Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 09:41 PM EDT
Nathan Wrote:
Don't misunderstand. I know how to use him, as I said, I kick ass with him. I just dislike how he's become a pale shadow of his former agile self.


Yeah you got a point UMK3 Subby was sooo nasty with his 8 hit combos and juggles also the Ice Shower move when you knocked a dude in the air, Oh man THAT move should have been Sub's enhanced version of the freeze move in this game.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 09:45 PM EDT
I disagree. I can pull off some easy 7-8 hit combos with him. I'm best with Sub.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 09:48 PM EDT
And I can pull off a 12 hit combo, with 55% damage. Doesn't change the fact he moves slow compared the other 3 characters in the demo.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 09:49 PM EDT
superawesomeness Wrote:
I disagree. I can pull off some easy 7-8 hit combos with him. I'm best with Sub.


Really? I find it hard to do strings that long because its hard for me to juggle with him he seems very grounded, maybe i'm not that intuitive. The only thing I see potential is when your in the air and punch the guy can bounce off the ground into something else.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 09:55 PM EDT
Grizzle Wrote:
superawesomeness Wrote:
I disagree. I can pull off some easy 7-8 hit combos with him. I'm best with Sub.


Really? I find it hard to do strings that long because its hard for me to juggle with him he seems very grounded, maybe i'm not that intuitive. The only thing I see potential is when your in the air and punch the guy can bounce off the ground into something else.


Here's what I use, if I remember correctly.

Back + Square - Triangle - Freeze - Triangle - Square - Circle - Slide

I'm pretty sure that's it. It does about 39% damage I think.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 09:56 PM EDT
A good one is Triangle, triangle, ice ball, triangle, square, circle, enhanced slide. 8 hits right there, with 34% damage.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 10:05 PM EDT
yea... I guess I'll just have to get use to this subby. RIP mk3/mkm:sz subby lol. sidenote- maybe a better set of kicks would make him a lot more appealing. some of them look clumsy.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/27/2011 10:12 PM EDT
Moving to Strategy Zone.

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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/28/2011 10:10 AM EDT
I never thought about using the ice freeze in the middle of a combo, i tried out both combos and they are AWESOME, you guys definatley helped me in stepping my game up, thank you both. I tried mixing both of the combos together by pressing: triangle, triangle, freeze, then using the back + square, triangle, then freeze again. Only, it makes the other guy stumble back before i can unleashe the triangle, square, circle combo that sends the guy flying to the other side of the screen. I'm hungry for more lol.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/29/2011 05:51 AM EDT
I think the only thing I disagree with that has been said is Sub being more POWERFUL than Scorp in this game (no offense to Jaded-Raven). At least in the demo Scorpion is much much easier to pull off 25%-40%+ damage combos with. Sub has some damn good ones that are kinda easy too but just not as many or as easy as Scorpion.

my best sub-combo: B+Sq, Tr, Freeze, Pop-Up JP, B+Sq, Tr, Tr, Sq, Cir, Slide (not sure on #hits/damage exactly but its up there in the 40%'s I think.. I stress the not sure part) You can also substitute the Circle into Slide for Triangle into Freeze for a little less damage but it looks cool. Also you can substitute the special for an X-ray to do much more damage.

I find it difficult to land this though sometimes because of the relatively slow start-up on his B+Sq it takes more timing, setup, and skill to land than Scorpion's combos.

( see my B&B; for Scorp in this post: http://www.mortalkombatonline.com/content/forum/showmessage.cds?id=133397 )

Just the fact that he can do 20% damage just by JK, Airthrowing I think gives him a speed/damage edge over sub-zero as sub needs to hit more buttons and needs more setup than just that to do good damage. Let alone the easy 30-40% combos that Scorpion has not just a couple of but a TON of them.

Then again I mostly main Scorpion and I'm not as good with Sub-Zero so maybe I just haven't seen or done more variations on his combos that do damage in the mid to high 30's or 40's like I have with Scorpion. It just seems like Sub-Zero is definitely capable but without using walls, expert setups, or other situational things he doesn't have quite as many versatile options for high damage.

But well... good luck getting ahold of Sub-Zero since he's a total counter tank, lol. Unlike Scorpion who while faster and imo stronger is a helluva lot easier to punish and throw off his game. Sub-Zero has a slight issue with faster people like Scorp or Cage rushing him and interrupting his moves/attacks but a good sub-zero player will learn when and how to use that god forsaken ice clone to put anyone just trying to rush at him in their place. That's just my opinion though and I'm far from an expert player.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/29/2011 07:55 PM EDT
^ Great post. I agree, it's easier to do high damaging combos with Scorpion then Sub-Zero, at least against the AI. I haven't played against any decent human opponents, my friends just button mashed...

I think Scorpion is a bit more predictable than Sub-Zero though, hence why I enjoy playing with Sub-Zero more.


As for his ice clone, I usually leave it in the air after my JP or JK connects. Also, I think it's wicked to leave it after you do one of these combos:

- triangle, square, triangle into ice clone
- square, triangle into ice clone

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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
03/31/2011 05:16 PM EDT
Yes he is slower, but after playing with him quit a while I feel they brought his gameplay back to the way he was played in the first 2 MK games. Which was a bait-and-trap type of player.

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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
04/05/2011 11:52 AM EDT
Nephrite Wrote:
^ Great post. I agree, it's easier to do high damaging combos with Scorpion then Sub-Zero, at least against the AI. I haven't played against any decent human opponents, my friends just button mashed...

I think Scorpion is a bit more predictable than Sub-Zero though, hence why I enjoy playing with Sub-Zero more.


As for his ice clone, I usually leave it in the air after my JP or JK connects. Also, I think it's wicked to leave it after you do one of these combos:

- triangle, square, triangle into ice clone
- square, triangle into ice clone


TY. I play against my younger brother who I taught how to play MK and SF pretty well. I mean I'm not as good as most of the people online, lol, but I'm like average to slightly above average at most I think. ::shrugs:: I'm too good for most of my friends because most of them don't play non-button masher friendly fighting games so I ream them in MK and SF. My bro and I have some pretty epic matches though. He can destroy me in SF4 if he's Ken unless I play Sagat or Blanka who aren't even my favorite characters as I prefer Chun Li or Akuma but they got nerfed to unplayable levels in that game compared to Ken. lol. I'm still a bit better at MK generally though especially if I play Scorpion. We have as of late been reliving the epic Scorpion VS Sub-Zero battles of old. lol. Scorpion (IF he can get ahold of you) will DESTROY you with his insane combo ability just like he could in UMK3 and MK4 (his two most dominant incarnations IMO). Sub-Zero on the other hand with a well timed or well placed ice clone trap will probably be able to do less damage in general unless you get lucky positioning or master his really damaging combos but he will probably hit far more often. Which was pretty much true of the MK4 sub-zero who was much much faster but also much weaker than this version. UMK3 everybody was fast, lol, and most of them had combos in the 30% range so yeah just specials and setups that mattered for them.

The ONE thing about Sub-Zero that I miss and wish they would tweak is his MK2 setup of his Jump Kick into Ground Freeze. The startup for the ground freeze in this game makes this much harder to do. My brother still manages to catch me with groundfreezes and such though as he is really really good at zoning and timing as well as good use of his ES moves. Knowing when and how to use Sub-Zero's ES moves really steps up his game, lol. I mostly play Scorpion who doesn't even need ES moves except for certain situations, lol, so my management of them when using the characters that do need them is very poor. His management of them with Sub-Zero however is very very good and he catches me off guard with ES Clones and Ground Freezes ALL the time. lol. I am an aggressive strategy type player ("rushdown" style and "combo" style mainly) so I fall for alot of stupid things that more cautious players wouldn't which is why I tend to lose a lot, hence my self-categorization as an average to above average player. I'm good at strategy and move/combo execution, I can recognize strengths and weaknesses of characters very easily, and so you could say I am a great player Academically speaking but I still lose due to over-eagerness so only average player Practically speaking. lol.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
04/05/2011 03:32 PM EDT
Bloodfang Wrote:
TY.


Damn, I had to search Google to find out what "TY" means, lol... Every day I learn a new abbreviation. You're welcome!smile

It's so cool to have someone good to play against. I've got no one to play against, but the AI. That's why I'm scared of online as I've never played online before. I'm pretty good against the AI (I don't have any difficulties on the expert level), but still, I have a feeling I'll get my ass kicked hard in the first couple of matches online, lol. Either way, I was brave enough to join TheFightKlub PS3 tournament MKO is organizing. If I win just 1 match, I'll be happy. grin

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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
04/08/2011 05:58 AM EDT
Nephrite Wrote:
Bloodfang Wrote:
TY.


Damn, I had to search Google to find out what "TY" means, lol... Every day I learn a new abbreviation. You're welcome!smile

It's so cool to have someone good to play against. I've got no one to play against, but the AI. That's why I'm scared of online as I've never played online before. I'm pretty good against the AI (I don't have any difficulties on the expert level), but still, I have a feeling I'll get my ass kicked hard in the first couple of matches online, lol. Either way, I was brave enough to join TheFightKlub PS3 tournament MKO is organizing. If I win just 1 match, I'll be happy. grin


I haven't decided if or when I'll attempt online fighting as the lag usually gets me pretty bad not to mention the fact that I have a life outside of gaming so I lack the "mad skillz" that most of the "hardcore" online players have... not to mention I tend to be a little over aggressive and get baited easily (lol). I kinda suck compared to most online players, well perhaps I'm slightly above average in skill at best, but compared to most of my friends I'M the one with the "hardcore" fighting skills... which is sad.
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RE: Anyone else agree that Subby seems slow in the demo?
04/08/2011 04:25 PM EDT
Im glad he's slow, i dont want everyone the same

he does more damage so why not?
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