Anyone know where I can find the information regarding characters special moves? Many videos, articles, updates, ect have been released since PAX and I have no intention of sifting though all that information unless absolutely necessary.

If no such information exists in one place, I believe its safe to assume that at least one user has played the game at PAX, Gamecom, or E3. Any help is appreciated.

Here are some stats on various anti-airs and jumping MK from multiple characters.



The legend is as follows:

Damage: Numbers with a * (asterisk) in front of them are the next hit of a move.
Numbers in parentheses are based on when the attack hits your opponent. For example, hitting with the early part of Ken's Light Punch Shoryuken does more damage (120) than hitting with it later in the animation (80).

Active: how many frames of animation a move is capable of hitting for


Startup: number frames of animation take place before this move is capable of hitting your opponent.


Recover: Recovery Frames.


Frame Adv. Block: : Short for Frame Advantage after Blocking. A number with a + before it means how many frames faster than your opponent you will recover if they block your attack. Negative numbers mean how much faster your opponent will recover than you after blocking it.






Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /

KEN

Dp 100(80)/ 3/ 11 / 18+6/ -14
Lp

Dp 90*60/ 4/ 3*11/ 25+14/ -29
Mp

Dp 70*40*30/ 3/2*2*12/ 30+9 / -30
Hp

Dp 70*30*30*50/ 4/ 2*2*2*6/ 45+9/ -41
Ex






Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /

Guile

FK 130/ 4/ 11/ 20+23/ -33
Lk

Fk 140/4/11/ 22+23/ -35
Mk

Fk 160/ 4/11/ 24+23/ -37
Hk

Fk 100*80/ 4/ 2*9/ 24+23/ -35
Ex






Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /

Ibuki

DK 50*20*65/ 5/ 1*1*11/ 25/ -27
Lk

DK 20*20*75/ 7/ 1*1*11/ 28/ -32
Mk

Dk 50*20*90/ 9/ 1*1*11/ 25/ -27
Hk

Dk 40*40*80/ 5/ 3*4(2)8/ 39/ -26
Ex



Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /

Adon


Rj 80*50/ 4/ 2(6)4/ 17+13/ -13
Lk

Rj 90*50/ 5/ 2(6)5/ 22+13/ -27
Mk

Rj 50*100/ 5/ 2(6)9/ 22+13/ -33
Hk

Rj 80*40*40/ 5/ 4(8)2*6/ 24+10/ -33
ex














Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /


Seth

Dp 80*60/ 5/ 2*16/ 11+13 -19
Lp

Dp 90*60/ 5/ 2*16/ 21+13 -29
Mk

Dp 100*80/ 5/ 2*16/ 24+13 -32
Hk

Dp 100*50/ 5/ 2*16/ 26+13 -34
Ex






Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /

Honda

Ss 80*100/ 14/ 7(14)6/ 18/ -2
Lk

Ss 90*110/ 14/ 7(14)9/ 18/ -2
mk

Ss 100*120/ 14/ 7(14)15/ 18 -3
Hk

Ss 100*80/ 9/ 6(14)12/ 18 -2
Ex










Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /

Dudley

Ju 120[80]/ 6/ 7/ 16+9/ -16
Lp

Ju 140[100]/ 6/ 14/ 16+12/ -26
Mp

Ju 100*60[70]/ 4/ 2*18/ 18+12/ -32
Hp

Ju 100*80/ 4/ 2*18/ 20+12/ -29
Ex




Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /

Balrog

Bh 100/ 8/ 11/ 10+13/ -13
Lp

Bh 120/ 10/ 11/ 10+13/ -13
Mp

Bh 140/ 12/ 11/ 9+13/ -12
Hp

Bh 150/ 12/ 11/ 9+13/ -12
Hk









Move/Damage/Startup /Active /Recover Frame /Adv. Block Frame /


Vega

St 100/ 7/ 10/ 15+8/ -12
Lk

St 80*60/ 7/ 5*5/ 14+9/ -15
Mk

St 100*60/ 4/ 8*5/ 14+9/ -15
Hk

St 110*70/ 4/ 8*5/ 14+9/ -20
ex





Despite Ken having some superior DP stats than the characters listed he still breaks even with Dudley, Vega, Ibuki, Adon, and Seth at 5-5 matches. He loses 6-4 against Guile and Balrog. These match ups have been consistently in this range since May and Ken has still remained Mid-tier. These stats are proof that Ken’s shoryuken isn’t some broken god killer; its proof that characters having disadvantages and advantages does NOT break the game.









---------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Moving on to Ken's Jumping MK.


Damage/ start up/ active


Ken mk 80 6 4


Ryu mk 70 6 6


Sakura mk 70 5 4

Juri mk 70 5 6

Blanka 70 6 5

Dee jay 90 6 4

And this goes on and on. Ken’s jumping Mk does not beat every other air attack.














All Hondas throws including his ultra are 2 active frames. 2! That is really small window for success. Zangiefs throw specials are also 2 and 1 for ultras and supers. These couldn’t be farther from broken.

Do you really want to take that away from two slow characters lacking any significant mobility options that already have a seriously hard time getting inside? These throws are not “broken”













Standing JABS can cancel ultras if timed right. This isn’t exclusive to Abel.








Here’s a list characters that can combo into ultras, juggling and otherwise:

Adon
Abel
Blanka
C.Viper
Cammy
Chun Li
Cody
Dan
Dee Jay
Dudley
Honda
Fei Long
Gen
Gouken
Guile
Guy
Hakan
Ibuki
Juri
Ken
Bison
Makoto
Rufus
Sagat
Sakura
Seth
Vega
Gief

This is practically the entire cast.








That is not why people play these characters at all. That’s just flat out wrong. Akuma is played for his pressure game, resets, offensive options, and his damage. Ryu is played for his footsies, zoning, and Ultra 1.

Ken is the only one who is played for his cross ups, and that’s not even exclusively why.












No offense, but this is all hyperbole and at this point I really do believe you don’t know what you’re talking about. Bison, Guile, Cammy, Chun Li, and Balrog are all above every character you just listed. You’re not even complaining about the right characters.

At Evo2k10 Ricky Ortiz made it to the finals by beating Akuma, Sagat, Ken and Ryu players with Rufus of all people. Jwong’s Balrog went toe to toe with Daigo’s (unquestionably the best Sf4 player) Ryu and the match went down to the wire.

Honestly; Ryu, Ken, Akuma, and Sagat are so far from broken it’s laughable. I have a lot of problems with SF4 that make me almost hate the game, but mine are grounded with some sort of validity . Your own show a severe of lack of knowledge about this game, considering I had to correct you on some of more elementary things. Sorry but UMK is way more “Broken” than SF4-and UMK3 isn’t even broken- so what the hell does that make SF4?

Yeah dude, I’m down for the old school, but glassy eyed nostalgia and a complete lack of knowledge about what you’re upset about isn’t the way to go.

No offense intended.

lol No wonder when I taught some one to play SF4 and he decided on Balrog to main that he actually surprised me some... I'm not a hardcore SF4 player at all, but it is a great game.

And UMK3, I love it, but I would say it is a little broken. I mean there are infinites. Any thing with Infinites in it I'd consider broken to some degree.

yeah, what Glenn Be- er Statue of Liberty said.

Nice long post and all, but I'm talking about Street Fighter IV, NOT Super Street Fighter IV where they fixed the damages.

And you probably never played a handful of jump happy kicking mindset Ken's and Ryu's (I probably didn't put Ryu in the kick example in my last post, sorry) like I have. These people pick and do these moves for a reason because it's an advantage. I don't remember me saying his (their) kick defeats everyone as in 100%, but damn near. Countless of times when I do an air attack I'm easily defeated by their jump kick no matter my timing.

"All Hondas throws including his ultra are 2 active frames. 2! That is really small window for success. Zangiefs throw specials are also 2 and 1 for ultras and supers. These couldn’t be farther from broken."

No offense, but you gotta be fucking kidding me if you don't at least think Zangief's Atomic Buster is broken. It's just as broke as CPU Seth's version where he can jump at you and perform it without his feet touching the ground.

"Standing JABS can cancel ultras if timed right. This isn’t exclusive to Abel."
I know, but I was mainly talking about Abel being able to cancel Ultra's with his throw special.

"Here’s a list characters that can combo into ultras, juggling and otherwise. This is practically the entire cast."

I'm not talking about combo/juggling into it. I'm talking about performing just one easy simple attack into an Ultra. How many people can do that? Please, educate me and tell me the exact procedures. I'm not talking about things like Special Move EX cancel into Ultra or Focus Dash Ultra.

"Bison, Guile, Cammy, Chun Li, and Balrog are all above every character you just listed. You’re not even complaining about the right characters."

I was just using some characters as examples, I didn't want to put down the whole roster, that's all.

(To the Hardcore Players)

K lets be honest.... With now what we've seen, what are your thoughts on how this game is shaping up?

I haven't seen any thing that looks like it could be broken, which thus far is a good sign. MKA and MKvsDC being broken were no surprise to me from the earlier gameplay vids of them. MK9 with what gameplay vids there are now looks pretty decent.

I don't believe I've seen any combo's (not involving X-Ray moves) to do more than 20% damage, so seems like they are getting the damage balanced pretty well actually.

At the moment my main fear is the EX bar stuff potentially breaking the game.

I have, and you having trouble with it is your own fault. Sorry but their jumping normals have no crazy broken advantage over everyone else in the air. You eating air Mk every time you try a jump attack is reflective of your own skill; not the moves.












I’m not kidding you because I actually know what “broken” means. ST Akuma’s air fireball is broken; CvS Nakoruru’s flight is broken. Geif was great in vanilla but he hasn’t even touching “broken”.






I thought you were. So in this case I agree with you. In my reply to you I that (one of the reasons) Ryu is played is because of his Ultra 1 and its great flexibility. And that gets into the whole problem I have with SF4. Slow gameplay + unsafe jumps + reliance on comeback mech=garbage.

But this is indicative of failed implication of mechanics NOT unique normals. Normals don’t even have to do with your one valid complaint.


I still fail to see how unique normals hurt a game.

Its basically MKDC on a 2D plane with a super meter. From what we've seen it looks impressive, but I just can't let go of the fear that the MK team will royally fuck up in some aspect and ruin the game.

So far though, X-Rays take just the right amount of damage, the ones that can be combo'd into take less and the ones that can't take more.

EX moves might ruin the game. Like for instance, you start a combo with Reptile's EX Force Ball. Reptile then combos the character and lands enough hits to actually build up another EX move which allows him to restart the combo with the EX Force Ball. Things like that might get through the "testing" of the game.

But since we're getting patches after release, in theory there shouldn't be anything like that right?

MK9 looks like it is shaping up to NOT be a tounanment ready fighter imo.

And real talk, the MK subforum on SRK has much more valuable info on the gameplay mechanics than this site.

At 1:20 Scorpion does a JP starter. Awesome!

The damage on these combos is toned down...I looked at a Scrub-Zero/Kitana vs. Cyrax/Kung Lao fight, and even though KL comboed into and out of his Brutality it only amounted to like 32%.

and didn't Eddy Gore-do say that it'll be even more toned down in later builds?

Depends how you define combos. Just punch and kicks or THAT plus specials and Supers?

In the Cyrax/Scorpion VS Kitana/Kung Lao video, you can see a handful of 20%+ damage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJlru3PoEEE

You'll be happy to know that will be impossible since kicks and punches DO NOT build the bar. Only performing specials and taking damage will.

Wow, that sounds stupid and retarded.

I agree with some of the stuff both of you are saying. my basic problem is the paper rock scissor style of playing. yes street fighter had high low tactics and those tactics r OK. tekken was just a mess and after tag tournament (which was the best one in my opinion) I was done. mortal kombat gave the fighting world I different type of game play compared to the two. people complain about Turtle blocking... but guess what. as much as everyone disliked it. it was a great defensive technique that required timing and patience to wait for your opponent to mess up. you took damage while turtle blocking, and it set up so many moves in the game that were eliminated after MK3. and in my opinion MK2 was the best out of the franchise. I never won a single united states tournament in MK2 .. I got 2nd place in the MK3 tournament only losing to another great play by the name of Jon Long.
here is a small compare of the different hi/low's im talking about.

In street-fighter it was simple and effective. if u duck low someone can jump kick and hit you over the top of your head, then tap-kick fireball. good combo, basic and impressive.

In the 3d mortal kombats, if you duck low, someone can come over with an overhead that pops you up, then can do their normal combo, or special then normal combo. unfortunately these combos were easy to do and took off massive amounts of energy. and instead of the combo pushing you back to be able to get up and get ready for the next set. it would lay u down right next to your opponent. at that point the opponent had the upper hand again with the paper rock scissors guessing match I explained in my last comment. this quality was shared in tekken and gave the player no chance after the first explosive combo was dealt.

In my opinion the ability to turtle block is what made MK different than any other fighting game. it setup tap-kicks, tap-punches, and lead to tricks that most people still fall for this day.. example : tap-kick, spear with scorpion. gets people all the time. and every character could use this to push off aggressive players.

MK2 took real skill, timing (it was harder to pull of juggles) and no button masher could win against a pro! EVER!

yes, the combos and run button in MK3 made the game more fast passed and it was good to have chain linked button combos to learn and master.
but the button mashing started in MK3. thats the only negative thing i have to say about MK3

UMK3 and MKT were both great games, and had the same fun as normal MK3 with more characters and a few other tricks up its sleeve .

MK4 was clearly redundant. The weapons were a good idea, but it was not done right. and honestly the game looked like crap

MK deadly alliance was just a joke. the game was made just to get some income in and was released with so many holes and 100% combos. the graphics were pathetic and gameplay was sad.

MK Deception - This game at first actually impressed me. I played it for a pretty long time. even became a force to be messed with online. but once the secrets and glitches were released.. it was back to MKDA all over again. 100% non corner combos. pinning your opponent down on the ground, by taking on step back and waiting on if they would duck or stand up to setup the overhead + 40-60-100 combo. killed the game.

MK Armageddon - The second worse MK ever made. enough said
MK vs DC - lol The WORST MK ever made.
BOTH GAMES HAD THE CRAPPIEST GAMEPLAY AND BUTTON REG I HAVE EVER SEEN.

Thats why I hope and pray that this new MK will have what people are really looking for. A balance, well planned out, non-glitched up, and strategic way of fighting like they said they will do.. back to the MK1-MK3 days of being patient and setting up your opponent with tricks (not glitches)
If they were to make this game properly in my opinion.... I would buy it even if It had a $100.00 price tag on it.

Actually I prefer MKDA over any of the 3D. It was by far the most playable. Sure it was crappy but MKD - DC were simply unplayble. Also, Armageddon, for the first time, tried to get some stuff right (Wake up, Parry) But like everything. It was poorly excuted.

MKD was probably one of the most broken games in gaming history, and I mean, not fighting games. All games.

MK vs DC was just crap.

I'm no expert but MKDA is better than MKD in terms of gameplay, I think this have been proved for a long time now.

i wonder how many infinties will be in the game. like for example subzero he could punch and freeze and repeat.... just hope theres no inifinites.

And where you get this idea from?

In terms of gameplay: MKDC>MKDA>MKA>MKD. Still, that doesn't say much about these four abominations.

I hope this mks not goin to be all about the Pop ups and juggles, I kno juggleing was a big part in earlier mks and even the 3ds ones,
But dam... honestly how many times can u punch somebody and keep volleyballing him in the air.....sometimes its just to much, especially if ur going to be able to take 40% or plus damage off. Some ones life by playin hacky sak with his body.... that's stupid to me... I really hope they make a deep figthing base with plenty of stringing punches and kiks for each player. maybe some power houses like scorpion , should have less stringing ability then say kitana,ya knooo...he could have just quick brutal 2 -4. Hit devestators,and then kitana could have an easy string of 8-10. Weaker attacks....u know so u could actually feel a characters strength, I kno the 3d games weren't great but I actually think they did a decent job of that in mkda.... but what I'm sayin is the juggles should b toned down because a few clips I seen it was ridciculous, mileena jus flyin thro the air for 15 seconds, I would really wish for them to expand on the ground hand to hand combat u kno with the specials an some pop ups and a few more sensible juggles... not any tekken or ssf4 stuff, and get rid o f all these stupid meters and all that garbage and base blocks an counters. More on timing and the gamers indivual skill, include parrys and plenty of counters and stretch the life long out so its a deep bloody true battle to the death.

i agree dannyboi, that was always something that would grind my gears about the 3d ones. but i would and still do boldly stand by the 2d games. mostly just trilogy, but umk3 is amazing as well. that aggressor thing is awesome.

This is pretty minor, but if there's some small twinkle of hope that they're tweaking the hell out of this game, it's with Johnny Cage's Brutality

in the E3 build the start up animation was a lot less discreet, so that any idiot would know he was trying to parry. He put his hands to his chest like he was making an Energy Ball.

but now, he just kinda loosens his stance, leans to the side, and charges some Shadow Energy.

It's a good sign, I say...

i thought deception was pretty kool. other than playin trilogy a bunch still, that's the only one i still occasionally play. can't get over that chess kombat. why is it so addictive. and i never really even like vs DC. just couldn't get into it, but the graphics were awesome. though i gotta say, haven't played deadly alliance in a long time, cause my copy got kerstolen!

doing a x-ray move after a free hit (scorpion's spear,sub zeros freeze) seem overpowered?