I Think this Roster Makes sense..
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 08:36 AM EST
barakall

Rain has developed into a nice character, though I’d wish that they’d get away from the ninja inspired look all together. They should show Edenia too. He’s 100% in regardless of that interview. I dislike his name though, with a passion. Can never take that seriously..

I love his name, but i guess if English/American was my native language it would not sound that cool.

I also like his modern designs, but I hope we will be able to give him klassic Ninja costume if he is in. Even MK9 did not give him one, while those are just palette swap :/

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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 08:57 AM EST

I like Rains overall design in mkx (which stemmed from his Armageddon look) .. it’s not very ninja looking, more so royalty in my opinion.

What is going to be interesting is that since Kitana looks Japanese I wonder if Rain will also look Japanese. The Edenian look to this point has always been darker skinned but more middle eastern?? Idk. But should be interesting to see his style in mk11 if he gets in.

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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 11:33 AM EST
thisiscourage

I like Rains overall design in mkx (which stemmed from his Armageddon look) .. it’s not very ninja looking, more so royalty in my opinion.

What is going to be interesting is that since Kitana looks Japanese I wonder if Rain will also look Japanese. The Edenian look to this point has always been darker skinned but more middle eastern?? Idk. But should be interesting to see his style in mk11 if he gets in.

Back in Armageddon I remember seeing a BTS of some sort (don't remember if it was a video, concept art or what) talking about how they were interpreting Edenia as having an Ancient Greek flavor, which was the inspiration for Edenian architecture and the designs for Taven and Daegon. Greek and Near Eastern aesthetics are pretty closely linked, so the fact that they've hovered in that general geographic neighborhood for Edenian designs afterward makes sense.

Kitana's always been an odd one out though, because her name and her roots in MK2 strongly point in an East Asian direction and it's really hard to let go of that. (Sindel doesn't seem to fit either region; I always thought her design was more inspired by Bride of Frankenstein than anything.) So I guess the takeaway is that Edenia is dominantly Greek/Near Eastern-ish, but there are other kinds of cultures around as well because Edenia is an entire planet.

Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve. ~ Master Fuji's Fortune Cookie
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 11:53 AM EST
02/05/2019 11:56 AM EST
SenSx
barakall

Rain has developed into a nice character, though I’d wish that they’d get away from the ninja inspired look all together. They should show Edenia too. He’s 100% in regardless of that interview. I dislike his name though, with a passion. Can never take that seriously..

I love his name, but i guess if English/American was my native language it would not sound that cool.

I also like his modern designs, but I hope we will be able to give him klassic Ninja costume if he is in. Even MK9 did not give him one, while those are just palette swap :/

How cool does it sound in your native language, @SenSx ?

As far as MK's habit of naming characters after things goes, I've long felt sorry for Reptile and C/Khameleon because their names are clearly racial slurs given to them by their slave masters. It was pretty awesome seeing the developers kind of acknowledge this when Raiden reveals his real name as Syzoth.

Noob doesn't do so well either, for reasons that are obvious now but couldn't have been anticipated back when he was created.

Rain isn't so bad to me. Sounds like a name that he might have given himself that describes his powers but sounds more graceful and highbrow than other potential names. (Hydro? Lame, already taken. Riptide? Too crude for a prince. Sunami? Hmm, has the right elegance but sounds a tad too feminine. Any more direct references to storms will tread on Raiden's territory, and you wouldn't want to be a cheap Raiden pretender. River? Too peaceful. Umm... Gush? Clearly running out of ideas here. Let's go with Rain. Simple, classy, and just menacing enough.)

Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve. ~ Master Fuji's Fortune Cookie
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 12:47 PM EST
thisiscourage

I like Rains overall design in mkx (which stemmed from his Armageddon look) .. it’s not very ninja looking, more so royalty in my opinion.

What is going to be interesting is that since Kitana looks Japanese I wonder if Rain will also look Japanese. The Edenian look to this point has always been darker skinned but more middle eastern?? Idk. But should be interesting to see his style in mk11 if he gets in.

If Rain ends up another Asian looking character I will not be pleased, the Edenians should not become suddenly Asians... I like them being latins-like more, they are like elves, well Rain wouldn't be like an elf if he's Asian... Vain characters are rarely Asians as well...

I know this sounds super racist, but it isn't, Rain has never been Asian, so why suddenly turn everybody asian? I love characters like Kung Lao and Liu Kang, they are Asians and I love that, but the Edenian super pretty characters shouldn't be all Asian all suddenly.

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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 01:00 PM EST
02/05/2019 01:02 PM EST
Nuckelavee
thisiscourage

I like Rains overall design in mkx (which stemmed from his Armageddon look) .. it’s not very ninja looking, more so royalty in my opinion.

What is going to be interesting is that since Kitana looks Japanese I wonder if Rain will also look Japanese. The Edenian look to this point has always been darker skinned but more middle eastern?? Idk. But should be interesting to see his style in mk11 if he gets in.

If Rain ends up another Asian looking character I will not be pleased, the Edenians should not become suddenly Asians... I like them being latins-like more, they are like elves, well Rain wouldn't be like an elf if he's Asian... Vain characters are rarely Asians as well...

I know this sounds super racist, but it isn't, Rain has never been Asian, so why suddenly turn everybody asian? I love characters like Kung Lao and Liu Kang, they are Asians and I love that, but the Edenian super pretty characters shouldn't be all Asian all suddenly.

Kitana has always had more of an Asian influence than the other Edenians. She has a Japanese sounding name and carries Japanese tessen fans. It makes sense for her to appear more Japanese.

Doesn't mean anyone else will also change.

As for vanity as a character trait, what about Kung Lao?

Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve. ~ Master Fuji's Fortune Cookie
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 01:56 PM EST

Kung Lao = Envy, not vanity, he doesn't care about his appearance.

Johnny and Rain are the only vain characters, maybe Tanya, dunno.

I don't think Kitana looks ANY asian in MKX...

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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 02:29 PM EST
02/05/2019 02:39 PM EST
Nuckelavee

Kung Lao = Envy, not vanity, he doesn't care about his appearance.

Johnny and Rain are the only vain characters, maybe Tanya, dunno.

I don't think Kitana looks ANY asian in MKX...

Envy is just one dimension of Lao's character. Vanity is another. Vanity is about more than just appearance; it's an overabundance of pride and self-image in general. When Kung Lao takes a bow after defeating Kintaro and lets his guard down to wallow in his own perceived awesomeness, and gets killed for it -- that's vanity. Ever since MK Gold he has prioritized personal honor over higher principles. (And if you don't think Kung Lao cares about his appearance then you haven't been paying attention. The dichotomy between Kung Lao and Liu Kang has always been one of flashy style vs. practical and humble simplicity.)

From the moment they gave him any personality at all, Rain has been defined by personal pride. Pride in his appearance is a symptom of his vanity, not the core of it, just like Johnny Cage. And it's the same kind of arrogance and the need to "be somebody" that Raiden chastises Kung Lao for in MK9.

Kitana's costume was definitely styled to be Asian in MKX. Part of the issue is that they seemed to have a hard time making some people look convincingly Asian until recently. MKX still had Sub-Zero looking pretty white for a Chinese dude and Kitana was... kind of ambiguous, really. (They did a pretty good job with Scorpion and Takeda, I think. Takeda has decently accurate Thai features.)

I really appreciate how much more authentic Liu Kang and Sub-Zero look now. White Dude Sub-Zero has bugged me since MK3.

Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve. ~ Master Fuji's Fortune Cookie
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 02:39 PM EST

I loved white dude Sub-Zero, and because Sub-Zero was supposed to be HALF Asian only.

I think Scorpion was the one that was fully Asian. This new look for Sub-Zero looks horrible, really ugly. I loved his look in MKX.

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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 02:44 PM EST
02/05/2019 02:48 PM EST
Nuckelavee

I loved white dude Sub-Zero, and because Sub-Zero was supposed to be HALF Asian only.

I think Scorpion was the one that was fully Asian. This new look for Sub-Zero looks horrible, really ugly. I loved his look in MKX.

I and nearly every other half-Asian person I know looks more Asian than white. Asian phenotype tends to dominate.

I will try not to take your comment about Sub-Zero's face, which is modeled from a real Asian human's face, as looking horrible and ugly, too personally. I gotta tell you though... it's not easy.

By the way, they only made Sub-Zero half white to explain away the fact that he was played by a (totally) white actor. He was originally conceived by Tobias to be Chinese. Look it up.

Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve. ~ Master Fuji's Fortune Cookie
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 02:50 PM EST
02/05/2019 02:54 PM EST
umbrascitor
Nuckelavee

I loved white dude Sub-Zero, and because Sub-Zero was supposed to be HALF Asian only.

I think Scorpion was the one that was fully Asian. This new look for Sub-Zero looks horrible, really ugly. I loved his look in MKX.

I and nearly every other half-Asian person I know looks more Asian than white. Asian phenotype tends to dominate.

I will try not to take your comment about Sub-Zero's face, which is modeled from a real Asian human's face, as looking horrible and ugly, too personally. I gotta tell you though... it's not easy.

It's an ingame sprite + my personal sexual preferences, nothing to do with racism at all, if I hated all Asians I wouldn't have cared so much for Kung Lao, Liu Kang, Scorpion, and especially Shang Tsung and Sektor, two of my favorite characters of all times.

I just don't like Kitana and Sub-Zero to be fully Asian-looking, as I am used to their previous appearances. And I find this sub-zero to be much uglier design in general to MKX's design.

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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 03:10 PM EST
Nuckelavee

I just don't like Kitana and Sub-Zero to be fully Asian-looking, as I am used to their previous appearances. And I find this sub-zero to be much uglier design in general to MKX's design.

Previous appearances... like this?

Dun-dun-dunnnnn!

They got one of their programmers to pose for this shot in MK2. No idea why they couldn't find one Chinese guy for MK3. You probably missed my edit in my last post:

By the way, they only made Sub-Zero half white to explain away the fact that he was played by a (totally) white actor. He was originally conceived by Tobias to be Chinese. Look it up.

You're free to enjoy your aesthetic preference for a white Sub-Zero, but I'm personally happier with a version that's both truer to the original concept and a bit more accurate for a mixed heritage guy.

Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve. ~ Master Fuji's Fortune Cookie
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 03:28 PM EST

I think I tend to prefer a Sub-Zero who looks Caucasian this day in age just because I've become used to it over the past 15-20 years... He looked white in MK3, fairly white in MK4, Old Man white in MKDA, SUPER white in Deception (that one was a joke, we couldn't see his face in Deception, but his skin was very pale), AND fairly white again in MKX. So making him suddenly look Asian again seems off after all that time.

THAT SAID... yeah, I've been aware of that MK2 ending screen for that entire time too, and fully acknowledge he originally looked Chinese. So to make him look Chinese again is not entirely out of left field.

I'll also add a +1 to Asian phenotype tending to dominate. Because it generally does. I can point to my sister's boyfriend and all of his brothers as first hand proof in my own life. (Not that any of you know them or anything, but I do, lol...)

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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 03:32 PM EST
Gillbob316

I think I tend to prefer a Sub-Zero who looks Caucasian this day in age just because I've become used to it over the past 15-20 years... He looked white in MK3, fairly white in MK4, Old Man white in MKDA, SUPER white in Deception (that one was a joke, we couldn't see his face in Deception, but his skin was very pale), AND fairly while again in MKX. So making him suddenly look Asian again seems off after all that time.

I understand that perspective. I just fall closer to the "just because it's normal doesn't make it okay, or not worth fixing" span of the opinion spectrum.

Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve. ~ Master Fuji's Fortune Cookie
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RE: I Think this Roster Makes sense..
02/05/2019 05:38 PM EST
umbrascitor
Nuckelavee

Kung Lao = Envy, not vanity, he doesn't care about his appearance.

Johnny and Rain are the only vain characters, maybe Tanya, dunno.

I don't think Kitana looks ANY asian in MKX...

Envy is just one dimension of Lao's character. Vanity is another. Vanity is about more than just appearance; it's an overabundance of pride and self-image in general. When Kung Lao takes a bow after defeating Kintaro and lets his guard down to wallow in his own perceived awesomeness, and gets killed for it -- that's vanity. Ever since MK Gold he has prioritized personal honor over higher principles. (And if you don't think Kung Lao cares about his appearance then you haven't been paying attention. The dichotomy between Kung Lao and Liu Kang has always been one of flashy style vs. practical and humble simplicity.)

From the moment they gave him any personality at all, Rain has been defined by personal pride. Pride in his appearance is a symptom of his vanity, not the core of it, just like Johnny Cage. And it's the same kind of arrogance and the need to "be somebody" that Raiden chastises Kung Lao for in MK9.

Kitana's costume was definitely styled to be Asian in MKX. Part of the issue is that they seemed to have a hard time making some people look convincingly Asian until recently. MKX still had Sub-Zero looking pretty white for a Chinese dude and Kitana was... kind of ambiguous, really. (They did a pretty good job with Scorpion and Takeda, I think. Takeda has decently accurate Thai features.)

I really appreciate how much more authentic Liu Kang and Sub-Zero look now. White Dude Sub-Zero has bugged me since MK3.

Dude same here... always hated white guy subby

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