wrong.

it started in mk1.

the cancer was planted when they created 3 ninja swapped characters. which led to almost 50% of the roster being swapped characters by the time of mkt.

there really isnt a perfect mk game. mk1 and mkda are the only games that arent broke as hell. many fans state mk2 as their fav and i really dont see why.

mk3 is far better then that pile of shit that you claim "came closest to achieving it with its total elimination of all things stupid in favor of all things brutal. "..yea right. mkd is the worst mk game ever hands down. its nearly fucking unplayable.

"MK3 was the game that turned MK from a respectable fighting game enjoyed by everyone into a monstrosity that no self-respecting gamer could possibly enjoy."

respectable? are you huffin paint? mk was NEVER respected in the fighting scene. the only reason it got attention to begin with was because of its blood and gore.

you wanna know titles that really hurt mk? go play mk4, mk gold, mythologies, and special forces. look at the tshirts, lunchboxes, boardgames, trading cards, movies, cartoons, tvshows, toys, comics, etc (i could go on for days) then tell me mk3 is the reason mk fell. just face it. mk was never ment to be a success to begin with. it was a quick project put together that became a success due to its over the top violence. it was all an accident. you really cant blame it on one particular game when the entire franchise was doomed from the get go.

the guy above is right.
and..quote:.I'm an old school MK fan, probably twice the age of the average poster here

im older than you,kiddo.we already know that here is swarming with fanboys and kids,there's no need to say it again.

Hey, I liked MK4. I donno why, but it was way better than mk3.. I like the mk's in this order

mk2 > Mk1 > MK4 > MK3 > MK:D > MK:DA

I'm going to assume that MK:A will probably take its probable spot between mk3 and mk:D

noob troll hammer! AHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

Anyways I personally like MK3 and UMK3. UMK3 is my fav MK game of them all. I feel MK feel down with MK4. It got back up with MKDA though, but with MKD kinda feel flat on its face and is probably the worst MK fighter of them all imo. Then now there is Armageddon wich looks to have a lot of problems with it, but looks to be a decent game still.

I can't believe you are really being seriouse. If you are then just wow.... One major way MK3 was a big improvement over MK2 is the combo system and total change in pace of the game.

Well hey if all you wanna do is play MK1 and MK2, that is fine by me and the rest of us.

Your sig is proof of what I'm saying.

Just look at how dumb Stryker looks. He's supposed to be a cop, but he's wearing a backwards baseball cap....is he a cop, or a catcher? And what's with the gloves? Is he a bicycle cop? I'll admit that MK never really got very creative with their names, but Stryker really takes the cake as a stupid frigging name.

But anyway, you do make a few decent points. I'll agree that the cancer was planted early on with the very concept of palette swaps. However, how can you possibly say that the fighting mechanics in MK3 were better than those of MKII? MKII had real combos that had to be meticulously planned while MK3 had senseles dial-a-combos. You say only MK and MKDA had non-broken fighting systems, but MKII was the same exact engine as MK, only smoother and with a more diverse mix of moves such as turn-around kicks low jabs.

Maybe I'm not a huge fighting mechanic expert, but I really can't tell a difference at all in the fighting engine used in MKDA and that used in MKD except for the addition of combo breakers.

I'll agree that the "fighting scene" never respected MK. But what was the fighting scene? It was a bunch of kids playing a bunch of games that were basically clones of each other. Street Fighter II, Samurai Showdown, World Heroes 2, can most people even really tell the difference between all of these?

People liked MK because it was something different. It looked real because of its digitized graphics. People who thought they had outgrown video games were drawn back in because of the more adult content. The overall sportsmaship and good nature of fighting games was replaced by eerie atmospheres and no honor or respect (except among the people who actually played the game, who were for the most part quite honorable and fun to play with).

I agree that Special Forces, Mythologies, etc. degraded MK, but I think that all stemmed from MK3. Those games never would have happened without MK3. But I think MK should stick to solid fighting anyway becuase I thought Konquest mode was absolutely abysmal as was the heinous MK Shaolin Monks.

So while I agree with some of your points, I maintain that most everything that is wrong with MK today goes back to MK3, the first MK game to really wallow in its own squalor.

man just get off the site then motaro wasawesome instead of four arms they had four legs

too much to read there...

kthxbai

good story

I kinda see your point about the mk3 tho.

The initial roster of mk was rather disappointing. But the graphics and sound were really impressive at the time.

I agree with alot that has been said. I thought MK4 was a step in the right direction, albeit minor. MK3, UMK3, MKT was all pretty much crap, although a few new fighters slipped in that I'd rather have than have not.

I hear people commenting all the time about Stryker and Jax, but I thought Kai, Jarek, Drahmin, Havik, and Mokap were all pretty bland and generic.

Kudos to Midway for Kenshi though, he could easily be Liu's replacement for main character. He is just so freshly badass and slick in design. Come on, the first time you got a look at him and hear he is a blind swordsman, I think most liked his style.

I totally agree, Kenshi is easily the best addition this generation. I'd love to see him as the new hero of MK.

I also give props to Midway for evolving once bland characters. I mean, Ermac was a totally stupid character in MK Trilogy, but I thought he was pretty bad-ass in MKD. I'm looking for the same thing to happen with Rain this time around. I'd much rather have them concentrate on flushing out once bland characters like this than introducing new generic ones like you mentioned plus people like Kobra and Darrius.

I agree there too, except Kobra and Darrius are just needing a facelift - their fighting styles and special moves are pretty good as is.

I needn't cover most points you've raised as not only have some others countered you better than I could, I agree with some of what you say. However, there is one thing I have to nitpick.

Can you honestly tell me Stryker is a worse name than any of the following:

Johnny Cage
Reptile
Sonya Blade
Jade
Smoke
Rain
Reiko (baring in mind it is a very common Japanese female name)
Frost
Havik
Kobra

I am not expressing any opinions on these characters for their names. For the record, I love Cage, Jade and Havik; I dislike Reptile, Smoke, Reiko; I have no real opinion either way on Sonya, Rain, Frost or Kobra. Can you honestly tell me those names are better than Stryker? I personally think Rain takes the cake as the stupidest character name - Purple Rain? Oh, you're funny with those wacky Prince references Mr. Boon...

You have some points, but some of what you said is just untrue.


UMK3 has the best gameplay in any MK game.

Running, combos, balancing, testing (for the most part)


MK2 may have had the best feel to it but UMK3 was by far the best gameplay wise.

While I don't share all of your sentiments (gameplay-wise I think UMK3 is the best, for instance), I whole-heartedly agree that MK3 was in no way what it should (or at least could) have been. MK2 was in every way a logical followup to the first game; it improved upon the mechanics and added new content, while staying true to everything that was established in MK1. MK3 however went in a completely different direction as far as design, mood and atmosphere goes; sending the series into a downward spiral from which it still hasn't recovered. Pretty much everything that was added in MK2 was an improvement (or at the very least something positive); in my mind no sequel since has been nearly as consistent with things being added actually being good. Characters of course would be the most obvious thing - although not all post-MK2 characters suck, no game since has had a real solid group of newcomers - but I think it applies to pretty much everything. The universe, while more expansive than in the early days, just feels convoluted now. The story keeps getting retconned to the point where it's difficult to care anymore. The overall design is just so much worse than it used to be, the ugly-looking 'fists-as-big-as-my-head' character models of the current games really being the epitome of the MK series' descent into aesthetic awfulness.

I'm hoping the next game will give the series the fresh start it so desperately needs - going away from the ridiculous, cartoony, stupid mess we have now, in favour of something serious, atmospheric and sophisticated that I can admit to liking without having to be ashamed. But that said, if the MK team's taught me anything in these past 10 years or so, it's that hoping is futile.

That's the beauty of MK....how corny and unbelievable and stupid, yet still fun, it is.

i aggre with sindrix mk3 was a bad game but 4,da,1,2,d,mka were good games so if any kid disagrees then shut up you donot understand the game like us vererans. you may never live to seee another wave of kombat mania.

I'm about centered with Scorpio here.

"Everything terrible about Mortal Kombat"

1. MkSF:
Everything about it was repulsive.
I hated it from head to toe and it's probably the only part of the Mk franchise I can truthfully say that about.

2. Mk4 & MkG:

The only things I had against these games was that it seemed as though the Mk Team wasn't finished with the idea, and shouldv'e held out longer to release a better product there. These games I appreciated because I could visualize where they were taking Mk. Around that time alot of games had already started experimenting and releasing games associated with Motion Capture. So, to me it was an exceptable attempt. It failed simply becasue it was wrong.......Wrong wrong wrong in pretty much all areas with only a couple exceptions being the story, adaptation to the new fighting engine, and maybe some of the endings. Remember people, we got some solid characters to hold on to out of those games, and endings like Reiko, Raiden, and Fujin are ones that still stick out in alot of peoples minds today becasue of those games. They weren't completely bad to me simply becasue I could see the goal they were trying to accomplish.

That doesn't mean it wasn't a terrible game, just appreciated for the idea.
"E" for Effort!"....but it just reeked of suckiness.

"A failed attempt made those games bad, not to mention money.
They'd just rolled off the dispicable MKA the movie, the failed t.v. series Mk Conquest, and were, I believe, looking for a recoup of a loss in those side projects all at the same time. Out comes Mk4 and MkGold....plzzzt!

I think the comics happened before Mk4-G though, so it shouldn't apply here unless I'm wrong time line wise somewhere.

3. Mk Mythologies:
This game wasn't that damn bad actually. It just failed to be complete story wise. Gaping...GAPING holes there were.

It's the grandfather to what we're seeing in MkSM and in our current conquest modes. I like the conquest modes we've been getting because again, when I was playing Mythologies, I was the dude sitting there hoping for a game from Mk, that would allow me to fight melee style while going on pointed missions within the Mk universe.

I got damn near exactly what I was looking for in MkSM and in the Konquest modes of some of our current games.
For these reasons, I not only appreciatted MkMyth, but it now allows me to like the game. In hine-sight though. I enjoied it back then but felt the same way I do now about Mk4 & MkG....."Nice idea, but incomplete. I wait til the next one like this comes out."

4. Mk3, MkU3, MkT:
These were no doubt the best of the series for me. They had the detail and garaphical value I looked for from mk1 and 2, and they built on top of what was already there speaking of the engines, fatalities, and story lines. Everything was great. Yes, it was a step up for the series back then. The only thing I felt might have been missing is maybe a 3-d enviornment. But you know what? Who gives a crap when the rest of the game was so damn good.

Air combat was good, fatalities were nice, bloody, and butal, you got to run, you had the "Aggressor" feature there for no appearent reason other than to add to the adrenaline rush....uumm, 3-4 different ways to kill or make freinds with your opponent after you beat the crap out of them. Y'know, nice wholesome fun. Lolz.

Not to mention the roster, even though we did have a bunch of pallete swaps. Everybody was still pretty unique, it's just now millions of people demand a more appearent "difference" between them all.
These games were the best of Mortal Kombat to me and I still hold tournaments at my house specificlly for these games (ThePredator151 is the name, MKT is the game, buddy..you betta bring ya gameface).

5. Mk2:
I wish they could have kept the same graphical profile we got from that game. It was the best I have ever seen from a video game even today. Nice and crisp REAL PEOPLE. It made the fatalities that much better in "caring for your characters". They messed it up with Mk4. I don't wanna play with a cartoon after I just finished playing a game with realistic looking characters that I had then built repore with. I Don't Want A Cartoon! I want Mk2 graphics back now!

As far as gameplay, I always felt limited in this game and that was the worse part for me. Having all these ideas of ways I could do an opponent dirty, and not being able to take them out on "mine enemy". Mk3, U3, and T took care of this for me though.

6. Mk1:
The only realistic problem with this game is that it was new and people loved it. That's it. That is all and that is the bottom line.

Pretty much eveything else are "pros". It was ahead of it's time...in it's time. There were supposed to be crittical mishaps with it. Hate it or love it.

The graphics, then fatalities, then the story and it's characters sucked us all in.

7. MkDA MkD:
Parts of the story got extemely good and parts of the story sucked my ass twice. I couldn't stand the non-relavance of the "mini-games" to the core of the game.....the Fighting part of the game, and the fact that I have to mention Mk in different parts erk me sort of.

But then there's that conquest "part" again. Hmm...all they have to do now is make it longer, more in depth, and even more connected to the core of the Mk story and we will probably have something I can hold onto. (nudge: MKA)
I'll sit on that one for a couple more days.

I couldn't stand how strickened each character was in MkDA or MkD. They seemed more..."loose" or nanchialant(spelling??) in previous Mks'.

Fatalities took a turn for the worse though they were still decent and everything keeps getting more and more limited. We're supposed to have more space to work with as we progress technology wise right?
Well, when are they going to spend the bulk of that memory on the core of Mk?

Ah ha! KAKharacter, KAFatality, the "broken" engine is fixed now with MkA.
Sit on that one too for a couple of days.

8. MkSM:
I loved it! The only questionable parts were that it was probably too short, there wasn't enough in the fight part (more charcters ect), and the story wasn't exact. But I didn't mind these things at all because that game would have been the closest thing to an exceptable step for the MkMyth and Konquest modes. I loved it. I still play it form time to time. Breaks in weeks I don't play it are due to the shortness or repetiton of the game. Repetition kills that type of game.

I loved finding Mk2 in there and everything, the mellee in Co-Op had us going crazy for a few months. I want to see more from this type of game in MK.


9. That's all I'm doin', get outta here! Lol.


And that's the bust down as I see it people.


ThePredator151

Complaining about MK is pointless. They've gotten some things right and some things wrong with each new game. Also before I continue you mentioned can anyone tell the difference between samurai showdown, stf 2, and world hero's 2. I'd say that's a resounding yes. World hero's and street fighter are a bit similar. I mean world heros litterally has the ripoff ryu/ken characters, but have you even played samurai showdown? I'm not calling it the best of the 3 but it sure as hell was a lot different in how you played and what you did. The POW guage alone was something that was totally lacking in the other two. Also people mention a bad start for the MK series with pallet swaps in 1. Have any of you played street fighter 1? I have. My god talk about a shitty game.

Moving on though I think i'll mention some pros and cons of each:
MK1:Pro: Basically considered amazing because of the violence, but it was something totally new and no matter what you say it's right up there with street fighter 2 in making the fighter genre what it is today. Fatalities and unique special moves(I thought the idea of freezing your opponent was so unfair after playing stf2. Then I saw scorps spear and immediatly decided the whole game was rigged.), and unique bosses(4 armed goro, and shape shifting) along with a different look and feel pretty much made this game.
Con: the beginning of pallete swaps with our friends scorp, sub, and reptile. To be honest I don't really know how balanced the gamepaly itself was since I was about 5 or 6 at the time, so I can't do too much here.

MK2: Pro: Everything about the last one refined even more. More characters, better looks, great feel, more fatalities, and suddenly you had friendships. It was basically just better than the pervoius on all levels that I can think of. Also although this holds for all the games as with reptile in the last one they were very good with obscure hidden secerets such a noob and smoke.
Con: The beginning of female pallete swaping and I think last I heard high level gameplay was competitive turtleing. Also as mentioned we get two more swaps with noob and smoke suddenly appearing.

MK3: Pro: Again new characters, and the first major revamp to the fighting system. Running and combos are added and more interactive stages.
Con: I don't think too many people were happy with the removal and changes of certain ninja's and we got more pallete swaps. Not to mention the cyber ninjas. This still leads to problems personally becasue since they couldn't totally lose scorpions spear move they gave cyrax the net. I'll go into how this causes problems later. Also many characters who aren't liked (stryker) are introduced. Also the fatalities are beginning to be absurd(JAX)

UMK3: Pro: probably the best one in terms of all out balance. Defintly still a wide tier list though it had a great selection of characters and nothing was too absurdly strong.
Cons:pallet swapping and by this point the stories for various characters are totally redundant or just flat out absurd.

MKT: Pro: well you had everyone. Kinda fun for those who never went near high level play. noob and rain are finally playable.
Con: story? Balance? Pallet swaps! Story is gone, balance is shot(who came up with the idea of a no block projectile and mind control orb?) and we've got 1/3 of the charcters as the technicolor ninja's. Also the aggressor bar and brutalities.

MK4 Pro: the jump to 3d. New characters. Weapons. Breakers. The first one to start making the characters truely look different.
Con: The jump wasn't that great. Max damage, crummy balance, and just generally a bad move to 3d.

MKGold: pro: Mk4 with more characters.
Con: Still mk4.

MKDA: Pro: A major overhaul to all the gameplay and everything. Style's, weapon's, new looks and of course new characters. Also did a decent job of trying to get everyone's stories back on some reasonable track. After the 5 years of massive failures before this(The only game in that time i consider to be any good is mythologies) DA does a decent job of bringing MK back.
Con: one fatality, no pits, backdash cancel and other glitches hurt balance.

MKD: Pro: Death traps are a new gameplay device and of course more characters. Also mini games in the form of puzzle and chess kombat.
Con:Death traps are found to sometimes be a pain in the ass. Serious glitches make game unplayable at high level(bo rai cho anyone?).

There's probably alot more that could be said but it's 5 am so i'm probably forgetting alot of it.

To the Classic discussion forum with you.

well in my opionion, Mortal Kombat did not take a turn for the worse with Mk3, I rather enjoyed alot of the new additions to the game, such as running and combo's. Yes we all know how lame Stryker is, but some cool new characters were introduced, (nightwolf, Sektor, and cyrax). Shao Kahn was not recycled at all, I thought the whole earthrealm invasion was right along the lines of Kahn's personality. Although I disliked the whole maskless sub-zero thing.

In my opinion MK took a deep nose dive with MK4 and MK Gold. Although the games were trying to modernize the franchise, they lacked serious depth in characters and storyline. Not to mention the whole is Reiko actually Shao Kahn debate which was utterly foolish. Shinnok had potential to be cool, but his gimmick was a cheap rip off of Shao Kahn's, and Shinnok lacked all of the memorability of Kahn, who's voice is still well renound in the video game industry. Gold attempted to fix some of the short comings of 4 by adding baraka and Cyrax to the game, but it couldn't turn the tide with part 4. Indeed Kenshi however was an exceptional addition.

Now we move on to deadly alliance. While the gameplay was a step in the right direction, the whole lets make Shang Tsung a badass thing again was spent after his rejuvenation in MK2. The thing that aggravetd the hell out of me was the fact that Shang Tsung and Quan Chi, two cowardly and rather weak sorcerers were able to overpower both Shao Kahn, and Liu Kang, although in Kahn's case it turned out to be a clone. But how many times had liu destroyed Shang TSung? Well lets see, every MK that both characters were involved in together. Now all of a sudden Shang tSung teams up with the albino baldy, and they kill kang? no way doesn't fly, Kang had defeated Motaro, Goro, Kintaro, waves of extermination squads, assassins, Baraka, Reptile, Shinnok (an elder god), and most importantly Shao Kahn, who had personally killed many many warriors for thousands of years, as well as kept Shang Tsung cowering like a weasel. But now all of a sudden he can't defeat two cowardly fools, that he had defeated before. I don't buy it. Also they introduced Hsu Hao.....YUCK.

Mortal Kombat Deception to me was just a continuation of DA. It seems that they needed a stop gap filler until they were ready to push Armageddon out on shelves. So they concocted a story of the fabled and powerful Dragon King the mighty Onaga. Gimme a god damned break. Onaga was the lamest Boss in MK history, during kombat all he did was groan and roar, and it was so lame, at least when Goror roared it sounded fairly intimidating. His storyline was neither interesting nor useful, and he looked like a big awkward and goofy Bat creature. He sucked in combat, and had nothing memorable or worthy of recognition, and now without his kamidogu hes useless. However on a bright note, some characters who before had been lame, (Ermac, Kabal) were made into bad-asses. Also some kool characetrs like Darrius and Havik were brought into the franchise, and finding out the fate of the original Sub-Zero was huge(noob Saibot) I had been wondering since MKII where he disappeared to.

Now it seems that MKA is definitely a step in the right direction.

On a personal note Shao Kahn at full strength would demolish that annoying overgrown winged dragon fly Onaga.

Does anyone else find Onaga as horrible as I do?

Ok, Mortal Kombat II was going to be a hard act to follow. When one compares MK3 to MK2, of couse MK2 would turn out as the better game. BUT STILL MK3 has it strong points. Sektor, Cyrax, and Kabal, fan favors show up for the first time. The new combo system. I like Motaro as a subboss, it was a change from the 4 arm shokan's we had. If you want Shokans, we got Sheeva. I like all the new fighters coming into MK3.

Stryker was a amazing fighter. He was indeed more human than the others. BUT with Cage MIA, I had to find some replacement. and Stryker fitting pretty neat. in FACT, out of the new fighters, Curtis is my favor fighter in that game. Sheeva is 2, I always like the ideal of a female shokan. She rock.

The robots were impressive. I like the whole Cyber story line, and Subzero a traitor to the clan story line here. And Khan finally counqers Earth Realm. For a few Weeks that is. It was on loan. lol.

Over all its a pretty good fighting game. Not as good as MK2 of couse, but hey, you cant always follow a game like that.

Just ask Street Fighter 3 lol. Outside of the new Parrying system, SF3 did not add anything. They took out fan faves like Guile and E Honda, and replace them with, Well most of the fighters in that game are under 18 lol. Jen, and his twin. Elena was pretty cool. BUT they relie on Ryu and Ken to carry that game. SF3 is a good game in its OWN right, but as with MK3. It had a impossible act to follow.

I never understand this though. MK makes a bold move. And people smack it. SF does nothing but add a parrying system, than take out the old, and add in the new, which in SOME ways are the same fighters.

Hugo was just Zangie,
Elena was DJ.
The English boxer was Balrag.
Hell Jen and his Twin were Cammy lol. I mean we got a lot of knockoffs here. BUT SF never gets the same smack talk that MK does.

mka...a decent game?!?wow i think ur the 1 with the problem u havent even tried mka yet so give it a chance...u should try it out b4 u judge it..u pissed me off

maybe in your opnion. personally, i think umk3 is just as broke as mkd.




"However, how can you possibly say that the fighting mechanics in MK3 were better than those of MKII? MKII had real combos that had to be meticulously planned while MK3 had senseles dial-a-combos. You say only MK and MKDA had non-broken fighting systems, but MKII was the same exact engine as MK, only smoother and with a more diverse mix of moves such as turn-around kicks low jabs. "

i never said it was better. but anyhow, look at the number of bugs and infinites in mk1 and mk2. mk2 is far worse. thats how i can say it. mk, umk3, and mkt all had the same engine. they just tweaked it along the way. anything that you could do in mk2, you could still do in the mk3 series. all they did was add a run and dial combos.

"Maybe I'm not a huge fighting mechanic expert, but I really can't tell a difference at all in the fighting engine used in MKDA and that used in MKD except for the addition of combo breakers. "

i can tell that by this thread in general. you know nothing of the gameplay mechs at all or this thread probably wouldnt have been made. play mkda for an hour. then put in mkd and play it. the recovery times was slowed down, every character in mkd has multiple infinites, free throws, and glitches out the ass.

How dare you say MK3 was a step in the wrong direction?

MK2 sucks.
MK3 rules.
UMK3 rules even more.