I’m pumped all of the female ninjas are in. Shocked, but pumped.

and if Mileena doesn’t make the base roster she will undoubtably be DLC

That honestly makes a ton of sense. I think if any of the MKX newbies has legs as DLC, it's easily Takeda.

I'd honestly even take Kung Jin as DLC. He was my least favorite newbie in MKX, and I have no problem with him sitting the game out, but I'm also verymuch in favor of NRS avoiding 1 and done characters... so... any steps they take to keep a newbie viable, I'd be okay with. Which is why Jacqui returning ultimately doesn't really piss me off either.

Honestly the thing that REALLY makes me WANT Mileena in this game is customization. I think she'd be a VERY fun character to tweak with costumes and accessories, and if she sat out it would be a missed opportunity.

Despite being my favorite character, I haven't actually mained her since like MKII. I sort of side-mained her in Deception a bit. Didn't particularly enjoy her in MK9 or MKX. In fact I preferred playing as Kitana in MKX, which made me feel dirty as a Mileena fan. (Not because I hate Kitana, it just felt like a betrayal, lol)

No worries, I got your point. I suspect you kinda missed or glossed over mine, though.

My post was about the fact that Deadly Alliance was the MKX of its day in terms of lacking surprises. (Let's take into consideration: If you throw in a large proportion of brand new faces, you kinda need to back them up with a strong roster of old familiars so that it retains enough of the expected Mortal Kombat brand identity. The "safety" of the returning roster is set to balance out the very high risk that new characters bring. That was probably the logic behind both MKDA and MKX having a "safe" slate of returnees.)

My post went on to point out that while Deception was chocked with surprises, those surprises came with a cost that diminished their "legit"-ness, at least a little bit. Seeing a few of the previous games' oddballs get a turn at the 3D treatment was a welcome advance for the series... but transparently forcing the classics to sit out a game to make it happen, and the hamhanded way they justified it in the story, made the oddballs feel even more like second-class characters getting a charity treatment. Between the near-total lack of beloved original characters, and a slate of total strangers coming out of nowhere, Deception had a decidedly weird presence that made it feel more like a delirious fanfiction than a logical follow-up to the previous game. Roster-wise, it was big on surprises with proportionally little substance.

This is exactly what a lot of the 3D advocates have been asking for them to do again: get rid of boring-old-characters like Liu, Johnny, Sonya, Jax, Kano, Lao, even series mascot Scorpion, so we can bring back all the oddballs as a charity case. I think this is misguided. This approach doesn't respect the oddball characters enough to put them on equal footing, head to head, with the classic characters they're filling in for. Which leads me to the next commonly-voiced opinion that I think is misguided:

See, I think those two are shining examples of a proper win for 3D characters. They're characters from the post-Trilogy era who became classics after spending some time playing together with the original crowd. Having appeared prominently in both Deception and MKX, Tanya is on her way to becoming one of these as well... if they can stay on task and maintain her relevance with another appearance. Unfortunately, if they decided to do that, I kinda worry that she would start to be considered as "worn out" as Quan and Kenshi are today.

I don't mind seeing a slower drip of forgotten characters making a comeback if it means that when they do come back, they get a chance to gain enduring importance -- as opposed to falling into obscurity again in the next game, because the fans already got bored and are demanding a whole new crop of oddballs to replace last season's crop.

(To properly balance the need for both original characters and consistently recurring folks from later eras, they seriously need to put the brakes on adding new characters. Having only three in MK11 is a good step, but honestly I would be happy if they added only one, maybe two per game from here on. That's enough to add a whiff of freshness, and give at least one a chance to grow into a series regular, while allowing enough space for characters like Rain and Smoke to gain a proper foothold.)

Highly, highly doubt you have anything to worry about here. (Especially if KenshiMaster's sources are right.) NRS has very clearly shown that they do take requests, between last game's DLC and already Frost and Skarlet in this game's starting roster. You honestly suggest they wouldn't capitalize on the fan demands for Fujin etc. by throwing him out there as an extra? You're stressing yourself out more than the situation warrants here, I think.

If anything, I'm guessing that the sheer intensity of the crying out for Fujin pretty much guaranteed his placement as DLC instead of the starting roster. The base game will sell the same with or without him -- but if you want to milk the most out of those hardcore fan dollars, then sell the most hotly demanded character separately. Casuals may or may not bother to buy the extra content, so if you want guaranteed sales, you gotta tickle your most dedicated fans right in their Fujin boner. I imagine that's why they're apparently drawing out the tension with Havik at least until the next game -- because fans want him bad enough to pay extra for him, and the suspensionof gratification will only intensify the hunger.

On a personal note: It always bugs me when you do this, pretty much every time someone even mildly challenges your opinion. Remember, just because you have a right to an opinion, that doesn't mean the foundations of that opinion must be totally shielded from scrutiny or contest. "It's just an opinion, so don't question it" makes it sound like you will not be reasoned with, will not accept or even listen to any viewpoint that attempts to soften your outlook a little, or assure you that things aren't nearly as bad as they might look to you.

Jesus. Would everyone quit fighting over a roster that you have ZERO control over.

That'd be too easy

Chaos at its finest. Havik is most impressed.

Havik probably wouldn't even care if he was in a game or not, he'll cause chaos either way

Why be in the game? Havik has already won.

Chaos is life!

I wouldn't say the audience has zero control, since the team clearly does take requests and feedback, even hate, into consideration. Not that I would encourage this much complaining. They are listening, though.

In any case, when it comes to pushing back against the disproportionate, unrelenting hate going around for a property we presumably love... well. I'll stop when they stop.

(-_^)b

This. Clearly we have a say in like 10% of the roster and 60% of the DLC. They are gonna put in who they want on the base cause of story or dev wishes to build up certain moves or utilize certain gameplay tools. Then they clearly allow us a certain number of slots due to fan demand, hence Skarlet / Frost / ect. Then, if the DLC is accurate, the majority of that will clearly be all for the fan boys who have spent the past 4 years blowing up Twitter.

no one will ever be happy with the roster, unless they just do Armageddon roster for every game it's the only way to please everyone who spends their life on these forums hating this roster, that roster

if i was Ed/NRS team i would straight up tell the fans the real reason why so and so is not in the game, just so we know the truth

Even if they did an Armageddon roster for every game people will still be pissed. "There's too many characters! Why do we need this many!" There will be complaints no matter what because all have our own needs and wants and that's OK. I'm sure NRS are not as put out about complaints as you and others are on this forum- they've been doing this for nearly 30 years. Oh and they get paid millions for it too. Cue the violins.

People will complain, people will praise, people will shout with glee, and people will rant. It's all the same every game. Just don't sweat it. What bothers me more than the complaining is the people who like to slap others down for doing so.

Tremor proves that fan choice (or better, fan demand) is far more important than most people think.

Ironically I believe that hadn't Tremor been so requested, maybe we could have had Fujin(or another obscure character like Li Mei or Sareena) in his stead.

This led me to believe that roster spots are in brackets, something like 15 characters are returning from the Trilogy era 5 are new, 5 from the 3D era/obscure secondary character, etc.

Every time a oddball character makes it to the actual roster he steals the spot to another character of the same category imo.

Mk 4 times where Noob, Kano and Kitana were replaced by Reiko, Jarek and Tanya are over. It was not the most convenient move to do back then, for sure it will not be the right move today.

A roster that has Skarlet, Frost, Shinnok, D'Vorah and Erron Black plus 4 new characters is not bad.

I believe that another 1 or 2 spots are still available as DLCs for those characters.

My prediction would be something like this:

Fujin

Ermac

Reptile

Nightwolf guest 1

Spawn

Pack 2

Sareena

Sindel

Sheeva

Guest 3

Guest 4

Come on man, you're better than this. There's a difference between hate and disappointment. People who truly hate Mortal Kombat are not on the internet ranting over their favorites not being in. Some people are just disappointed. Let it fly. NRS aren't helpless victims that needs defenders.

They get paid for this.

Three females in one pack? NRS may have upped the number of females in this game as a whole, but I still don't see them doing more than one female per pack- especially considering all the major female ninjas are in. Sindel I can see totally landing a DLC spot, but any other females I doubt will make it. Maybe they'd toss in Tasia. She was pretty badass in the comics.

I hope to God I'm wrong.

i'm not put out though

i want everyone to be happy in a way but if you want to complain over the little things then of course those people will bitch about the bitching

i may look like that type or look like i'm a crazy bitch, but honestly i don't care if your main is in i just want people happy so we can all play the same game and have positive shit to say

but if your main does not turn up to be in this i feel bad, but i'm also not that person who is HAHAHAHA YOUR MAIN IS OUT SUCKERS

cause really you all are strangers to me like i am to you, it just be nice if NRS was just honest and tell everyone why Reiko is not in, or Havik or the cyborgs or Fujin and Rain etc etc

You don't want them being honest. You're not gonna like the answers

why not at least those fans who are not getting their fav can get the truth why so and so is not being in the game

Because I'm fairly certain some of those honest answers would basically boil down to ""We hate 'em"

I get it: You don't "hate" Mortal Kombat... you're just disappointed in virtually every decision they make, and you won't support the game if it leans too hard on its original characters and is missing one or two of your personal favorites in a roster that might very well hit 40. Some might consider that a distinction without a difference, but... shrug? I guess you're free to call that whatever you want.

"They" may get paid millions, but by the time you take out the cuts for marketing, production, distribution, and retail, and split the rest between the labor costs for every single person who has a name on the credits... I don't think you're going to find any millionaires on the team. They're creators who are fortunate enough to be making a living, and game development is notoriously brutal work. It's hard to imagine them not feeling something when people shit all over their efforts, and it's hard to blame them for catering more to the preferences of people who at least sound like they appreciate what the team makes.

As for me, at the end of the day (or any other time) I'm not here to whiteknight for the developers. Hell, they seem to have a thicker skin for weathering criticism than the people doing the complaining, who seem to get really, really touchy about things. I'm just here to express my opinion that some of the series' flaws aren't nearly as bad as they're made out to be, and I try to back up that opinion with whatever little insight I have. Far be it from you to slap down a dude for having an opinion though, right?

ok but that would be honest would it not, then those fans can either pick new favs or move on and finally know that Ed/NRS hate those characters instead of sitting here demanding this and that

but i honestly think that is their reasoning for not putting in certain people like Fujin and Rain

A lot of decision making goes into the roster choices beyond simple popular demand. They need to fit well enough into the story, contribute to the balance and mechanics a certain way, etc. Some characters will likely remain staples just because they're familiar and therefore easy to learn, especially under new mechanics.

It's probably hard to explain that they make these decisions over the course of weeks of pitch meetings between story, design, marketing, and whatever other departments are involved... going through multiple iterations where different characters are in or out, making concessions and compromises as they run into technical, design, and time constraints.... There really wouldn't be any one easy answer they can give besides, "We hear you, but the process is complicated and not everyone can make it."

i get that too

i'm just saying for those people who are so upset every game that their fav is not in

i know there could be many reasons why this person or that person is not in, but if you dislike a character make it sort of known to those small fan bases so they can kind of move on if they are so butt hurt he/she is not in

if i was NRS i would make this game story mode be like where the Armageddon fight is happening they have erased all those characters they actually came out and said they hated are gone and you still everyone from mk1 -mk3 plus frost, sareena, bo, tremor, fujin, rain, etc etc still in the fighting

but others like hsu hao, mokap people they will never ever bring back are completely out, if they are going to stick with the familiar faces that is fine, but for those fans who are dying to see Reiko and who ever else just let them know truthfully 'yeah we honestly don't care havik and reiko and fujin so get over it'

i only liked armageddon cause it had everyone there even if i didn't play as everyone it was cool, but i was never a fan of the 3d gameplay having to constantly move around like spinning the angles, i hated the fatality method so stupid, i was so glad they went back to 2d fighting for mk vs dc and so on

but anyways i just want people to be happy in a way and if Ed hates your fav then it's ok to hate him too for hating your fav, but just to hate cause you want to start shit come on (not everyone just those trolls)