, Broadsword 1,1,f+3 will often whiff after b+3, which reduces Kung Lao's damage potential and puts him at some risk. Regardless, he is a great character online or off, but he is still nevertheless slightly worse online.

Jesus christ people on Internet message boards are fucking stupid. I'm sure you're some elite player who's a lot better than me, but you're totally out of line, especially when you ultimately end up agreeing with what I posted. I mean, what was this, an elementary misunderstanding of the relative nature of the word "worse," or just an opportunity for an ego trip? Grow up.

Scorpion's wep. f+1 is still very good off-line. One of the best mid pop ups in the game, if not the best. Only certain characters can punish Scorpion's f+1 off-line when they block it. Online it is 100% safe on block.

Scorpion's gameplay does not change too much from online to off-line since he is still very safe. Hapkido is probably the safest stance in the entire game. As I've said, Mugai Ryu f+1 is great enough. It punishes almost anything on block off-line.

Kung Lao is worse off-line (like most characters) recovery-wise. Wep. b+3 and b+2 are both horribly punishable when blocked, and so is first stance, f+1. Parry cancel cannot bail you out. However, Lao has deadly and easy combos off-line thanks to aerial cancels. He can do a lot of damage (depending how many aerial cancels you think are "legit").

Overall, off-line fights are different from online fights. You cannot abuse mid pops like you do online. You abuse Noob's 2,4 randomly, that will cost you at least 40% of your life every time it gets blocked. Off-line is all about safe pokes, major turtling, and proper punishing into combos.

Thank you very much. Thanx to everyone actually for all the information about the changes offline and online, and especially fr scorp help. Since someone said things aren't that different offline from online, does anyone happen to have a full tier list, online or offline. I have seen many of them before, but i try to go back and find them and they all are off of the forums. When i get the next one il copy/paste it into a word document. I would like to play in tier with my friends, so if someone has a tier list with all the characters chategorized, or knows where i can find one, it would be a huge help.

Here are the top tiers. I made this list with both off-line and online gameplay in mind. A lot of it is theory fighting so take it for what it is.Thanks to Konqrr goes out as well for editing my post and making it clearer.


1. Sareena - Hardly any mismatches at all. Knives are too good at pressuring, aerial cancels are available. Complete character.

2. Scorpion - He's safe online. Weapon f+1 is a little less safe, though, and lacks aerial cancels but he doesn't really need them as he can do 50%+ damage without them.

3. Dairou - I'm not putting him at #2 until I can beat Check's Scorpion consistantly on a 3-4 star connection. Dairou is still Dairou, though, turtle and run all day. Lots of safe moves are available as well as nice aerial cancels for 40%+ damage.

4. Drahmin - 1,1,CS is an incredible safe dial-a-combo that launches. 1,1 also gives a free throw, which launches, weapon d+1 is a nice low poke that gives huge advantage and is not parriable. He lacks aerial cancels, though, which is the reason he is not a top 3 character.

5. Sub-Zero - Great character overall, hardly any mismatches, has a lot of moves that lead to free throws for decent damage. However, he lacks aerial cancels, which keeps his damage mostly under 40%.

6. Tanya - Air-fireball gives a free throw or 50/50 mixups when it connects. First stance d+4 is the best low in the game, easy 50/50 mixups afterwards. She lacks a somewhat safe mid attack/popup, but she has aerial cancels. I'm not sure how she does against Scorpion and Sareena but she gives Dairou a lot of trouble.

7. Kung Lao - Very, very solid character. Weapon b+3/b+2 mixup after the 1,1,f+3 plant if you can move in fast enough. He lacks a safe mid popup, weapon b+2 and first stance f+1 aren't really safe at all unless the connection is mediocre. Kung Lao also has aerial cancels available into ridiculous damage potential.

8. Noob - He's very good but I've said it 100 times and I'll say it again: 2,4 is a shitty move on block,the only reason it's fairly safe is because of the lag. First stance d+4 is a nice advantageous low poke, his Invisibility move combined with lots of turtling can be a bitch to deal with. Noob has the damage, too, but doesn't really have safe mid popups unless the connection is shit.

9. Kenshi - Nice turtling character. Lots of damage available due to aerial cancels. Weapon 2 is fairly safe even offline depending on distance. You have to turtle with him a lot to use him effectively.

10. Quan Chi - He has the easiest 50/50 mixups in the game. The Rising Kick goes under high attacks, most of the projectiles, and even some mid attacks, and is fairly safe. The Magnetic Force can easily turn the outcome of the match and give Quan Chi the advantage against characters who heavily rely on their weapon stances, however, give me a 3-4 star connection and he's so limited. Weapon d+1,3...the second hit is blockable even if the first one hits and punishable by jabs. The last hit of weapon 1,1,4 is parriable. Rising Star is punishable by jabs, plus, he must be the slowest character in the game (since in both of his stances he moves very slowly), which means he struggles immensly against turtlers. His distance game sucks, his projectile is very slow and recovers very slowly but it does hit mid I think.

The below characters are top tiers online ONLY due them being a lot safer online (compared to offline where they are less safe)

11. Raiden - He's a very decent character, lots of pokes available, and he even has aerial cancels in his arsenal. Weapon d+1 is a great low poke that gives Raiden the advantage upon hit. Teleport is still very good, first stance f+1, and 1,2,CS are annoyingly good online.

12-13. Mavado & Kabal - Both of them are almost played exactly the same way. Weapon u+2/4 mixup. Mavado has aerial cancels that probably lead into the best damage available in the game but lacks a safe mid popup even online to set up the damage. On the contrary, Kabal can set up his damage due to the Flash (which causes huge problems for most characters since the Flash punishes almost everything), but he lacks aerial cancels and damage unlike Mavado. They're only top tier online, though, I'd really put Kabal over Mavado due to the Flash, but offline, both u+2 and 4 in weapon stance are horribly punishable on block. u+2 gives most characters a free throw at the worst.

14. Shinnok - Decent character but he's so un-safe even online. He has aerial cancels, nice combos even without them, d+3 in weapon stance is a deadly low move, etc.

This is not an official tier list. It's very hard to judge who's above who espeically in the top 10 (besides Sareena and Scorpion,and Dairou). For example, Tanya may not do as well against Scorpion, but Drahmin does better than her. However, Tanya does a lot better than Drahmin against Dairou. It's like a long chain of certain match ups that makes you question where certain characters really do stand in the tier list. Combine that with the inconsistent connections and lag online, and it's really impossible to jump to conclusions. However, regardless of that, I think that all of the aforementioned characters are top tiers.
______________________________________________

At the top of the list are the three "God-Tier" characters who are above and beyond all of the regular characters due to their Boss abilities.

Blaze
Moloch
Onaga
______________________________________________

The following are the characters that are so bad they shouldn't even be taken seriously:

Frost
Kai

Well put Dave. But I think Tanya can easily keep up with Scorpion. I find myself able to put up a fight against KARATE's Scorpion. I think her d+4 is rarely punishable even by Scorp's f+1 which enables her to spam it. Or maybe it's just me. Overall a high level Tanya vs. a high level Scorpion is a pretty intense fight. I guess it comes down to which player gets lucky, lol.


Sareena she's fucked basically. Even though she can side step her knives with ease Tanya's left guessing whether to duck and get hit by f,f,1 or stand and block then get grabbed. And you can just forget about her invisibility if you get hit by a knife, hehe. Only really good Sareena I've fought with Tanya was Bone's. I've fought VERSA's but I used Li Mei (bad idea, lol). P.S.- Why you gotta rag on my best character, Frost, like that? You ass! Hehe, j/k with you dude. But as much I hate to admit it she is complete crap in MKA. No mids AT ALL. So she's forced to rely heavily on her freeze specials.

Mind giving me some options with Stryker, Jarek, & Bo' Rai Cho. Dave? as they are the one's i use the most. I already know how to use mavado. So im not to worried about that. And my bo is great. But i just wanna hear what's safe for him online.

I know very little about Stryker. He's a solid character, though. Probably around mid-tier. He has that ove move that I especially like. I think it's "2" in first stance. It hits mid, it's un-parriable, and it gives very decent advantage on a successful hit.

Jarek is a decent character. A lot of people assume his game revolves around keep away, but it really does not. The Rhino Drop is jumpable on reaction. The Flying Leg move is very punishable when blocked (especially by some characters, such as Dairou). The Lasso is slow, and when it trades hits with another projectile, you don't get the juggle. It's also very punishable on block (Sareena gets full-screen knife into throw, Dairou gets a TS Drop, etc.). His game up close is above average at best. Most of the stuff he does is parriable. He can still compete, though, just not Vs. characters like Scorpion, Sareena, Dairou, Drahmin, etc.

BRC is probably a top 10 character. Off-line I know he is because he has:

(wep.) 3,4,4, 3,4,4, throw for easy 45% of damage.

That doesn't work online, though, because of the lag. But you can still do:

(wep.) 2,4, 2,4, throw or even juggle after 2,4, with b+1 (I think) into the 3,3 glitch online. That's what Check was doing to me (if I recall correctly) back when I was playing MK:A a lot.

BRC is still very, very good. Just not MK:D good. If his throw was broken like it was in MK:D, I think he would easily be one of the best characters in the game, if not the best. In MK:A he's still not safe enough, and his dial-a-combos that are abusable are parriable inbetween the hits.

Mavado is simple to play. Wep. u+2/4 mix up. 4 gives a free throw. Both are safe enough online to be extremely abusable.

PS: You sent me a PM, right? I'm not sure what you're asking, though.

Yea it was to show you my post here but you covered it. I rember when we played i got you that 1 round with jarek untill you did mixup's after the tele. Thanx though, i appreciate what you offered here.

how would u rank jade offline compared to other characters, around where in the tier list. Also, how would you recomend play her/playing against her?

Nice input Dave but I have to disagree with you here.

MINION, Jarek's specials are definatly not his main game.

But his weapon 1,3,4 can be a deadly 50/50 that you can constantly mix up with a throw or rhino drop.

1,3,4...1,3,4 throw

- this is very effective since the opponent thinks your going for the free throw.

or

1,3,4 rhino drop

or

1...1,3 rhino drop. I think that one is only safe online though.

and his d1 is a great poke.

MINION and bewoulf what are your online screen names? Jarek and Jade are two of my main's and Jade Im not going to begin to explain, but I can make them compete against any player using any character.

Find me online...

Skuntac
Newskun

I'll try and help you out since I like using Jade too. Although someone can probably explain better than me though, lol.

Jade's all about 50/50s with her staff. There's not much use for Fan Zi.

FAN ZI (hand combat)

Altough 3 (X) in Fan Zi is a good pop-up and it's really safe.

Plus down+4 is somewhat a good low-hit. It's exactly like Noob's down+4 so with Jade you can mix up down+4 with 3 in Fan Zi.

BOJUTSU (weapon)

Jade's 1,1 (square, square) can be an annoying mix-up. It hits mid so ducking it is out of the question. Right after that you can grab them.

Her throw is what kills people the most. Once you grab them your opponent is left guessing whether you're going to do 1,1 (making them block high causing you to grab him/her) or are you going to just grab them again (making them block low causing you to do 1,1 again.)

Sadly offline 1,1 is punishable so try not to overdo it cause you'll get screwed.

Now 4 in weapon is useful too. It's a free grab which is awesome. Or sometimes you mix it up. When you hit your opponent with 4 in Bojutsu and they know it's a free grab naturally they're going to duck so just do 1,1 to trick them, lol. Although I"m not entirely sure if 4 is safe on block. I'll have to check.

Also back+3 is a good low-hit as well as down+3.

However do not do up+3 (X), up+4 (circle), or down+2 (triangle). Those moves in her weapon are super unsafe online and offline.

SPECIALS

BOOMERANG- Her projectile is somewhat ok to use. Only use it from a distance. You're asking for trouble if you do it up close.

SLIDE KICK- This is a horrible move IMO. It doesn't hit mid anymore like it did MKD. Sure it's faster and reaches farther but it's still a crappy move. MY best advice for this is don't do it. Unless your opponent likes to jump A LOT then go for it.

VANISHING WINDS (teleport)- her teleport is ok. She can still be hit while "recovering" from it so try not to spam it. Although her teleport is an infinite. Grab, teleport, grab, teleport and so on..... But don't use that. I"m sure who ever you'll be playing will become annoyed, lol.

DODGING SHADOWS (green glow)- this special is really useful for people who like to shoot crap at you constantly. Try to use this as much as you can even if your opponent doesn't abuse projectiles. Although it doesn't protect you from all projectiles. Here are some of them:

Scorpion's spear
Stryker's taser
Smoke's Sticky Fingers special (back, forward, 2(triangle)) Hsu Hao's chest laser Kano's eye laser

I think that's it.

Well anyways I hope this helps you. It's probably too much information, lol. Overall Jade is probably top 15-20.

*NAKM*

I'd throw Stryker into the upper-mid discussion, right below the top 10 or 15 actually. Stryker is a beast if you can position yourself correctly and pick your spots. Bo is up there too I think.

In online mode, out of the god tiers. The order in top to bottom is this:

Blaze
Moloch
Onaga

I don't know about offline though but apparently Blaze users are a tad bit stronger than Moloch users. I'm an exception to this though. Kung Lao IS in fact good online. Now against Moloch users, Reiko, Blaze, and Kung Lao are 3 characters I reccomend against him. I forgot if Ermac, Kenshi, Shujinko's, and Mokap's tele slam moves would help against Moloch though. However if so then you can pretty much make an infinite and/or a devastating combo from that and go from there if you can pull it off. Onaga and Blaze however are different issues. Now those I mentioned aren't the only ones that you can use to beat Moloch users. Those are just the best 3 I know about while Jinko, Kenshi, Ermac, and Mokap are potential ones. Whoops I forgot about stryker. You can beat Blaze users very easily with Stryker if you position him right like m0sEpH said in his post. Stryker is one tough dude. Then again he was one tough dude in MK3. Then again, regarding Stryker users vs Blaze users, it all comes down to how well you play using Stryker. Now if only Stryker has a shokan stomp like move like the one he did on Sheeva in the trailers for MKA lol.

I don't think Ermac's or Kenshi's teleslams work on Moloch, Onaga, or Blaze. But I do know that Kintaro is a very good counter-pick for M.O.B.

Thats my thinking too.

I must say, SubZero has also improved too quite drastically

Ya know, I actually forgot about Kintaro. Especially since I use him a lot against blaze. I was probably sleepy when I made my last post lol.

Yeah man Kintaro owns Moloch, Blaze and Onaga.

I love all the people who are like 'U R TEH LIE CUZ I CAN KIK UR ASS WIT BARRKA HE IS DA BEST TEIR!!1'