"It doesn't make sense though. Someone who's seen blood, guts, torture, corpses, etc. throughout her life becomes hindered by some fatso who likes to fart and vomit?"
But how do you know it was that that made her quit the training? How do you know it wasn't simply impatience and unwillingness to put up with his childish behavior? You assume she said "Ewww, this guy's gross...I can't train with him." but how do you know she didn't say "I don't have time for this disgusting drunk...I'll do fine without him."

May be assumption either way, but which reaction sounds like the one a former assassin who's seen centuries of death, chaos, blood, and war would have?


"It still shows she's not "fiercely determined" as you said if she can't even focus on her training because she's too easily distracted and annoyed by his behavior."
So her not willing to put up with Bo' Rai Cho completely overrides everything else that shows her determination? Like I said, maybe she just decided putting up with Bo' Rai Cho wasn't worth her time. Was this the right thing to do? Probably not...but is she not allowed to make a mistake or show flaws?

Actually, you put Kitana down for never doing anything other than what a typical goody-goody hero would do...wouldn't the typical goody-goody hero put up with Bo' Rai Cho's childish humor and complete the training?


"What about her passionate heart? She'd sacrifice herself to save her friends. Who else in MK is known to be that passionately caring? Yeah, she's good, but to such extremes? That's highly distinctive of her and so deserves credit."
But that's thing....I don't find Sonya's passion distinctive. For me, that simply falls into the "tough" category." Sonya's aggressive, determined, passionate, etc. And what hero wouldn't sacrifice themself to help their friends?

You mentioned Kira...Kira doesn't strike me so much as a "tough chick." She seems much more like a "femme fatale" character. There is a difference.


"Is it OK if I ask you if you relate to Kitana in some way? I mean, do you find much of her in you?"
No...aside from maybe some broad things that can apply to any number of other characters.


"The problem is, Ed and John were *very involved* according to interviews. We might never really know how much, but they did say they gave opinions and approved the way characters were being portrayed and developed, etc. They were very happy. I remember in the EMG (spelling?) whatever Mag that John even stated they corrected some things and that the movie makers listened and took them out. And who of them was the one who said something along the lines: “The characters are exactly the way we always depicted them”?. I'm almost sure this was Ed."
I pray they were referring only to the first movie...because if they meant Annihilation as well, then we're ALL in bad bad trouble.

Well, I guess I'll just have to take your word for it that Boon made such an idiotic comment....although we've seen he's not above making his share of bullshit statements....but okay, I'll be fair here and admit the first movie wasn't too far off in terms of character portrayal. But let's also be fair and remember Kitana didn't exactly have a huge part in the first movie. Her role in that was simply this mysterious chick to drop vague advice to Liu Kang. It's wasn't exactly a showcase of who she is. Annihilation and cartoons still blew though...if the MK team was happy with that shit then I might as well turn and flee from Mortal Kombat now.


"Didn’t her role become more “the princess” then the “assassin” because that’s the direction her story *inside the game* went to? It all started with the end of Mk2, just look at her ending."
It did and I said that...what I meant was because of the movies some people forgot she was ever an assassin at all and that she was always the "princess" from the beginning. Even to this day, there are some people who, if you were to tell them Kitana used to be evil, would get confused because that's not how the movies/shows portrayed her. As I'm sure you've noticed, when I see that I feel a moral obligation to rectify this error.


"And wasn’t Kitana being that angry and full of yourself and evil just because of the spell? After that, she was normal."
I wasn't referring to her hammy spell act, I meant after she finds Jade dead. From then on until the end, she acts very hostile and angry towards Liu Kang & Kung Lao...which I suppose is reasonable, seeing as they stabbed her friend in the face.


What I think Sonya needs if she's to continue, if not development, is something to challenge her in a new way. Sektor may be a new challenge, but he's not going to challenge her in a new way.

I mean a challenge that will provide her with conflict or reveal something new about her. Forcing her to face an antithesis would do nicely...confrontingher with someone who represents her dark potential. I support Kira being this...but hell, if not her, run with Mavado...who had a decent bit of build up in MK:DA.

If not an antithesis....then turn Jax evil. I don't like Jax...but he could be useful here. Test Sonya's reverred passion to protect her friends by having her best friend turn on her.

To Subby7th

I will be getting back at you with a decent responce, I promise buddy.

You bring up a point about Sonya always kicking male butt or something along those lines. Well, with that said, it makes a rivalry with Kira even better, because it would be a change from the enemies she's been up against before. This time, there'd be a female enemy that she has to go up against, one whose skill and cunning could prove to be quite formidable. This could lead to Sonya becoming wiser and more evolved as a character. So when we get to the end of that rivalry, the story has come full circle with Sonya overcoming Kira.

Sounds nice. I like it, But I still find Kira predictable, if I it had to be one of the current known Mk females, I would choose Frost. That possible “rivalry” feels more interesting and unpredictable, and even better, it could take Sonya away from the Black Dragon business for a while.

And if we didn’t have to take some “logical” paths, I would even say something with Nitara (though I doubt it because if they keep her and Ashrah, she already has a lot of things to be dealing with) or Mileena would rock. With just a bit of creativity you have an unlikely pair or rivals either working together or the opposite.

If no female proves to be a match for the blond, I still say let her kick some male butt in that direction, Mavado could work very well, there's a lot of potential in this already established rivalry, despite it being so small and underdeveloped.

Yes, Sonya hates those criminal organizations and is determined to take them down. But the same can be said about Kitana wanting to take down Shao Kahn or even the Deadly Alliance. Sonya's struggle against the Tekunin doesn't have a sense of it being so personal unless you bring Jax into the mix. And quite frankly, I'm not interested in wanting Jax return. But even if both Sonya and Jax were to return and have a conflict, there still needs to be a progression of Sonya's character.

But, so what if the same thing can be said about Kitana? I know that, and I repeat, I didn’t make any comparison about the two in this aspect or underrated Kitana’s own struggles, so I still don’t understand why you keep saying that. Aren’t we both agreeing that both characters have their struggles and problems (no matter how you may feel about them or even if you think Kitanas are superior), right?

I ask you because it sounds like you think I said Kitana’s struggles aren’t as good or important or that she doesn’t have any. And I haven’t said anything of the sort in any post. And plenty of the characters have their own struggles in similar fashion like these two.

To Xia:

But that's thing....I don't find Sonya's passion distinctive. For me, that simply falls into the "tough" category." Sonya's aggressive, determined, passionate, etc. And what hero wouldn't sacrifice themself to help their friends?

It extremely depends on the kind of passion. “Passionate passion” doesn’t mean tough. Someone being “passionate” can have very little to do with that, even if the person is tough. Its got more to do another kind of strength. There's a lot more that goes into this.

You mentioned Kira...Kira doesn't strike me so much as a "tough chick." She seems much more like a "femme fatale" character. There is a difference.

Yeah, that’s kind of what I ment when saying she is more like a “tough” Nitara or Sareena. These two are like that as well.

I pray they were referring only to the first movie...because if they meant Annihilation as well, then we're ALL in bad bad trouble.

Then we are in bad trouble. But then again, we have never heard or seen them openly admit any sort of huge dislike, terrible disappointment, complain, or hate about the second film (which is obviously quite understandable so its unfair to reproach them for that).

So, my guess is they weren’t happy with many characters that were simply unexplored or underdeveloped or ruined like: Sheeva, Mortaro, Mileena, Rain, Jade, Scorpion, etc., but they already have/had a concept or vision of some characters that they perceive and distinguish in someway and that’s how they are developed (despite still being very underdeveloped in some way), like: Shao Kahn, Sonya, Kitana, Liu Kang, Rayden, Jax, Johnny Cage, etc. And sadly, it doesn’t mean we have to like it. That’s just the way they see their own game creations.

I was at least very very happy with their vision distinguishing Sonya in the second movie, though I missed the extreme toughness they gave her in movie 1.

Annihilation and cartoons still blew though...if the MK team was happy with that shit then I might as well turn and flee from Mortal Kombat now.

LOL. Like I said, I doubt they were happy with MKA. But as for the cartoon, I deeply think you are underrating it. Sure, its not among the top 100 best cartoons ever and it might ruin Kitana for the way she is perceived, but its not that bad either. It obviously lacks the intense passion the real mk story has, but it did played quite nicely with most of the cast and it was fun, I actually enjoyed it a lot. There are many memorable scenes and character portrayals imo, even if a few others suck badly.

As I'm sure you've noticed, when I see that I feel a moral obligation to rectify this error.

Very understandable.

What I think Sonya needs if she's to continue, if not development, is something to challenge her in a new way. Sektor may be a new challenge, but he's not going to challenge her in a new way.

I mean a challenge that will provide her with conflict or reveal something new about her. Forcing her to face an antithesis would do nicely...confronting her with someone who represents her dark potential. I support Kira being this...but hell, if not her, run with Mavado...who had a decent bit of build up in MK:DA.

If not an antithesis....then turn Jax evil. I don't like Jax...but he could be useful here. Test Sonya's reverred passion to protect her friends by having her best friend turn on her.”

I 100% (though I still say Frost would be a million times better then Kira any day) agree with this. This is exactly what Sonya needs. Her story is always moving, but its time to see her soul, mind and heart get some new action, even if it doesn’t move her away from her business.

Ok, queve, I didn't really read all your first answer to my post because I know we will just agree to disagree. However, Sonya irritates the hell out of me and I am certainly not in denial about it, so if you don't want to hear anything but your usual "SONYA ROCKS, SONYA ROCKS, SONYA ROCKS", don't read the opinion of a person who admits to be badly biased against her. I don't run around the boards shouting "SONYA SUCKS, SONYA SUCKS, SONYA SUCKS", btw. I just expressed my view in the proper thread. When I say that I try to be rational, I mean that I can tell the difference between what I simply dislike and what I consider a real flaw. And the "you suck" bit refers to Shao Kahn's taunt, it does not mean that my word is law. You probably understood this, but, being the self-appointed knight of the order of the blonde bitch, you can't take a joke and call me delusional. Sonya, like it or not, is not a good character, because a good character can be admired even though you don't like it. If you are not fond of the blonde bitch, you can not honestly say she has an important role, a well developed personality or an amazing story. The fact that she is the only female hero for Earth only makes it worse. You keep saying that she rocks, she rocks, and that you can't mess with her: I say it is all fluff and no substance. I don't care if they call her a deadly weapon, as long as they portray her as a loser, she comes across as the typical dog (or bitch, in her case) that barks but doesn't bite.
On a side note, you keep saying that Kitana was rude to Bo'Rai Cho, but what kind of point are you trying to make? Even if we were to agree that Kitana was rude, as I said before, nobody claims that Kitana is perfect: are you really going to lecture Kitana for being rude once when your Sonya is rude by default and you, oh, like it so much?

Considering you touchingly failed to answer *everything* and still come off as a pompous biased who absolutely fails to make a decent point, I guess we will have to fallow your own advice and just leave it at “lets agree to disagree”. Oh, and after your ridiculous: “Sonya, like it or not, is not a good character, because a good character can be admired even though you don't like it” , are you honestly going to keep saying that you don’t imply that your word is law? Just because *you* feel that way, it makes her be whatever *you* want her to be? I didn’t know *you* had to admire a character *you* didn’t like in order to make him/her worth *everyone else’s* time. Either type clearly what you are saying before contradicting yourself or just think before typing or simply make some sense/logic.

“You keep saying that she rocks, she rocks, and that you can't mess with her”:

No I don’t, absolutely not in that way you imply. You should actually read the posts before posting and before making this sort of silly statements. I, unlike you, have talked about her positive aspects as well as the negative, I haven’t given any “she rocks” without actually getting deeply into the “why” or “reason” of it. I haven’t said once “she rocks just because”, so stop putting words I never said in my replies. Now, if you fail to see anything positive because you are utterly biased and disagree, that’s your problem, so you shouldn’t imply people say “she rocks” just because, and have no reason. Just because *you* don’t see them or accept them, doesn’t mean the rest of the world is wrong and that you are right.

“I don't care if they call her a deadly weapon, as long as they portray her as a loser, she comes across as the typical dog (or bitch, in her case) that barks but doesn't bite.”

LMAO!!!!

“On a side note, you keep saying that Kitana was rude to Bo'Rai Cho, but what kind of point are you trying to make? Even if we were to agree that Kitana was rude, as I said before, nobody claims that Kitana is perfect: are you really going to lecture Kitana for being rude once when your Sonya is rude by default and you, oh, like it so much?”

Lecture Kitana?????..........Will you read the thread before making this dumb question? If you are capable of paying attention, you will see and hopefully understand what was actually being discussed by ***everyone****.

“and call me delusional.”

Why keep saying stuff I never said? There's a big difference between saying you are biased and *just* saying you are delusional...but if you took it that way, maybe, probably, likely, there's no difference at all, and that’s not my fault.

And as a side note, after your stupid “thong” statement among other things, can you blame anyone for not taking you seriously?

“so if you don't want to hear anything but your usual "SONYA ROCKS, SONYA ROCKS, SONYA ROCKS", don't read the opinion of a person who admits to be badly biased against her.”

“My” usual? I actually back up my opinions you know, no matter how much you care to disagree. Again, read the thread and do try to make some sense.

I don’t need to hear “the usual”, but it would be nice to read some sense if you are screaming the opposite. I will read whatever I want if I want to, and I will reply to anything that I disagree with if I want to as well, specially if such opinion is *biased* and comes off as a “I'm right you are wrong. My word is law. End of story. Period. Fin. I'm biased.”

You do realize we wouldn’t be having this conversation if you hadn’t implied such arrogance to begin with? Maybe it wasn’t your intention, by what you said in your recent post it wasn’t your intention to come off like an immature infant, but you did an awful job at all times.

You should already expect to hear people contradicting whatever you type if you are terribly blinded by whatever reason, but if you don’t like it, take your own little advice and use it for yourself.

“However, Sonya irritates the hell out of me and I am certainly not in denial about it,”

Fair enough. I can respect *that*.

Yours, sincerely:

“The self-appointed knight of the order of the blonde BITCH”

LMAO! Honetsly, probably the best thing you said in this entire thread.

So yeah, let’s just agree to disagree, if that’s alright with you. I can accept your utter hate towards the sexy tough blond bitch, its not a problem. But just like anyone would do with any character anyone feels it has potential and at least something positive in them, expect to hear great contradictions.

Yes, you may back up what you say, but your opinion after all is nothing but: Sonya rocks, she is the original, she is blonde, she is a tough bitch, she is dressed. Of all this, the only vaguely respectable thing is the last, and it is just a superficial and somewhat overrated thing. None of the rest can make up for what Sonya seriously lacks to be a respectable character; she is not the worst, but certainly the worst main protagonist. Parading around as if she were the queen of Earthrealm, despite her relative lack of importance and personal failures. To me, she is even more overrated than Scorpion, at least it took a horrible retcon to ruin him. And just look at his thread, it's full of bashing: to be fair, Sonya deserved her share of bashing, to point out her issues, so at least we heard some serious discussion, instead of "She's blonde".
I am not really a Kitana apologist, but she gets written off a lot: "just a princess", "looks delicate", "is a whore". Oddly enough, people say she is "stiffly formal" then point their finger and preach about "what a princess should wear". Why can't she wear a leotard AND be a princess?
I think you should bash Kitana more openly: sometimes it looks like you respect her, but you never miss a chance to call her "cheap whore" and you seem to be searching the storyline for "evidence" of the fact that she is "mean". You read too much in the Bo'Rai Cho episode: besides, what "maturity" was he showing, acting like a clown when his only successful student has just been murdered and he must prepare new students to face the murderers?

Why do people take the story so damn seriously?

They let Kano get away from Sonya millions of times so that her rivalry with him could continue. It's obvious. Simple.

Scorpion's revenge story has been stretched in the exact same way. So has Mileena's jealousy. Big deal. It proves nothing special about these characters.


Oh she can, but it just validates that she is a dull flower since this is the image the makers give her over and over. I mean what military commander walks around in a ballerina outfit?

Sonya or even the Queen would make more sense in that role.

Anyways, my point is that if you're gonna judge characters negatively because of bad writing, then you're just being ridiculous.

“Yes, you may back up what you say, but your opinion after all is nothing but: Sonya rocks, she is the original, she is blonde, she is a tough bitch, she is dressed.”

No, is not...and even if it were, whats your problem? If my opinion is very well backed up, you have to accept the fact that I like her character, who are you to convince me otherwise? Your opinion is biased crap, and the only thing you talk about is the negative, blinded, so what does that make you? Nothing good, I can already tell you that.

Think before you post, you seriously have a problem, and do try make some sense, will you? I have already expressed a million times that she is a great character with flaws, and I have spoken of those flaws I would love to see changed, so what the hell is your point? Go read the thread. If you are going to post, at least *know* whats being discussed and stop assuming crap that will help you in your discussion, specially if its fake.

You are being redundant and very stubborn. The only problem here is that *you* are still trying to force your view into us as if it were the “right one”. What makes you think you are so right? That’s its your opinion? Such ego and arrogance.

You have failed to answer to all crap you wrote that I silenced, you don’t even back up your opinions from a fair reasonable perspective, and its you the one who *only* says the opposite, which makes you an extremist biased, so how can we take you seriously? Specially if you go around contradicting yourself every second, and posting stuff like the one here (among other examples I already pointed out above) without even thinking:

First you say: “So, I'm biased as fuck”

Then you want to make everyone think the opposite: “I don't think it is a biased opinion.”

And then you lamely go and say: “Don't read the opinion of a person who admits to be badly biased”

Sad.

“Certainly the worst main protagonist”

That’s subjective. You are being “queen of the universe of opinions” yet again. And there's plenty of impartial story lovers that would contradict your statement in a blink. You don’t really know the depth of the story and certain characters, do you?

“Parading around as if she were the queen of Earthrealm, despite her relative lack of importance and personal failures. To me, she is even more overrated than Scorpion”

Kid, go read a book or something. She is a videogame character, and you are way too obsessed with hating her as if she were real that its not even funny anymore. There's a world out there, and there's no Sonya to “irritate” you.

“I think you should bash Kitana more openly: sometimes it looks like you respect her, but you never miss a chance to call her "cheap whore" and you seem to be searching the storyline for "evidence" of the fact that she is "mean".”

How old are you again? Four? Or is that too much?

Quit the dirty crap of saying words I never said in any post. Cheap whore???? I’ve only said what everyone agrees with in terms of the females outfits, but saying “cheap whore” in such unnecessary way its just your way of trying to find something else to cry about and to try to “back up” your decaying posts. If you are planning to continue a decent conversation, at least have the decency to be mature about it and stop making up stuff to “back up” your vague and truthfully empty replies.

As for evidence of she being “mean” and the Bo Rai Cho part, I will say it again: GO READ THE THREAD. You will find your answers there, though I'm starting to suspect you don’t even understand the discussion that took place *ages* ago.

Oh, and I find it hilarious that you claim not to be a Kitana apologist, because despite your Sonya, that’s the only character you talk about...And the only thing you have done is ignore or contradict or get upset about any negative view on your Kitana, so this makes you a hypocrite. And sorry, the little icon pic doesn’t help....at all: “Lets get the blond dirty because I don’t like her, but I'm not biased! And lets keep the princess clean because I like her, but hey, I'm not an apologist!” . LOL. That’s how you sound.

“And just look at his thread, it's full of bashing: to be fair, Sonya deserved her share of bashing, to point out her issues, so at least we heard some serious discussion, instead of "She's blonde".”

The only bashing that’s been posted, has come from you. And there *was* a serious discussion, a discussion that just happens to annoy you because you don’t like her and hate to see she is a great character with fans. Work harder if you want a serious discussion, one rule involves something about not making up stuff to make a point.

Because some people like to be emotionally engaged with more than mere pretty colors and costumes. Personally, I like something that can provoke thought and perhaps involve my attention span. Granted, Mortal Kombat is just a lowly video game, but it's story and characters...when done well...accomplishes this. If it didn't, I might as well go play some other fighting game....which more than likely, would have a far superior fighting engine.
Gameplay is crucial...but it's story/character that makes me really like the character. And costumes is merely icing on the cake.



Oh please. What does Jade wear? What does Sindel wear? Mileena? So, out of every character who wears a leaotard or less, it's Kitana who's the dull flower?

That doesn't mean you should take the story so damn seriously. I don't understand why people like you get upset when a "dead" character returns, for example. Big deal, big surprise.

If you prefer stories over action then I don't know what you're doing looking for it in a video game.


Is that why MKA came with no bios? Did that not show how unnecessary all those bios and elaborate stories are?

Most games as far as I know just come with some overall game story and a few details about the characters, unlike MK which elaborates like hell, so rethink what the icing is.


What are you saying? That because they all wear bathing suits that they all look the same?

We've discussed this before. My response to that was that even though they all wear bathing suits, they still obviously carry unique qualities or themes. Sindel... witchy goddess or dark queen. Mileena... regal and mysterious. Jade.... strong latina or strong ninja. But Kitana.... ballerina or lovely ninja? Not to mention her image in the movies and toon which was exactly the same, yet that still won't convince you that the makers have a soft, flowery idea of her image and personality, I'm sure.

Fine, queve, I give up on you. I tried to make clear that my feelings on Sonya are one thing, her problems as a character are another thing. I made clear that she is the only character I hate out of honesty because I didn't want people like you to simply dismiss everything I said with a "You say so just because you hate her", but such subtlety is lost on you.
"Serious discussion" is a discussion on subjects such as character depth, development, personality, and it is want we got now; before, in the thread, the biggest question was whether she could be considered a tomboy or not.
I don't want this to become personal, so that's it, but let me say that I consider you a troll. Goodbye and happy ass slurping on the bitch. EDIT. In the storyline analysis thread I found that queve shows off for being "the strongest" and "one of the very first" criticizer of Scorpion, even back in the day when people were "afraid" to attack him. Sonya and Scorpion have a lot in common when it comes to flaws: both are overrated fanboy material, both are trapped in repetitive storylines and have no depth (Scorpion used to, at least), so they can be compared. And if Scorpion is attacked for such flaws, there is no reason why Sonya should go unpunished. queve still has to make one valid point to deny the fact that Sonya is an overall poor character (a mediocre one at best) whose popularity depends on her fanboy potential. Almost every time he claims Sonya is "the best of the best", it is because she is the original female, wears pants, has blonde hair and a blatant personality. Most of these are not merits, but mere data. You can like this stuff, but you can hardly "claim" anything on it. I'm not making this up; just read his posts. He has zero credibility when it comes to Sonya: not only does he confuse a character he LIKES with a GOOD character, but he lacks honesty. He considers himself brave for "challenging" fanboys attacking a fan favorite, but when another person does the same thing with HIS OWN personal favorite, that person has "delusions" and is "ridiculous". His only reaction is mockery and insult. And, no, I don't need to work harder: unlike someone else, I can tell the difference between "character development" and "story development". Pointing out Scorpion's flaws is legitimate criticism, of course; Sonya's flaws (the same as Scorpion's) either don't exist or magically don't damage her. And he talks down to me. He is the last person who can talk down to anybody. Like Sonya, he has nothing going for him but fanboy-ism. To QueenSindel on Kitana's looks: while I very much disagree with your Independence of Fluff Theory, I think we can agree that the leotard is not the real issue. When people want to attack Kitana, though, it's like every wind blows for their mill. When the wind blows from north, she is this soooo typical fairy tale princess; when the wind blows from south, she is some kind of sexual predator who REALLY should dress like a "proper" princess. Pick your choice, they can't be both true.

Awwww, how cute.

Fine, queve, I give up on you. I tried to make clear that my feelings on Sonya are one thing, her problems as a character are another thing. I made clear that she is the only character I hate out of honesty because I didn't want people like you to simply dismiss everything I said with a "You say so just because you hate her", but such subtlety is lost on you. "Serious discussion" is a discussion on subjects such as character depth, development, personality, and it is want we got now; before, in the thread, the biggest question was whether she could be considered a tomboy or not.

Well, you did a terrible job trying to make your feelings clear, it doesn’t seem like you even tried. You just kept contradicting yourself every 2 seconds with every post, so, that’s not my fault. And there *was* a serious character discussion, just because the last parts were about her being a tomboy or not doesn’t mean the rest should go unnoticed, but sill, since you are biased, you will utterly refuse to see beyond that, I'm sure. Again, if you don’t like her, that’s fine, but don’t expect everyone else to buy your word and consider it the right opinion and law. And I insist, some of your worst statements perfectly reveal you lack deep knowledge about the “serious discussion” aspects you claim to know so much. I don’t deny you have a pretty solid opinion and views, and you know about MK enough to identify who are the characters, but that’s as far as you go when biased.

I'm guessing that you probably wouldn’t make such a fool of yourself if you were a bit objective.

I don't want this to become personal, so that's it, but let me say that I consider you a troll.

I don’t consider you a troll, and luckily, I don’t feel defeated or have the need to insult you to feel better about anything.

It doesn’t have to become personal if you don’t want to, but you have a lot of growing up to do.

Goodbye and happy ass slurping on the bitch.

Why say goodbye and something such as “I don’t want this to be personal” if you are going to keep posting pathetic stuff like this?:

EDIT. In the storyline analysis thread I found that queve shows off for being "the strongest" and "one of the very first" criticizer of Scorpion, even back in the day when people were "afraid" to attack him. Sonya and Scorpion have a lot in common when it comes to flaws: both are overrated fanboy material, both are trapped in repetitive storylines and have no depth (Scorpion used to, at least), so they can be compared. And if Scorpion is attacked for such flaws, there is no reason why Sonya should go unpunished. queve still has to make one valid point to deny the fact that Sonya is an overall poor character (a mediocre one at best) whose popularity depends on her fanboy potential. Almost every time he claims Sonya is "the best of the best", it is because she is the original female, wears pants, has blonde hair and a blatant personality. Most of these are not merits, but mere data. You can like this stuff, but you can hardly "claim" anything on it. I'm not making this up; just read his posts. He has zero credibility when it comes to Sonya: not only does he confuse a character he LIKES with a GOOD character, but he lacks honesty.

OH MY GOD!!! LOL, that’s very funny...and pathetic, no offense.

I find it hysterically-amusing that you actually found the time to read “all” my posts and “thoughts” about “everything” I have posted in order to pretend to make a valid rational and of course, an un-biased statement.

You claim I ignore her flaws as a fanboy, I claim you are a dim-witted and predictable.

I have lost track of how many times I have addressed this issue and asked you to pay attention to what you try to read. I'm just wasting my time telling you to make some sense and read the thread, you are just too biased to even read the stuff that’s been posted with an open mind.

And I cant believe I have become this important for you, but then again, its no surprise. I could reply to all your desperate statements, but why waste my time? You have already proven in this very thread to post made-up statements to support your flaccid opinions, and refuse to reply to all the things I silenced from you. So, no need.

Don’t take it the wrong way when I tell you to grow up, again. You have some horrible immaturity issues.

He considers himself brave for "challenging" fanboys attacking a fan favorite, but when another person does the same thing with HIS OWN personal favorite, that person has "delusions" and is "ridiculous". His only reaction is mockery and insult. And, no, I don't need to work harder: unlike someone else, I can tell the difference between "character development" and "story development". Pointing out Scorpion's flaws is legitimate criticism, of course; Sonya's flaws (the same as Scorpion's) either don't exist or magically don't damage her. And he talks down to me. He is the last person who can talk down to anybody. Like Sonya, he has nothing going for him but fanboy-ism.


Look, I know you are desperately trying to make a point even though you have already fallen apart, so I will just let it rest, but I don’t promise that I wont eat you if I must continue.

Whats your point trying to lamely and desperately address to the world about the self-appointed-knight-of-the-order-of-the-blond-bitch? Are you going to open the eyes of the ones who are enchanted by my charms?:

“He is evil, he is bad, he is queve, he is a Sonya fan, what he says is this, what he thinks is that, what he feels is this, what he wants is that, he doesn’t know this, he claims to know that, he says this, he denies that, oh my God, my entire life depends on what his thoughts are and revolves around my Sonya-irritation”

That’s how you sound...seriously, how old are you again???

You are like a four year old telling mommy about the bad bully that abuses kids in school, when that bully doesn’t even exist, or is probably the kid who complains about it. You claim that I mock you, and that I have insulted you...try looking back and you will see that you alone brought it on to you and stop being such a hypocritical cry baby.

I have lost count of how many times I have asked you to read the thread, and obviously, you are incapable of even understanding the basics

To QueenSindel on Kitana's looks: while I very much disagree with your Independence of Fluff Theory, I think we can agree that the leotard is not the real issue. When people want to attack Kitana, though, it's like every wind blows for their mill. When the wind blows from north, she is this soooo typical fairy tale princess; when the wind blows from south, she is some kind of sexual predator who REALLY should dress like a "proper" princess. Pick your choice, they can't be both true.

“They cant both be true”?

Your creativity and imagination must be *very* limited and poor if that’s the case.

Woah, this has become a heated discussion.


Yes, the leotard is not the real issue. What is the real issue is how her appearance is themed and how her personality is severely restricted.

And I never said or implied that I thought Kitana was some kind of sexual predator. Mileena is the one who acts like a sexual predator, Kitana acts like sexual prey.

On Sonya, I think you actually are biased because from the start you blamed your dislike of every aspect of her on the whole "tough chick" thing. That makes you sound like you have a pre-set antagonistic mentality towards Sonya and characters like her.

You could have at least agreed that some sides of her personality were cool, like her passionate care and loyalty towards friends and allies, but not even that. Even her special moves. You said something like "And I don't give a damn about her legs, rings, or kisses." I mean, come on. That attitude shows you have a seriously close mind towards her.

My point is, you shouldn't be posting that you're discussing Sonya from 2 different angles: one from a personal-feelings angle and the other from an objective view of the character when obviously you're basing everything on your feelings for her.

You can hate her. That's absoultely fine, but the truth is, she is a fan favorite for SOME reasons. It's not like people like her out of nowhere. Whether you want to believe it or not, fans love her because of her distinctive, cool signature moves, eminent personality, and cuz she's one of those nostalgic characters that shined during MK's classic days and still continues to shine.

To me, her MKDA outfit (NOT the alt one, though) was excellent. Whether or not the MK team decided to make her a tomboy, it was a great improvement over her MK3 aerobics look (I'm sorry to all the MK3 fans, but this is my opinion) - in MKDA, she's definitely dressed to go to war and not to the gym.
Though for some who say she needs a new look, well, though I'd keep her army jacket, bra and leather pants and boots, how about a karate outfit? It'd be sleeveless (neatly hemmed, not the torn off ones like Ryu), black belt, bare feet, and for a woman's touch, rolled up pant-sleeves that come right below her knees. And she'd grow slight muscle mass and she'd improvise MMA with, say judo, karate and wrestling - thus completing her tomboy image (again, just IMO).

BTW, is it weird that other than Shiva, we haven't seen the other MK girls barefoot? Cage was in MKDA... as was Dhramin... In it 's 20 years, MK artists needs to do something with their girls to turn their fans on! It's like, show off some toes, ladies!

I like to play as Sonya,but i am a big believer in downloadable fatalities for all the original fighters even Raidens fatality from the SNES version which was really cool, should be available for download in the new game,but i would really like to see Sonya's original costume as well as her original fatality that was in MK1,for download in the new game or the one coming to XBOX 720.