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LadyRaiden
07/05/2010 02:55 AM (UTC)
0
ErmacMk5 Wrote:


Fujin: Fujin was presumably guarding the amulet as of MK1-3. It'd be interesting to see how he reacted to the invasion, but as a whole, not entirely necessary.


Unless I'm mistaken the amulet was stolen before the Mortal Kombat tournament. Shinnok was given a fake and Quan Chi kept the real one. Never did finish MK: Mythologies Sub-Zero so I don't know if Sub-Zero ever got a false copy too to give to Raiden or not. If not, no medallion to guard and even if there was one, I would think the Elder Gods would have gotten a better security system than four elemental gods that were easily defeated by a single mortal warrior. Not sure as to the time-frame of him in MK:D's Konquest, but I do believe it was about the same time of MK1-3 so he wasn't guarding anything. Why he was there, no idea and to be honest not sure if Konquest can be considered cannon or not.

More likely Fujin just kept to his job as the God of Wind and since he wasn't Sworn Protector had no reason or right to deal directly with mortals. He didn't show up until Shinnok's invasion, which endangered gods and the Elder Gods and doesn't really show up again in MK:A which is also a danger to all, including gods and Elder Gods. Which is really funny since in both MK:DA and MK:D, he was sworn protector and thus should have at least a commentary or something about warning Earth's warriors.
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RazorsEdge701
07/05/2010 03:00 AM (UTC)
0
ErmacMk5 Wrote:
I always took reiko's mk4 bio to mean that he "died" in the battle between Shinnok's forces and the Gods, and that's why he didn't appear in the first few revisions of MK4.


That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about how he came to be in Shinnok's service in the first place. It's common sense that the soldiers of Hell would be guys who died and went to Hell.

ErmacMk5 Wrote:
Nothing about Reiko's story or physical traits indicate he's an undead wraith like Noob Saibot.


Yes, the guy who has hair and tattoos just like Quan Chi's demon girls and glowing blue eyes exactly like Noob Saibot's, he couldn't possibly be undead at all...I'm sure ALL of Shinnok's army just WALKED into the goddamn Netherealm or were sent there while still alive like Reptile. That makes so much more sense, right? C'mon man. Be real.

ErmacMk5 Wrote:
For the record, You can have multiple generals in an army for the record. It's not a one man job necessarily. The United States has multiple Generals, and Outworld is an entire realm, not just a country; I can't imagine they'd have only one general.


In the games, the term is only EVER used to refer to a SINGLE member of the army who is Kahn's right-hand man in charge of all his forces. That fact is kind of an important part of MK3 and Deadly Alliance. Motaro is deliberately named "THE general" specifically because the Shokans had the job before and both failed so Kahn lost faith in their ability to serve him. And when Sheeva got pissed about that and killed Motaro, Kano was promoted. As THE general, he lead all of Outworld's forces against Kitana and Goro's raids in MKDA. That's not even speculation, it's actual canon. In Outworld, there is only one General. Fact.

Well Reiko's story is that he's a renowned Outworld general, but if there's only one general at a time, and it wasn't him in MK1 thru 3, then where was he? Obviously, he was already in the Netherealm by that time.
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ErmacMk5
07/05/2010 12:56 PM (UTC)
0
LadyRaiden Wrote:
ErmacMk5 Wrote:


Fujin: Fujin was presumably guarding the amulet as of MK1-3. It'd be interesting to see how he reacted to the invasion, but as a whole, not entirely necessary.


Unless I'm mistaken the amulet was stolen before the Mortal Kombat tournament. Shinnok was given a fake and Quan Chi kept the real one. Never did finish MK: Mythologies Sub-Zero so I don't know if Sub-Zero ever got a false copy too to give to Raiden or not. If not, no medallion to guard and even if there was one, I would think the Elder Gods would have gotten a better security system than four elemental gods that were easily defeated by a single mortal warrior. Not sure as to the time-frame of him in MK:D's Konquest, but I do believe it was about the same time of MK1-3 so he wasn't guarding anything. Why he was there, no idea and to be honest not sure if Konquest can be considered cannon or not.

More likely Fujin just kept to his job as the God of Wind and since he wasn't Sworn Protector had no reason or right to deal directly with mortals. He didn't show up until Shinnok's invasion, which endangered gods and the Elder Gods and doesn't really show up again in MK:A which is also a danger to all, including gods and Elder Gods. Which is really funny since in both MK:DA and MK:D, he was sworn protector and thus should have at least a commentary or something about warning Earth's warriors.


Sub-zero retrieved (what he thought was) the amulet and handed it off to Raiden. I assume that Raiden would have the Gods guard it.
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RazorsEdge701
07/05/2010 01:03 PM (UTC)
0
ErmacMk5 Wrote:
Sub-zero retrieved (what he thought was) the amulet and handed it off to Raiden. I assume that Raiden would have the Gods guard it.


Now this I agree with. Raiden and Sub-Zero thought they got the amulet back, so the fake would have been left in the temple and the gods would've kept on guarding it.

The collector's edition MK4 comic (even though unlike the other two official Midway-released comics, it wasn't written by Tobias and isn't actual canon, I bring it up as a possible example anyway) even shows the younger Sub-Zero traveling to the Temple of the Elements to, basically, apologize to the four gods for what his brother did all those years ago. He expects to find Fujin and the other three there, still guarding the amulet, but he finds the temple empty, only because Shinnok's invasion has started and they're fighting him off in Heaven.
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ErmacMk5
07/05/2010 01:23 PM (UTC)
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RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
ErmacMk5 Wrote:
I always took reiko's mk4 bio to mean that he "died" in the battle between Shinnok's forces and the Gods, and that's why he didn't appear in the first few revisions of MK4.


That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about how he came to be in Shinnok's service in the first place. It's common sense that the soldiers of Hell would be guys who died and went to Hell.

ErmacMk5 Wrote:
Nothing about Reiko's story or physical traits indicate he's an undead wraith like Noob Saibot.


Yes, the guy who has hair and tattoos just like Quan Chi's demon girls and glowing blue eyes exactly like Noob Saibot's, he couldn't possibly be undead at all...I'm sure ALL of Shinnok's army just WALKED into the goddamn Netherealm or were sent there while still alive like Reptile. That makes so much more sense, right? C'mon man. Be real.

ErmacMk5 Wrote:
For the record, You can have multiple generals in an army for the record. It's not a one man job necessarily. The United States has multiple Generals, and Outworld is an entire realm, not just a country; I can't imagine they'd have only one general.


In the games, the term is only EVER used to refer to a SINGLE member of the army who is Kahn's right-hand man in charge of all his forces. That fact is kind of an important part of MK3 and Deadly Alliance. Motaro is deliberately named "THE general" specifically because the Shokans had the job before and both failed so Kahn lost faith in their ability to serve him. And when Sheeva got pissed about that and killed Motaro, Kano was promoted. As THE general, he lead all of Outworld's forces against Kitana and Goro's raids in MKDA. That's not even speculation, it's actual canon. In Outworld, there is only one General. Fact.


Well Reiko's story is that he's a renowned Outworld general, but if there's only one general at a time, and it wasn't him in MK1 thru 3, then where was he? Obviously, he was already in the Netherealm by that time.


I still see a lot of this as baseless speculation. Tanya's eyes are without pupils and she was never condemned to the Netherealm...and for the record Sareena has pupils. Nothing in the later games ever indicated that Reiko is undead, or had been in the netherealm for ages.

As for Outworld having one general, again this is baseless...yes Motaro was the main general, sort of like General Patreaus in Iraq...but I don't believe for a second Motaro lead every single extermination squad around the whole planet looking for the chosen warriors. That role had to have been delegated out in some fashion...unless Kahn only had a few hundred centuar warriors which wouldn't make sense either.

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RazorsEdge701
07/05/2010 08:33 PM (UTC)
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Well everything I've said so far is based on canon evidence, while you haven't offered a shred of in-game proof to back up your opinion, all you're doing is blindly denying everything with no continuity to counter it. I mean, you can SAY militaries have multiple generals all you like, but in the Mortal Kombat games, General is clearly established as a one man rank, the highest in Outworld. That's just plain how it is in the game's story. Sure, squads might have different lesser leaders, like Baraka for example. But those men aren't called "General". They'd be captains or lieutenants perhaps. Motaro is the only one called "general", everyone answers to him and then he answers to Kahn.
And as for the eyes, I never said his look like Sareena's. I said his eyes are the same as Noob Saibot's. Eyes that are either blank or glowing are always a sign of non-humanness, and the only characters that have blue are a wraith and Reiko, so it's logical to assume a connection. Now, as for Tanya's, I believe her's are white because it looks like she's wearing a domino mask like a superhero/villain, i.e. Robin. Comic book artists always draw them like they have lenses.
Bringing up him having BotS hair and tattoos reminds me, though: Reiko's allies list in MK4 (on the website, which was Midway-run and therefore canon) included Quan Chi's henchgirls, but how could he be an ally of Kia, Jataaka, AND Sareena, if Sareena hasn't been one of them since Mythologies? Common sense: he's been working for Shinnok since before Mythologies.
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ErmacMk5
07/06/2010 12:23 AM (UTC)
0


The truth is we know VERY little about Reiko....I was hoping MKA would tell us something about him, but all we know is that he's the general of Outworld's army as of Armageddon.

As far as I can remember the mk4 official site didn't have an allies list. If you can provide me with the site from archive I'll eat my words.
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RazorsEdge701
07/06/2010 01:16 AM (UTC)
0
ErmacMk5 Wrote:
As far as I can remember the mk4 official site didn't have an allies list. If you can provide me with the site from archive I'll eat my words.


As you wish:

http://web.archive.org/web/19980122200302/www.mk4.com/mikicic/MK4_Reiko.html

"Affiliation: Kia and Sareena"
See, the TRUTH is that "we" have all the cold, hard data we need about Reiko's background, you're just trying to tell me 2 + 2 doesn't "have to" equal 4.
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Jaded-Raven
07/07/2010 01:45 AM (UTC)
0
I wouldn't call Reiko an undead, as I wouldn't call Mileena an undead. They have both been killed, spent some time in the Netherrealms and then returned to the surface worlds.

Reiko's facial tattoos could be explained that he was at some point part of the Brotherhood of the Shadows who wore such tattoos, like Sareena, Jataaka and Kia - Quan Chi has something alike, those black stripes from his eyes which runs over his scalp.

It has been explained that Noob was originally thought to be in MK4, but they decided to make a new character in his stead = Reiko. That would explain why he has blue glowing eyes in that game like Noob. However, it was removed in MK Armageddon where he simply had all white eyes.

The white eyes, however, could easily be connected with either having some source of great power which makes your eyes go pupilless, such as Raiden, Fujin and even Shang Tsung in MK1-3, and also by the fact that they have been brought back to life, like Sindel has and even Mileena in Mortal Kombat Gold. Why Tanya has white eyes is a wonder, but as Razor said, it might just be because of the mask she wears, to make her look more as a villain.

The only two I truly see as undeads would be Scorpion and Noob, who were once Earthrealm warriors who died and then turned into wraiths. But that is of course just my opinion of the matter.
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RazorsEdge701
07/07/2010 02:18 AM (UTC)
0
Well I'm fine with however you want to interpret "how dead" he is. I never said he HAS to be a wraith, just that his similarities to Noob imply he COULD be one, and either way, the simplest explanation is always the best, so it's most likely he got to the Netherealm by dying rather than travel or banishment like Reptile did in MK4 (I always thought that was retarded anyway. Sindel sentences Reptile to Hell...but sends him there with a portal instead of a simple execution? Kinda impractical.)
My MAIN point, anyway, is that we pretty much know concretely that he ended up in Shinnok's employ well before MK1, and Kahn had a different General during each of those games, so him working for Kahn during the timeframe of this game would not fit continuity.

And that's what the topic is about, where characters were during MK1 thru 3. Reiko was in the Netherealm.

(For the record though, I know it's not consistent in the game, but Reiko's eyes do still have a blue tint in some Armageddon material like the giant cast render. Noob's eyes are much less blue in MKD/MKA and Shinnok's eyes are a lot less green in MKA too, that really pisses me off that they can't stick to their shit.)
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