"The monster in Smoke's ending isn't his Enenra form, it's the demon the cult sacrificed him to. "

Said on Page 2, and seem's very "Matter of fact" to me, especially considering it's coming from the man who prides himself in knowing the in's and out's of the story. What further hammered that impression across was how adamant you were the Enenra was a seperate creature. You only made that theory speculative once Nephrite challenged you on it.

Had you not stated what you percieved the ending to be as something factual, the debate wouldn't have instigated. If a new member joined the site and said "That's Delia in Jade's ending" you'd have called them out and ridiculed them publically for it Razor, in fact you did so earlier. I see no reason why you should be exempt from the same logic.

So.....I think the ending an cyber subs ending are clues that cyber smoke is returning. THIS IS PURELY MY OPINION AND SPECULATION PLEASE DIT. GO NUTTY! Look if Kahn can invade cyber subs body, and smoke can turn into this shapeless cloud then he should also be able to posses the body. With quai liangs soul *presumably* gone and with the netherrealm, his powerful armor body is ripe for the picking, therefore I hope NRS uses the same logic to give us cyber-smoke

Not that I feel like jumping into this fight but I personally thought the Demon (with shape) in Smoke's ending was the Demon he was getting sacrificed too as well, for the same reasons Razor stated previously, it's not shapeless, shown on screen at the same time etc. but I can see where the other blokes arguments have merit, returned to the mortal realm as an Enenra, the Demon looks like an Enenra (although to me it looks nothing like any of the examples put forth) etc. I guess we're just gonna have to ask the c*#ts that made it so fuckin' confusing, fuckin' NeRdS, or wait for the next game for conformation because Smoke is a Demon by nature and Qrap Chit will lose control of him like he did Sareena, then the rest.

The fact that you still have no proof that the monster is Smoke that I find convincing is why it would be illogical to treat me the way I would treat someone who thinks that's Delia in Jade's ending when anyone can concretely prove it's not. The situations are not equal, thus neither can the responses be.

That and to truly succeed at treating me the way I treat others, you'd have to be, like me, a bitter, tired old man who's been on MKO since Deception came out, pines for the good ol' days when robots were purple and icemen had scars, and wants these damn kids off my lawn with their pants around their ankles and their hippity-hop music. I think Ninja Mime could give me a run for my money in the spiteful geezer department...maybe Crow on a good day.

Well that might just explain why you can't see the black animated clouds leading from the alter to the monster. You also had trouble seeing that cyber Skarlet is actually a red colored Cyrax.

Time to retire, Razor, before those cataracts start kicking in. ;P

I agree with you. I get the feeling that Smoke can probably possess other people. I thought this with his Smoke away move. What if he got stuck in another person while in this smoke form. It just makes me think that Smoke will probably possess Cyber Subz body. NO, I don't have a definitive reason why I think that will happen. I just think it's logical. I also believe that since they included dlc characters who weren't in the story mode canonically like Kenshi, Rain, and Freddy then they most certainly could have included a cyber smoke skin and it would have made them money. That is what leads to my conclusion that maybe they held cyber smoke off for a reason. Who knows though?

I also agree with Razer and Chameleon84 who think that the demon in smoke's ending is who he was sacrificed too. I think you guys got way too blown up over that argument though really.lol. Anyways I also agree with Chameleon84 that both arguments seem plausible, but neither can be taken with fact. Unless NRS personally comes out and says it's one way or the other we just don't know.

Good God NO!!! That would just be really shitty and demeaning to the character. He needs to stay Human, develop his Enenra powers and move away from Lin Kuei and Sub-Zero and become his own character and not be stuck in S-Z's [either of them] shadow again.

I just noticed there are both a Human-Smoke-4-ever and a Human-Sub-Zero-4-ever on these boards.

How awesome is that?lol.

Anyway. I hope cyber smoke does happen again. He's just going to become an enenra now anyway. He will look almost identical to deception smoke, so why not have cyber smoke show up for a little while? Again though Smoke isn't my favorite character so I don't feel it should be my place to say what form he should be in.

However, if Smoke staying human means Sub-Zero shows up as a cyborg again then make that mofo a cyborg again.lol. I don't want to see cyber sub-zero Eveeeeeeeeer AGAIN. (quoting chris jericho).lol

I was here first. I think they avoid making Smoke a Cyborg again. They ruined the character by making him Robo-Bitch and nobody can convince me they'll do him justice this time around [That's why I said previously that they would be on some hard drugs if they believe that Cyber-Smoke can do What Cyber-Sub did in his chapter]

I don't think S-Z regaining his human form should come at the cost of Smoke's. It was just prove that NRS have run out ideas.

I think Cyber Smoke can do everything cyber sub did in his chapter. In fact if they just copy past Smok'es name it wouldn't be that hard. I don't think they ruined Smoke by making him cyber either, I mean what did Smoke have going for him before that at all? He was just a hidden character in the game, and he was first originally playable as a Cyborg. That's why it's so much easier for me to see Smoke as a cyborg than it is to ever picture Sub-Zero being a cyborg forever. Smoke was and has been a cyborg up until this game. Sub-Zero has always been a human. Switching them up really accomplished nothing besides erasing one of the best stories of the old timeline, and subseqently taking any story smoke had going for him away. Notice that Smoke is getting turned into something else now too. He was first a robot, and now he's going to become a demon. Why? Because grey ninja just really isn't that appealing. Especially with his hairdo. Again, not picking a fight. That's just my opinion of Smoke. He is rather boring as a human, and doesn't have that much to offer. That's why they turned him cyber in the first place, to give him something. Now he doesn't even have that tragic element because it was given to Sub-Zero, who didn't need it AT ALL.

NRS hasn't run out of ideas either, I just think they have some sh** writers on their team. They need a couple of people in there who , ya know, care about what happens. It seems like for forever they just really haven't cared about their characters. That's not how it should be either.

That footage had a motion blur! It looked like Cyrax with tits!

No, but seriously, my vision is fine and they're black fucking clouds on a black fucking background, I just don't believe that you can see them connecting from the monster to the altar, I think you're assuming they do, mentally filling in a blank, because they look close.

Even though there's pretty much nothing interesting about Shitstain #3 now, him being a Cyborg again would be great. How or why? That would require some thought, but I guess he'd probably have less of an importance than in the Old TL. And his whole story would have less substance than the original did, since there wouldn't be much of a focus on the cyber initiative, and his role helped fill in the major(? + for lack of a better word) angles of that storyline in the first place.

Doing so would be nothing but fan service, and while they're at it, they can bring back the rainbow ninja and gray ninjette.

I have to agree with HumanSmoke4Ever... Neither one of them should have to be sacrificed to be a Cyborg.
The idea of Smoke possessing Cyber Sub-Zero is pretty lame. No offense...

Nah no offense taken.

Personally neither should be automated, because neither fanbase likes the idea of either one being automated. I would be fine with Hydro being an option of a cyber character, but I don't know if they will ever add him.

On the other hand though, I just don't see how far Smoke, as a human, can go. They are always changing him. He was first a cyborg, and then a demon made of nano-bots, now an enenra. He just doesn't fit the human role very well, and like I said I think it's because Grey ninja just doesn't sound very appealing. Grey anything isn't very appealing because it's just dull, like smoke's character.lol.

Really the idea of Smoke taking on Cyber Subz body wasn't my idea anyway. It's been suggested by many people on the net that this is what could happen. Would it be great? Nah, probably not, but it's a way to get cyber smoke back.

Honestly, I do like Cyber Smoke though. I won't lie. He's my number 3 only behind Sub-Zero and Jade. I love him as a character. I loved the struggle between good and bad in deception, how he wanted to help his friend, but couldn't because he was ordered otherwise.

I wouldn't like him if he took cyber subz body though, mostly because I don't like the look of cyber subz. He's my least favorite design of all of the cyborgs. First, he looks feminine to me, which has been discussed before. Second, the head of the thing doesn't just resemble predator, it looks exactly like predator. Third, anything associated with the abomination known as cyber subz wouldn't set well with me. Which is why if Cyber Smoke is introduced I wouldn't want it to be in Cyber Subz body. That doesn't stop it from happening though.

However, it would answer the question to why cyber smoke appeared bluish purple in color in the old timeline.lol. If it comes down to it though cyber smoke shouldn't happen because his fans don't want it. Plain and simple. Just like sub-zero fans should have the option to choose how sub-zero is presented, and it's pretty clear we have expressed we prefer him as a human.

I don't think we need any convoluted ways for Smoke to somehow end up in Cyber-Sub's body or be captured and automated by Sektor in MK10, it's just too late for him to become a cyborg in the new timeline.

What I would like to see in a future game is someone do the smart thing and realize "Raiden's attempts to change the past only made things worse. We need to go back in time and undo his mistakes." That would solve a LOT of problems with the new timeline, for instance, making it so that their deaths never occured in the first place is a WAY less cheap method of bringing characters back to life than resurrection is.

Either that or I'd like to see a REAL reboot/remakes, meaning start over at MK1 again but this time don't make the fact that things have gone back to the beginning an actual part of the plot with convoluted shit like time travel, just BAM, "here's a remake of MK1, the ORIGINAL MK1, the way it happened the first time, but with modern graphics and gameplay" just like the Final Fantasy and Resident Evil series do.

I'm not saying either of those things should be MK10. Clearly it's way too soon for that, let NRS tell their damn "Shinnok with an army of corrupted good guys" story first. But, y'know, a few more games down the line when people get bored of MK like they did when Armageddon came out...or the retellings of the old timeline could be side-games in a non-fighting genre like how Shaolin Monks was supposed to be a retelling of MK2. I've said for years and years that I think MK3 should be redone as an RPG since the plot almost entirely consisted of the characters traveling the world and forming a party.

To do the whole back to MK1 plot again would be concrete proof that they are completely bankrupt of any creative ideas and just whoring out the series. To have to reboot the series again would mean that its high time to put the series to rest. They established their status quo with this game. Let them fix it within their new continuity.

That's not how franchises work.

You don't ever put anything to rest. One does not simply stop writing stories about Superman or making Mickey Mouse cartoons or Super Mario games. They're essentially immortal. Our great-great-grandchildren will know who these characters are long after we are dead.

And it's highly likely they will know who Scorpion and Sub-Zero are as well. Though the versions of Scorpion and Sub-Zero they learn about will probably be significantly different from ours...especially since, given the way copyright law works, Mortal Kombat will probably become public domain somewhere around the time we all die of old age, meaning anyone can do anything they want with it, for profit, without paying Warner Bros. for permission first.
And note that Superman's origin has been rebooted or retconned-in-entirety...at least five or six times just during my own lifetime alone.(Which is really bizarre considering it's the most well-known superhero origin there is. Why would anyone possibly need to read a new version of "alien scientist sends his baby to Earth to survive planet blowing up, raised in Kansas, becomes sun-powered goodguy"?)
MK WILL reboot again. It's inevitable. It's just a question of how many years it takes. The first reboot took 19 years to get to. I'm betting the second will come sooner, if my experience with the way WB has run the DC universe is anything to go by, the lifespan of a fictional universe they own gets shorter and shorter before it's scrapped and restarted again each time they've done it.
Hell, Movie series have an even faster turnaround than comics do, you only get to make, on average, three films before they restart. Look at Spider-Man. Batman got four the first time, but probably really shouldn't have, and Dark Knight Rises will be Nolan's third and after that, he's leaving the series and they'll reboot Batman. Hulk was rebooted after only one movie...though that was 'cuz the first one was completely awful and the property changed hands to another studio...
And video games come out about as often as movies do. 'Course, reboots aren't common in the game industry, but Devil May Cry did it...and it was after...what, three? Four? Remakes, on the other hand? Where they make the exact same game but in better graphics? Game publishers make those all the time. It's just a matter of time before MK1 thru 3 get an HD Collection treatment or be done in 3D. And when they do, all I'm saying is, I'd like to see a story mode conjured up to go with 'em.

I think it's safe to say though that for the foreseeable future we have Human Smoke and Cyborg Sub-Zero. Cyborg Smoke doesn't even exist in this timeline anymore, so it's unlikely he'll even appear as a Cameo or DLC since he's a character exclusive to the old timeline. Even Meat, Hsu Hao and Chameleon are all still fair game in comparisson since technically we don't know if they exist or not in the new timeline, nothing's saying that they don't.

Unless Sektor decides he wants to continue automating Lin Kuei members now that he's Grandmaster, we won't likely see another Lin Kuei cyborg in the MK future, and in all honesty I believe the moment to further automate those members was lost after Shao Kahn's invasion.

The only other way Smoke could become a cyborg is if he ends up coming back from the dead only to sacrifice his body and humanity (again, after losing both to Quan Chi) to restore Sub-Zero from his artificial form by trading bodies. And at that, it would complicate things further since Sub-Zero is a Cryomancer and not an average human, so to exchange bodies could put him at risk of losing his Kori abilities if he took Smoke's human body. There would be too many plotholes, inaccuracies and fan complaints if they did try to rectify it.

Whilst it's certainly possible that Sub-Zero could somehow lose his mechanical body through the Elder Gods or sorcery, there's no alternative I can think of for Smoke to become a Cyborg that's not far fetched or remotely sensible. He doesn't exist as a cyborg anymore. I'm sure the cyborg version of him had it's fans but the sooner it's realised that he's gone, the better. Many characters were changed in this new timeline, and fans from Baraka, Shang Tsung and even to Reptile have had to cope across the spectrum with the consequences of those changes.

I personally miss the old Kitana, and how she managed to uncover the truth about her fallen realm, murder her evil clone and liberate her enslaved mother and kingdom, all whilst being a renegade member of Outworld Nobility and dealing with her best friend being contracted to kill her within the exact same time period as the old canon. The new Kitana? Still Kitana, but forcefed her leads to the truth by Raiden, discovered a sister she never had, had Kahn tell her the truth about her past, was locked up, saved, then was killed wearing a disgusting outfit with a wonky nose, and finally ends up a zombie. Do I still love Kitana though? Hell yeah. I might not like her changes but they're changes that were made well over a year ago that I've just come to accept as a fan of the character. Smoke staying human is just one of those many changes people have learned (and are evidently still trying to learn) to live with.

When I said put the series to rest I meant temporarily. 5-10 years. The team has stayed the same since MK1 [minus Tobias' departure after 4] They need to add some new blood to the team.

God don't get me started on Comics. Especially that DCNU stuff. Just another excuse for Geoff Johns to retcon on an a Universal level.

I think its time to move Smoke away from S-Z and the Lin Kuei stuff [Ofcourse let Smoke and S-Z still interact in Story mode to that they will aways be best friends] and do his own things. Have him develop his Enenra powers and let him have a rivalry with somebody not from the LK. Move him out of S-Z's shadow and let him become his own man.

I don't think we need to do another switcheroo with Smoke and S-Z just so S-Z can regain his humanity. Raiden was able to convince the Elder Gods to resurrect Johnny Cage in a new body. So why not do the same for S-Z [though why he couldn't do that for Smoke when they realized he still had his soul is beyond me. More Raiden dickery I guess]

Smoke's always been Sub-Zero's shadow in some way. When not Kuai Liang's then Bi-Han's (Noob Saibot). Literally.
There is even a Japanese rock song called "Enenra"...
Trivia: The citizens of Prague also coincidentally smoke (or at least have been smoking) a lot of tobacco. The government controls people that way; the elderly citizens die sooner. It leaves more tax money. Smoke kills.

I don't think we'll see Cyber Sub-Zero ever replace the human counterpart. I realize he was in cybernetic form in the Netherrealm, but given that Sonya was wearing her MK9 costume in the Post-Armageddon intro, I don't think we can derive probabilities from such things.

I was hoping he'd remain a cyborg (mostly as a experiment to see who was REALLY committed to the idea), but now that I use him as a secondary in the competitive scene, I've changed my mind. I don't want to build a gameplan around that stupid dive-kick. I ain't worried, though. More than likely, Cyber-Sub will go back into the same attic toy box as Devolved Reptile and Two-Legged Motaro.

I think, and hope, you're right TemperaryUserName. I'm sure you're right on your theory that Cyber Subz little devotees would start falling like flies if they thought that Human Subz was gone for good.

I know I'm late to the party here, but to all the Smoke fans out there, especially the ones who differentiate Cyborg from Human Smoke as if they're two different characters, didn't you guys find Smoke's story boring before the reboot? Seriously, this is what happened pre MK '11...
MK: "Here I am, hanging out with Kuai Liang, while Bi Han gets the invite to the tournament. Man, I hope something interesting happens..."
MK2: "Sweet, I get to fly Sub-Zero to a mission and watch him fight in the tournament! This is awesome!"
MK3: "Grandmaster, Shao Kahn plans on killing us all! Hey, Sektor, love the new look... No, it's not for me, thanks... Wait, where are you putting that probe?! Let me go you- NOOOOOO- Obey the Lin Kuei, kill Sub-Zero. Obey the Lin Kuei, beat on Shao Kahn's minions. Obey the Lin Kuei, get my ass handed to me and brought into a jail. Obey the- I STILL HAVE MY SOUL! NOW TO FIND A WAY TO GET OUT OF THIS PRISON!"
MK4: "Damn, you'd think being able to teleport and become invisible would've been useful in staying out of jail. Oh well, I'm sure somebody's going to find me soon..."
MKDA: *rocking back and forth* "Any minute now... Any minute now... Entering sleep mode due to inactivity."
MKD: *Noob Saibot pops Smoke's chest open* "Hey, what're you doing? Where're you putting that probe?! NOOOOOO- Obey Noob Saibot, create Cyborg Demons."
MK Armageddon: "Obey Noob Saibot, create Cyborg Demons. Obey Quan Chi and Shinnok, create Cyborg Demons. Obey- Sub-Zero, my one true love, you saved me! At last we found each oth-" Stabbed to death by random opponent during Pyramid scheme.
This is the beloved Cyber Smoke that everyone loves and misses? Since his introduction, he spent one third of the series in a prison, another third as a slave, and barely a third with the freedom to think for himself. Honestly, I'm glad that Smoke stayed human, at least we won't have to deal with that sad excuse for a story again. Yeah, sure, now he's dead, but odds are he'll come back, sooner than he did between MK3 and MK6.