Why? How so?



That can be said about any of the characters in the game and even more about some very specific ones (Mileena and Sub-Zero, for example) who were "a lot less" than Johnny Cage, imo.



And why not?

You just gave one good example of how she might be developed. And its not fair to assume she'll provide nothing of interest for her next role.



But, even though it might not be interesting to you, it can be for others. I think you underestimate the kind of character that Sonya is to the MK story and what she provides to the viewer. Her scenes are some of the "most human".



Also because Shang Tsung had already failed Kahn more than once, and Quan Chi was the one (this time around) who resurrected Sindel. He proved to be more "worthy" than Tsung, I guess.



I don't think they acted like idiots at all. They were all just taken off guard by her immense power.

I hate to be the guy that reiterates the fact that characters don't stay dead in Mortal Kombat but...

Characters don't stay dead in Mortal Kombat.


With having a physical plane devoted to afterlife like the Netherrealm, it really creates this sort of "revolving door" policy on death and lessens the dramatic impact of people dying. It's for this reason that watching the majority of the hero characters get slaughtered doesn't leave me with a "Cage and Sonya vs the World" type of feeling despite them being the only survivors at the end of this game. Besides, having a bulk of the characters "dead" provides opportunity to introduce characters from post-MK3 while allowing enough wiggle room to cherry pick from the "dead" character roster.

If we're speaking strictly contextual, I thought the story flowed well enough and like queve mentioned, ending with the same characters the story began with fit rather nicely.

While there is no way to know why Sonya and Johnny survived, I speculate they have yet-to-be-fulfilled actions and story arcs that directly tie into whatever the NRS writers are planning for the next game's story. The impression I got is that those who died had their core story pretty much told in the course of the game, and NRS just didn't have any plans on how to build on it without having to dramatically alter their states of being like this - Thus, they die, and now, if they are to return, that becomes their new story and adventure. So I essentially think Sonya and Johnny will have some important tie-in to the next story, and their actions may more directly impact the coming conflict, whereas this game was more of their "intro" and build-up to what they'll be doing next.



Sonya being established as "the hot blond" should surprise no one, especially with the extra emphasis they put in sexuality in this game. From the moment I saw Mileena's outfit way back when, I knew Sonya's "blond bombshell" thing was gonna get played up more than ever before. I personally am for it, since her looks are a big part of why I'm a fan.

Johnny hardly "kicked the shit out of her". To believe that the bone-breaking and organ-rupturing action that goes on during the gameplay is anything close to canon is ridiculous. Only the before-and-after cutscenes are canon, obviously. Not saying this is what you did, I'm just trying to point out that there's nothing in the story that I think should lead you to believe he "kicked the shit out of her". She was obviously fine and unhurt, and was seemingly knocked on her side at some point in the scuffle. Johnny's following line of "not bad for a girl" is definitely sexist, but I think that speaks more to Johnny's personality in the beginning of the game than what NRS thinks about female fighters in their games.

I think that in terms of her "toughness", she was more or less portrayed as hot-headed, and as believing that beating people's asses is the best way to solve any problem. That's pretty accurate to me, especially when you consider this is early Sonya. I want her to be extra rough around the edges in the beginning, because I know she grows a bit softer as time goes by (and this story showed that she's headed down that same transition).




"She's human and has a vagina! Guess she's a weakling?"

Is that somewhere in the ballpark or did I misinterpret anything? The assumption that Sonya is one of the weakest characters in the game can't possibly be based on anything other than the above, given that she's constantly shown to be otherwise. I fail to see how, especially in such a far-fetched world like MK, a penis is synonymous with great strength. Likewise (though maybe in a lower level), Johnny's initial immaturity shouldn't be strong enough reasoning to support him being a weakling as well. Acting like a bad-ass or totally serious and focused are just types of personalities, not a gauge for strength and usefulness.



This reads to me like personal dislike of a character coated in a sensible manner of speaking. Something like the opposite of trolling. You don't provide anything solid to back up why Sonya can't possibly bring anything good to the story as a character, so I can't assume anything other than you're not a fan and you're going "Damn it, wtf", especially when you consider Johnny to be so much more deserving, given the fact that he was portrayed as incredibly childish and detached for a large portion of the story.

We have two characters who haven't really been all that developed as characters. You had brought up Johnny Cage's MK: Armageddon story. Even though I liked his bio, it doesn't change the fact that such development was about 4 games too late. We should have had that sort of step up for him in MK3's story. Basically, Johnny Cage and Sonya are practically in the same kind of roles they were in before. This is especially true for Sonya. Had Sonya and Johnny Cage (or at least Sonya) been amongst the undead, you'd probably feel much differently.



Like I said in other threads, most of the characters were ruined. They actually did a much better job with characters such as Stryker and Nightwolf, which is kind of ironic. Mileena and Sub-Zero defintely got bad treatment, especially Mileena!



You don't understand, queve. She can definitely have a story in the next game, but as a character, what is she going to deliver? It's very similar to her story in MK: Armageddon where she has a new enemy to deal with yet there's no reflection during her time under Onaga's control. We get that with Jax's MK: Unchained bio where he's really pissed off (and rightfully so).

You say that I underestimate the kind of character Sonya is to the MK story, and I still think you overrate her. This isn't to say that she can't be good. It's just that she's more or less stuck as being the same as she has been without stepping up like Jax or even Johnny Cage. By no real means was she bad in this game, and I wasn't really having some kind of high expectation for her. Like I said, with someone such as Sonya, it would have made more sense to have her bitter and distrustful of Raidumb like Liu Kang was. Even though Johnny Cage got pretty good treatment by being portrayed well enough, he and Sonya are pretty much the same as they were before.



Quan Chi's presence in the story mode was even more bullshit. They took away what made him a distinct villain for the series, namely that he's subtle and in the shadows. Shang Tsung should have been the one dealing with Shao Kahn more than Quan Chi. He should not have been taking part in the tournament, and Raiden should have noticed Quan Chi wearing Shinnok's Amulet, especially since Raiden did make a reference to Bi-Han's actions in MK Mythologies: Sub-Zero. That should have been an instant red flag to Raiden, but since he's now (and perhaps forever) been replaced by Raidumb, God of Blunder, it was completely oblivious to him.



Um, no...They outnumbered her, and they have special powers like she does yet Nightwolf was the only one to use his special powers. For doing so, he was successful in taking down Sindel. The others charged like fucking idiots and attacked her as if they were amateurs. I mean, especially in Smoke's and Sub-Zero's cases, they are supposed to be well-trained warrior assassins for fuck's sake!

Basically, if we were to take your explanation as being true, I guess you could say that they were taken off guard by her immense power that they forgot to use their own powers. Instead, they decided "Hey. Let's not use our powers. Let's just go up and attack her one at a time!". Then, you have Nightwolf thinking "Wow. At least I still have my intelligence.", only for him to do something significant.

EDIT:

To Leo: Sonya isn't really a bad character, per se. She just suffers from stagnation just like Johnny Cage did. It wasn't until MK: Armageddon where he actually steps up, but like I said, it's 4 games too late. I'm by no means a fan of Johnny Cage even though I was amused by some of his lines in the story mode. I wouldn't say that he's much more deserving than Sonya.

What I was trying to get at before with Johnny Cage was that it would have been cool to see dynamics with him where we see that inner seriousness to his personality. This should have been most evident during the MK3 timeline. I'm saying that Johnny Cage is more deserving than Sonya is because there's that dynamic to him that could be touched on.

Going back to Sonya, she can be good. In fact, I actually like her....in MK: Rebirth/Legacy. Kevin Tancharoen took Sonya and made her into a believable, competent character that can be taken seriously. The problem is, the chapter format of the story mode doesn't really allow for deep dynamics for really any character. It's not really dislike that I have for Sonya. When it comes to someone like Moloch, then we're talking dislike for a character.

My problem is with the praise given to Sonya to be made out as better than she actually is. Even though people are entitled to doing so, I just find a bit annoying, so that's kind of where the negativity stems from in addition to Sonya's stagnation. But like I said, I like the way Sonya is done in MK: Rebirth and Legacy. One positive I can say about Sonya is that at least Raidumb's idiocy didn't really rub off on her like it did with some of the other characters.

I'll tell you one thing that pissed me off about the story mode was how there was no battle between Sonya and Kano in MK3's timeline. That could have been epic had it been done.

But going to your question. Why do I feel Sonya isn't deserving? I feel that we would get more of the same from her, namely that she'll have new enemies to fight, but she'll still be the same brash, hot-headed character that she's been more or less established as. I think Sonya could become better, but I don't see that happening.

I agree with most things you've said.

Hopefully you are right in your points concerning Johnny's and Sonya's roles in the future. I'd love for that to happen. With any luck, the next story-mode will play a lot better than this one (overall design of how the story is played out)

Excellent post, Leo!



Johnny's development was late, true, but it finally arrived and it came with a huge glorious BANG!!!. So, why not just be happy?

It's here and it's very well done. Considering Johnny is one of the main characters and that he is still around, I think this should be looked at in a positive way instead of being negative about him. He's very likely to return, so, this is good.

Scorpion and Sub-Zero (granted his story is good, but, even if it wasn't it wouldn't matter) always get the pass and the pat on the back just because they are the team's main favorites.

And fair points regarding Sonya, but, still, she is not as uninteresting as you seem to make her out to be, nor as overrated as you say I make her out to be.

From what we got in this game, Sonya and Johnny were both truthfully developed. They are who they are supposed to be and their journey in this game seemed just like the middle of their arc. Sonya started off super tough and harsh and hot headed and went to being trustful and even emotional at the end. Sounds pretty solid and well done.

Her development is not done yet. Neither is Johnny's.



Reminds me of Scorpion, yet, he goes by untouched for being the ninja, Scorpion.

She definitely has delivered and she can deliver. Hopefully the team will take notice of how she is "stuck in the same boat" and give her the twist she needs to appeal to the people who feel about her the same way you do.

I agree with you that she's definitely "stuck". What I don't agree is putting her so down because of it, because in all honestly, its not bad at all and there are far worse cases within the "most popular" of the cast.



Sonya is extremely loyal and has powerful instincts. We've seen this before. She obviously saw something in Raiden that didn't make her act the way Liu did, something that didn't make her go all bitter like Liu. How is that wrong? How does it not make sense for her?

Same way she saw something in Frost. She was the only one who distrusted Frost and immediately rejected her.

My point is: Sonya not acting like Liu actually does make sense for her. I don't think it matters either way, though.

I still think you underrate her and this is kind of nitpicking, imo.



Fair points.

I too would have prefer Quan Chi more in the shadows and definitely NOT in the tournaments. However, I was pleasantly surprised for the most part.

And good catch on the amulet part. I guess they didn't stop to think about that detail during the story mode. They used the costume they designed for him and forgot to remove that. Yeah, kind of stupid when you think about it.



OK, fair enough.

You are totally right that if Sonya and Johnny had died in the same way I would have been very disappointed and upset.

However, I'd still say that it's an epic and glorious scene, despite my disappointment with the huge number of super quick deaths.

Just watch, in MK10 Boon's gonna bring back the other heroes with the typical
"The Elder Gods cleansed our souls, we're ok now"

But, you've already established before (and many times) that you don't like or approve of Sonya's personality and attitude. You don't approve of her being hot-headed and brash. You don't like her like this because it doesn't resemble a realistic professional SF agent/fighter.

And I think that very dislike makes you feel like "she's not as good as people make her out to be" or as good as you expect her to be.

Why, you haven't even mentioned anything positive about the whole new background info and story we got regarding her father. You haven't even taken into account her rather intriguing and interesting ending full of possibilities!

* Her sufferings and loses affect her sanity.
* She leaves the SF and becomes a loner. She abandons the thing that seemed to be keeping her stuck.
* A mysterious apparition that claims to be her father appears to aid her.
* She's heading to confront the remaining of Kahn's forces by herself and this spirit.

It looks to me that Sonya's story is in serious development and her arc pitching up nicely.

Why no mention of this?

She suffers from being "stuck" (stagnation), I definitely agree with you there. And I most definitely agree that she can be better.

However, this is no where near as bad as you make it out to be. Sonya is, after all, an establish character in terms of attitude and personality. She's what she is and that doesn't seem to be likely to change, ever. You expect a kind of development/change that is really not necessary for her at all.

I'm personally very happy she's not portrayed in the way you'd prefer her to be portrayed. I sincerely am.

But, don't take me wrong I definitely hope to see a new angle to her inner twists. And her bio and ending do point to this. Don't you agree?

And yes, I totally agree that her epic fight against Kano was a HUGE fail in this game. Same thing about Mileena's entire story and confrontation with Kitana.

2 of the most disappointing moments, imo

QFT. Shang had the hater face when Shao Kahn commanded them to team up in battle.

I have to agree with sub-zero_7th. It was totally bullshit. Even with Shangs power how does she matches up with all of them.


They walked up and said please kick my ass because i forgot how to use my powers.

Stryker dies by one punch but nightwolf can get his ass whooped and still perform a fatality/hara-kiri on himself and sindel.

Johnny Cage is the reason alot of heroes died. If motaro would have killed cage then none of this should have happened.

What really grinded my gears was the fact Raiden doesnt know the rules Shao can't merge the realms unless won in mortal kombat.

Plus, how come the FIRST Raiden didn't see this in his amulet.

As for Sonya she really didn't get involved that much IMO i figured this Sonya doesn't effect the timeline in the story. Because jax was going to die anyway.

Johnny Cage and Sonya have every right to live but just one guy living kills off the heroes is just BS.

Put that one on Retarden. He did, after all, save Johnny.

Alot of loop holes in this game....

I completely understand the level of power Sindel had which is fine with me. But what isn't is that she just whooped everyone's ass like nothing. I understand they couldn't have a long battle for time constraints. But those who were killed by her should have been killed by other characters. Spread the wealth I say.

I don't really like the idea of Johnny Cage being the new "main" hero. He's always just been the funny/obnoxious guy which he's good at. Taking the mantle of the main is a big step and he shouldn't necessarily be that guy any more which would defeat the purpose of his character. I'm not saying he doesn't deserve it, it just doesn't fit imo.

Also I feel like they made Raiden seem kind of stupid with his decision making toward the end. He totally just broke all his morals by offering Earthrealm souls to Quan Chi.

Hopefully a good number of the cast come back. I read some where on here that maybe this time around Liu Kang accepts Kitana's offer and stays with her in Edenia post MK4. That would be an interesting idea.

No matter how much skill power or whatever jumbo you have. Three on one is overmatched when they attacks simultaneously, and actually know what they are doing.

Six on one.... if Sindel resorted to magic, it would have been more plausible.

Okay, can we discuss something for a minute?

First off, this entire thing is meant to prevent Armageddon yes? What exactly CAUSED Armageddon? The Elder Gods. They felt that Mortal Kombat was getting out of hand and that the kombatants were so violent, they could have torn the realms asunder. So, they placed the kombatants in a realm where they would all fight until they killed each other.

So what's the solution? Think about this process for a minute:
-Raiden prevent Motaro from killing Johnny Cage. Kills Motaro.
-Out of rage of Motaro's death, Shao Kahn transferred Shang's powers and souls into Sindel.
-Sindel kills 85% of the heroes. She dies as well.
-Quan Chi, in retrospect, obtains the souls of all the fallen heroes.
-Shao Kahn is defeated.

Now, we are going to step into MK4. As step in, what's different between this story and what happened originally in MK4?

The biggest difference is Quan Chi's new army of undead heroes. Previously, it was Shinnok, Quan Chi, Tanya, and Reptile. Their forces were fairly weak. But now? They have an army of powerhouses!

And that army of heroes will prevent Armageddon. How? What caused Armageddon again? The Elder Gods.

Shinnok and Quan Chi are going to destroy all of the Elder Gods with the usage of their new found army. Inadvertently, this will prevent Armageddon from taking place.

Raiden has set the steps in motion to destroy himself and the Elder Gods, and that is the only way to prevent Armageddon.

The heroes can easily be revived, especially with beings such as Ermac. But the destruction of the Elder Gods, THAT is the ultimate goal of this story.




Again, I have full faith the heroes will be back shortly after Shinnok succeeds in killing the Elder Gods. The heroes will most likely be revived, and then Shinnok and Quan Chi will be defeated themselves. Armageddon avoided.

i have to admit i was disappointed with raidens bargaining the heroes souls out of desperation i mean dude what right do you think you have to bargain the heroes souls?

i actually think johnny could make a good new main hero as we seen from his later bios and endings from MKA as we remember they were shaping johnny to be a better leader and hero seems he learned to take things more seriously but its not like he still cant be witty or silly its his personality and i think we need that with a main character liu kang was the typical hero with the typical hero motives he was basically like superman when it came to personality thats why i never surprised me he won every single tournament cause he was the chosen one :/
but with johnny id love to see him develop character show he can take things seriously when he has to. i mean at the end of story mode johnny showed he cared about his fallen friends he didn't crack a joke or try to lighten the mood he knew what the fate of the world caused.
also i noticed he has some faith in raiden, like when raiden suggested him and liu had to talk to the elder gods kang was against leaving the battle but johnny " liu remember? close as a shadow "

i also can understand everyones opinion of raidens choices being stupid but you have to remember he was working with flashes of things that were about to happen he never got a good heads up on the whole future

first vision kang beats shang tsung . ok thats a no brainer the chosen one has to win the tournament to save earthrealm from losing the 10th match

but that didnt work, he then sees lui beating shao kahn . ok maybe this time somone else has to beat kahn in order to change the future

what happened to sub-zero and smoke? well when raiden saw smoke about to be captured he saw a vision of smoke turning cyborg and since he was there wouldn't you have tried to save him? i mean he didnt even know sub-zero was gonna be at the outworld tournament. it just seems he did what he could with the slight future visions he got. but in the end he understood that in order to be rid of kahn for good kahn had to be punished by the elder gods so he would never come back, defeating kahn would have just delayed armageddon cause kahn would return but now he cant. liu kang was simply fed up with the bad outcomes that raiden was causing but its a price to pay to assure kahn doesnt cause armageddon we iether lose most of earths heroes or face armageddon by kahn

Well I'm glad they went extreme and killed all the good guys... problem is that Sindel does it which is disappointing... Kahn only kills one guy (Kung Lao)... Goro and Kintaro don't do shit besides fuck up Kabal... and poor Baraka, "Ass-kicked" should be his new name because he's just a punching bag in story mode and he dies the 3rd time you fight him...

@ Insider2000: Excellent analysis! Those are some interesting theories, indeed.

I actually hadn't thought of some of those things in that way (I should have paid more attention, lol). I think you are definitely on to something:



But, say, they succeed in killing the Elder gods and gaining so much power, what will become of the fallen heroes? And will Shinnok (or Quan Chi) become unstoppable?

I expect Ermac to do some cleaning and resurrections. Maybe even Liu Kang's spirit will accomplish this, but, nothing is certain.

Maybe Onaga will never come to be because something will be changed during the events of MK4-MKDA. Maybe Blaze will be destroyed? Maybe Onaga's egg will be terminated and never reach Reptile?



Great post, man.



You know, I see where you guys are coming from. I think it would have been more just/fair to have a more spectacular fight for the fallen heroes or have some of them die in different situations against different foes (who kept loosing like Baraka, Mileena, the Shokans, etc) and another small group die against Sindel.



Who knows, maybe Johnny Cage will be the main reason why Armageddon will be prevented.



Or maybe those who were killed should had put a tougher fight against her. I think thats everyone's main problem. I think it would also be mine had my favorites gone off like that. These characters are chosen heroes who can surely deliver more than just that.

However, I understand the idea, thought, and concept behind this particular scene. Just because we didn't see the heroes put a tougher match against her doesn't mean they didn't do it. This was all done to show Sindel's extreme power and the grave danger the world is still in.



I see what you are saying.

I like to believe that Johnny will grow and be developed to become a much more "serious" person who will only joke and fool around from time to time instead of almost constantly. Also, his egotistical nature will certainly be toned down maybe even to the point of disappearing. I wouldn't oppose to that as it shows deep growth in his character.

Johnny being the next main leader/hero is a very interesting concept. I can't wait to see if he plays a role similar to that of MKA.



Yeah, I was shocked and disappointed, even though I understand his reasons. He was, at the end, doing what he felt was right for everyone and not just a selected few.

Remember he offers his own soul as well.



Sindel is a badass.

But, yes, I agree that the other villains (who only fought to loose) should have probably gotten a few more.



This.

I agree with your thoughts.

And you are right, Johnny and Sonya were pretty much the only two who didn't loose faith in Raiden.

No queve... just... fucking no.
I can tell from many replies and posts, you're too easily impressed...

Sonya's gameplay is shit compared to MKvsDC, and they didn't fix her disgusting face from MKvsDC or her fat saggy tits.

I'm no longer a Sonya fan...

To be actually on topic, they spared Sonya and Cage so they can develop a stupid love interest in further expansions of the story. I'm losing respect for MK's story writers. I really, really am.

I think that Sonya, Johnny Cage, and Raiden are taking Liu Kang's Place as main characters

Im sorry you didn't enjoy it.

I personally had a blast despite some of my disappointments.

I might agree with that had this been any other installment, but this time around, it's pretty clear they intended to take their particular treatment of the females up a notch.

I already mentioned Sonya and the Johnny candy role she played in story mode. A complete disgrace to the character. So he likes her... Ok, wasn't establishing that for the second time sufficient enough? No, it had to be branded into our skulls over and over. W... TF?

So I was left thinking that this "prettified" Sonya was limited to the story mode. Uh... right. So I'm playing Challenge Tower, I fight Sonya for the first time, and of all the lines imaginable, what does Kabal say to her?.. "What? No kiss?"

She has become a joke! I'm sorry, and it pains me to admit it since I've always defended Sonya and admired her, but this new "soldier slut" vision of theirs is already on my last nerve.

What else am I gonna find? More kissy jokes in CT? Maybe some bikini pics out of the Krypt?

Glad you're having fun with all this, but I prefer respectable female characters that can be taken seriously. I know this is not new for her. We've heard kissy/girly jokes about her before and we've seen lifeguard pics or whatnot, but it felt like a side thing back then. Now, in this game, it feels much more prominent, as if it has become essential to her character in the same fashion as Mileena (not to that degree, of course, but still).

I really miss when they would emphasize her strength and personality like in MKA and MKDC. Now we can't even go a minute without how blonde and pretty she is being shoved down our throats, as if that's a crucial part of her worth. And this is only Sonya we're talking about. Don't even get me started on Mileena, Kitana, and Jade to further assert my point. It is beyond obvious that NRS has reached new levels in regards to portraying their women "differently."

Honestly, they were victims. The only reason why they lived was because Nightwolf took Sindel out and Sindel didn't hit them with any killshots like the rest.

Now, they could potentially be very helpful though. Namely in converting Ermac and Scorpion onto their side so that they can save everyone from the Netherealm invasion.


Plus, there's a bunch of outworlders left to help out as well.

That's more or less how I see MK10's plot going.

I'll be honest. Ermac can join the heroes. Especially if he DOES turn into King Jerrod.

Scorpion should never join the heroes. He can help them. He can team up with them. But when the battle is over, he leaves on his own. That's how Scorpion is.

I'm willing to believe chapters of the game may have Scorpion and Sub-Zero working together, but Scorpion being a part of a team of heroes?

Scorpion cares about his own issues. He would never join the team. And I'm fine with that. He may even fight the heroes should they get in his way. I will say that the next game will mostly likely use Scorpion, Ermac, Cyrax, and possibly Noob as allies. I find that believable.

As much as I like those characters I think they survived because they're not that important. It's far more tragic and poignant if Raiden saves Earth but loses the greatest heroes.

I think Cage and Sonya do need more story focus and they've been in the BG for a while so this is just a chance to give them some more focus like in the original movie.