I... I gotta level with you guys... I "might" have possession of a UMK3 ROM! Aaaaaagh!

But my intentions are all good here... I SWEAR I'll buy an MK3 arcade cabinet the next time I see one at Best Buy! Hey, I still got a Gamer Gift Card Coupon... that'll get me $5 off that bad boy when it comes back in stock!

MK4 is undefendable in any regard. On the whole, the graphics suck, they weren't even very impressive for the time. The fighting engine is dangerously similar to the 2D engine for UMK3, because it is actually a 2D game with side stepping, SNK has dodging, it's the same concept, you can't walk up down, or diagonally, it has the same moves as all the previous MK games, it was in the arcade. That's the lowdown on MK4, it is defined as being classic.

MKDA is the first step in this new direction and it was is bare bones 3D. You can walk in a circular pattern, 4 directions, you have a modifed basic attack system from the classic MKs, it's still a direct deviation from the style, it is not arguable if it is a good move or not because that is a pure opinion. I don't like it, nor do I not like it. There's is undeniable broken aspects to 2 or 3 characters in the game. No one else stands a chance. There's what 24 characters?

MKD now has 4 characters who are viciously broken, 3 via one attack, and 1 who is simply as overpowered as Akuma in Super Turbo. Trust me, I know plenty about the games, but it's ridiculous to pass them off as quality games in terms of play. The best in the series was UMK3 and MKT, the highest percentage of top tier characters in a fighting game for their time, UMK3 having 8 of 23 characters being in the top tier, and MKT having 11 I believe. Most games having that many characters have about 4 characters tops who are contenders.

That is besides the point though. Every MK starting with MK1 was a ste up in gameplay, including MKT being faster if you want to count that, the aggressor was disabable and I don't think anyone serious about MK plays with that on. MK4 was a step down on the same system, MKDA and MKD are a new system, and dramatically fail when it comes to gameplay, which will keep more people coming back than graphics, sounds, fatalities, and all the other superficial nonsense that movie dwellers can get a kick out of. I know there's a lot of people who watch the same movies over and over, I am like that, but how many people can watch the same handful of fatalities over and over again and not be considered disturbed?

Matt

This topic should be said differently and not blaming midway altogether cause umm i dont think every single person at midway worked or works on mat2 or mortal kombat.So in that respect,center out the ppl who worked on the game itself and not the entire company cause that means your blaming everyone at midway when infact not everyone there was at fault for something they had no part of.

Hmm, interesting concept. If you've read the posts on this thread you'll notice that Digital Eclipse has been mentioned but ultimately, it's Midway that looked the final game over and gave it it's seal of approval. And where in the hell are we blaming everyone at Midway? Who cares if we say Midway instead of singling out the certain people involved in this. Everyone here knows who we're talking about anyways. Not like we're going to hurt someones feelings over at Midway when they read these posts if they had nothing to do with MAT2. It's like you're insulted that we are ripping on Midway as a group.

Shhhh. Don't give them any ideas, I want to hear their own stupid excuses. Wait a minute, I already know what their excuse is going to be though. "We didn't have enough time to get it done"

I hold Midway responsible as they have the last say in everything. If Digital Relapse, or whatever, showed them this final trash emulation of the games and they said "Yeah cool, ship it." that's their fault. If they didn't go to Midway before finishing it, that's again Midway's fault because they didn't get it in their contract to make sure a quality game was being produced. There's no way around it, I blame Midway and you should too. They lie, cheat, and steal, and even if they get caught, they still get away with it? Too much power in my "opinion."

Matt

I got my copy of MAT2 today, and I have to say the flaws in MK2 and 3 didn't really bother me as much as they seem to bother everyone else. Then again, being a Nintendo loyalist I only got to play MK2 at home on SNES so it's a massive step up for me.

One thing that puzzled me, is the Down+start thing for Smoke the only thing missing? I got the "ohhh-waa" thing when someone gets knocked into the dead pool to work, so some of the little extras are still there. Could it be that start pauses the game (on the Cube at least) and the remapped the Smoke code to another button?

As far as the analysis of other MK games goes, I actually agree that MK4 is just not up to the standard of previous games. MK4 was pretty much a test dummy to see if MK would translate to 3D, even a rudimentary 3D like it had.

However I don't see how the gameplay is broken in MK:DA....every MK game has had characters that are extremely weak (remember Reptile in MK2?) and characters that are excessively strong (either by move power or cheapness potential).

Matt, Im interested to hear about the 4 characters you are referring to here (Im not being a smart ass, Im just interested to hear!)

For my money, MKT was the best 2D MK, just on the basis that nearly every single character was there, even the MK1 versions of Kano, etc.

I know there are plenty of problems with MK2 on MAT2 but I like it mainly for the nostalgia I guess. And I have never really gotten into the MAME thing on PC. I really enjoy the fataltities of MK2 as well because they were still in the MK1 vein but things started getting a bit more ridiculous in MK3 (though Im a total sucker for Sheeva and Nightwolfs finishers).

Overall, I like the step that MKD has taken beyond MKDA (though the fighting system should be refined and I would like to see more characters but again thats the MKT in me talking)

Peace!

I'm curious about the broken MK:D people/moves as well. I guess I should look in the MK:D forum, but honestly I just don't feel like wading through all the posts. I like the relaxed pace of the good ol' classic forum.

Heh, I'm looking forward to finding out what's broken, and then pissing people off online.

you guys are pathetic. first off, you want a game, that was never meant to play properly on anything else other than its own arcade mother board, to play perfect. well on a computer it is possible because computers is how the game was made. but if you dont have a good comp, game will still not run right. i own a dedicated mk3 arcade machine, and i have all 3 mk boards mounted in it. i just switch the jamma harness and controller connecter. so guys, i own the real deal, i know them isnside and out. as for emulating them on home consoles? xbox does the best at emulating them, the others fall short. why do the games have the bugs? because your xbox ps2 gamecube does not have the power your comp has. the game is a source code never meant to run on these systems, and it requires tons of memory to bounce it around to get the right speeds and sounds. they did a hell of a job in my opinion. they never released arcade emulated versions on psx or other simply because not enough power. so, if you do own the arcade machine versions, you will know that in order to keep a great framerate without the chance of it falling greatly, they had to speed up both games a half second. trust me, this is why the bugs are there. i do simultanious comparing, like hitting start on my machine and the game at the same time. and the mat2 ends up running a bit faster as it loses sync. if you want these games to run perfectly on home consoles, then wait for xbox 2 or ps3 since the comp capacity will be much greater. remember, xbox was designed for xbox games. ps2 was designed for ps2 games. you damn crybabies know nothing of the electronic trade. and by the way, dont belive that i own a dedicated cab? ask me for a video confferance and i'll show you it on cam. also, if you own the arcade versions, why cry about mat2? it is the best home versions of each in their arcade format. wanna play an "arcade perfect" version? play your arcade and shut up!

No you shut up. They never should have advertised arcade perfect if they weren't willing to do what it takes to make them play arcade perfect. Don't tell me they can't, because they have the "money" to make it happen.

In any event, in MKD, the characters are Shujinko (Just way too powerful) Scorpion, Kira, and Bo Rai'Cho, at the moment have side step containment infs, or at least, Scorpion can waste a lot of time with his. Here's an example:

Kira's Stupid Time over inf

Matt

really? they have enough to just walk up to sony, microsoft and nintendo to say, hey we want to change your game system processors to meet our emulated arcade game needs. sorry to sound so rude, but we need you to make a better system. or else we'll cry. gimme a break , the system is the problem you jackass

I think the problem is that developers didn't develop it enough to run right on the system. Can't say as I blame them because they were probably planning from Day 1 for it to be a Value game starting at $20, which means a smaller investment on their end to start with. So they knew from day one it was gonna be incomplete, they just ran with it anyway, touted the quality they never intended it to have and thus pissed off a bunch of people around these parts.

Still, I wish they had done what they said they would. Its pretty simple if you think about it. They are developing software where there are no variables on the system it will be playing on. I mean, Mame was developed to run across countless processor, ram, video card, sound card and OS configurations and a P3 733 can run UMK3 at the proper framerate with sound in Win98SE. If mame had been developed for a single configuration, its power to emulate would have been enormous. Granted, Mame had the benefit of lots of hardworking folks that wanted to see it done, but Mame also emulates thousands of games, and Midway was aiming at only a tiny few, especially if you only count the ones that would mount any difficulty for them. They had the ability to do an arcade perfect emulation. They just didn't. As a result, people that purchased it feel the need to warn others and simultaneously vent their frustrations, and I think the healthies place to do that is here on an MK Message board where it is both on-topic and not physically threatening to others.

heres something to remember all you cry babies out there. the game its 20 bucks. and its not a game, its 20 games, each game a dollar. what did you expect after paying a dollar for mk 2 and a dollar for mk3? i dont know bout you, but i love narc, primal rage, total carnage, gauntlet 2 , champ sprint, i mean c'mon, those ar great games and they play fine. its just an emulation. its only 20 dollars. you'd probably cry if someone said, here, buy this ps2 for a dollar, and you didnt get a game with it. jeez c'mon guys grow up. its a value game. VALUE

So is Guilty Gear X2 #reload... and that wasn't exactly a slapped-together hack job, if you're familiar with it. Do you really want to reinforce the attitude that more money equals higher quality??

Riddict, you best quit being condescending to people around here or you're going piss people off with your "crybaby" and "you guys are pathetic" comments. How the hell do you get off acting better than all of us and acting like you know shit about shit.

Saying it's impossible for the current gen systems to run these games accurately is erroneous.

DreemerNJ and I were excited to hear about this title coming out originally because we knew it was theoretically possible to emulate anything up to UMK3 on PS2, which is the least powerful of the current gen systems I believe, with the knowledge that his P3 733 could run UMK3. That right there destroys any theory that the current gen systems aren't powerful enough. They run their own versions of games that require PC system specs beyond the universal 1ghz, which will run UMK3 on virtually any computer. The 733 example is a diamond in the rough instance, but the fact that it was possible at all means that a team working for money, could program a small emulator on one completely defined system hardware, to run MK2 and MK3...perfectly, but they didn't, and they deserve no praise whatsoever. Even if the games run what some people claim to be "perfect in terms of gameplay" which I'll never know unless the Prophet brings it over, the fact that it slows down, and the shadows flicker, sounds are missing, music overlaps, doesn't stop, stops randomly, sound is muffled, is all very unacceptable.

Again, I didn't buy it and I'm pissed about it. Imagine all the other people with expectations who did buy it. They probably feel disrespected and they should. So don't tell us it was impossible because it wasn't. There's nothing that can be said to refute the math behind these posts.

Matt

maybe you guys are just poor, and 20 bucks is you life savings. i'm sorry, i agree with the bugs, but to emulate on a comp is less complex than a system , since the game was created on a computer. computers were designed to handle many different things. my xbox was designed to handle xbox games. if they would have ported the games, it would have been perfect, but they emulated them. be mand that they emulated them in the first place. thats the problem, they should have just been nice to the fans and given us excellent ports. so yeah, you have a right to be mad, but not because it could be better, but because they just emulated it in the first place. but it's 20 bucks. just because you got it free for mame doesn't mean that all of a sudden 20 dollar game paks should be perfection. sorry, but most companies aren't thinking of their customers as people who already ripped the game for free, and are playing it arcade perfect on our mame's. i own all 3 pcb boardsets, and a dedicated mk 3 cabinet. i have the real arcade versions, and i'm satisfied with mat2. if i want arcade perfect, i'll play that, because if you have that, what more do you need?

What about the peeps that don't have MAME or the arcade? That's the whole point behind buying emulations or ports on consoles, because that's what most people have.

well if all you have is your consoles, then mk2 is the best home version you have ever seen. though mk 3 can be compared to n64's buggy and muffled sound MK TRILOGY. so its not the best home version. but definately the best animation. mk 1 is the best simply because snes would have been, had they left the blood in. so in turn, it does beat the genesis in my book. though i still love to play my sega cd version of mk 1

I agree with MK2KungBroken. I think that he should send a question to the MKO team that they would send to the MKD team during fight night.

I don't know how to say it, but it should be something like : will they make any other 2-D games, will they focus more on the gameplay in upcoming MK games etc.

You should just copy and paste your comments to the MK team on Fight night and it would be good. Your comments, despise the fact that I don't 100% agree with them(I bought MKD and I think the game kick ass) are very valid.

There is place for amelioration, and personnally I would not care if the next MK would have no fatality , less characters and would focus more on the gameplay. People would buy the game anyway.

However I don't agree, about your top tier selection.
Konqrr is convince that Liu Kang, Dairou and Hotaru are 3 of the most powerful characters in MKD, and he is a damn good player so it just contradict your list. + the 4 characters you mentioned, there is 7 tops characters in the game so I think that the game is balanced

The difference between top tier and broken ass tactics is what I'm talking about. I know who's really good in the game other than the ones who have specific tactics that will have to be banned in serious tournament play, if such a thing exists.

Matt