You don't understand what I'm saying...IT IS POSSIBLE FOR ANY CHARACTER TO BEAT ANY CHARACTER, NOT CONSISTENTLY IN A MAVADO VS BO RAI CHO SITUATION, BUT POSSIBLE. EVEN IN HIGH LEVEL...WE ARE ONLY HUMAN FOR CHRIST'S SAKE.


I wasnt talking about human error. I was talking about character vs character.

And salvadon, im giving examples, not talking tekken. Jesus christ....im not posting here anymore. Nobody has any sense here

good.






and i wasn't realy talking about human error either, so much as forcing that error upon them through deceptive tactics...
like the early MK2 ancestors of MKDA's high low mixups.

PS.
your POSTS are all garbage.
goodbye.

robojop Wrote: I wasnt talking about human error. I was talking about character vs character. And salvadon, im giving examples, not talking tekken. Jesus christ....im not posting here anymore. Nobody has any sense here

MK_Legend Wrote: jumping out is not the correct way to escape. and u can NEVER ss the hellfire after a shove.

i'm trying to piece together what i've seen for it being escaped...

am i right in thinking you need to walk inward or back away from your opponent to get out of it?

i swear someone jumped backward out of it on me once(im the only one who ever picks scorpion usually, go figure).

i might be wrong tho, i could have been slow on the draw with the fire...

that happens once in a while if im REEELY stoned.
like now

speaking of the shove, im starting to think drahmins best stance is oni, purely for the shove. while netherealm is his most damaging stance, if you stay in oni u don't take the damage of his weapons stance and if you abuse his shove, your opponent can't even touch you, really makes up for his lack of melee ability. and after a shove, backdash to really create some distance. anyone agree?/disagree?

yes, I totally agree. When I play Drahmin that is the stance I use the most. That is how I play him too, keep away.

Drahmin's best stance IS Oni. It's the only reason why he's top tier. It's all about shoving and b,f+2ing to chip damage will time runs out on their ass. For a while people were saying that drahmin has a b,d+4/b,f+2 mix up, but it's not really a mix up. Drahmin raises his leg when he goes for the pound, so anyone that pays attention to his feet won't get fake out.

Tiers matter very much. All we are trying to say is that everyone has good chance in MKDA. I only got pissed at MKL because he stated things as if it were fact. It only furthered my aggrivation when he stated crap like he can beat me 100 times and shit. I may not be as "high level" as he is, but I know that I can take him a few rounds.

Back to the tiers. All im really seeing in the top tier section is scorp,shang,sonya,bo,sub,drahmin and nitara. I also see Cyrax and Mavado as low. The rest i'd give mid tier. When TiT5 rolls around we can lay out a solid tier list.

If this thread is such garbage, jop, maybe you should go back to TZ. Im gonna take a guess and say MKL imed you and asked you to "talk us straight". All you did was put an already corrupt chat into even more chaos.

This thread is starting to go stale. It was great for the first 3 pages, then a few people(who I shall remain nameless) decided to come in and state things like they created the game or some shit. And then theres a few who brought tekken in here. I beg all of these people to contribute or leave. This place is the only thing us MK players have. The TZ thread closed down since no one posted there. Earthrealm and TRMK are full of casual players who dont care about serious talk. This is all we've got. If this dies..bye bye MK community. Instead of dogging each other, lets contribute to the community. MKL, I would like to be the first to say sorry for dogging ya like that. Im sure your a great player with insane skills, but some of the things you stated are over the top. MKDA is too fresh to have real tiers.

I'd also like to say sorry to Devil. You did contribute, and I appologize for talking shit about you.

Konqrr and Salvidion, I strongly advise saying sorry,too. Lets end this shit and continue to build the first ever serious MK strat thread.

There better be vids for TiT5. I want thousands to see my SZ skills : D!

definately agree with you versatile, when mk just came out the ps2 board on gamefaqs had a few above average players, but they all seemed to disapear. this sorta seems like the only watering hole.

on the topic of drahmin his (oni) 2, seems safe on block (backdash helps after its blocked). and 2,2,p-clock? (is the most damaging thing you can do off it?) drahmin's his throw? after his throw doesnt seem like you can really do much damage (even including relaunching with stomp) unless your in netherealm.

(netherealm) throw,3,4 (24%/39%[powered])

or does anyone have any good oni stuff off his throw?

yes, I got a little out of control...sorry to jop and mkl for any offence...let's get back to the meat of this thread.

I don't have much new cuz I got no comp and no time, but the more I play Mavado, the more I like him...he's a very linear player and hard to win with, but he's got good lows and quick attacks.

i haven't said anything i haven't meant.

no kombat last night, this is my weekend and i may not play again till sunday.

if i think of anything useful before then i'll post.

Versatile Wrote: I'd also like to say sorry to Devil. You did contribute, and I appologize for talking shit about you.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
no prob dood!

i also think when TiT's said and done, we'll know alot more and everyone can contribute good strats/ideas based on seeing 'high-level' play...he he....
peace out bros.

MK_Legend Wrote: konqrr Wrote: timco Wrote: What do u think of this konqrr? Shove -> Hellfire can be escaped by a well timed jump or sidestep. It's not easy if you don't know how to do it right, but my brother does it all the time...nobody uses it on me so I'm not sure of the timing...no comp jumping out is not the correct way to escape. and u can NEVER ss the hellfire after a shove.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
well, since shove leaves you standing afterwards, there's a limited number of options available once you 'recover' to avoid the ensuing hellfire:
1) jump kick?
2) just jump?
3) SWR?
4) SWL?
5) W forward?
6) W backward?
I believe that about covers the possiblities and since MKL's statement is 'general' it can't be a character specific thing based on special moves...(for instance, kung lao's spin kicks are fast and avoid lot's of shyte ie. sz's freeze ball, shang's straight fireball, frost's ground freeze, etc..but will they come out fast enough to avoid hellfire?)...
If you're inputting the hellfire at the fastest possible speed (don't believe you can buffer this), the escape window is limited indeed...

peace out bros.

I'm kinda concerned there'll only be a few fighters picked at tit5. There will be lots of scorpions, bo's, sonyas, drahmins, ST's, nitaras and some sz's.

What's up with Li Mei btw, she's the only character I heard NOBODY talk about, is she that bad? ;)

I've become rather good with scorp and drahmin and am training my SZ skills. I do however think it's a shame nobody (including me ;) picks raiden or JC or CY or someone like that, all low tier?

What do u all think of the 'never picked' characters, do they still have potential? Along with SZ maybe I'll pick one of those chars to experiment with...

I really like Li Mei...she's really fast and her best stance is definitely her first one. All of her damage comes from 4,4,CS,b+1. Once you are in Lui He Ba Fa, she has some really long range sweeps with b+3 and d+3 which you can mix up with her f,d+3 special. Be careful though, if you try to walk forward then do her d+3 sweep you will get the f,d+3 special. I'd recommend doing b+3 sweep instead. This reminds me of when MK2 first came out and Mileena's Tele-Kick was done by pressing f,b+LK, so you'd walk forward then try to sweep and you'd get the telekick and be screwed...Anyways, Li Mei can and will be punished for abusing repetitive moves. I think her Sai's suck...found no real use for them and they do hardly any damage, only juggle is u+2 and that doesn't lead to much.

Raiden (Staff, counter) and Cage (Very quick) are excellent characters, Cyrax is fun but not worthy to step up to the challenge of the better fighters. He can win, but it's not likely.

konqrr Wrote: Cyrax is fun but not worthy to step up to the challenge of the better fighters. He can win, but it's not likely.

It's a shame they made the bombs so slooow to come out, otherwise the tactical use of them would make nice strategies. I sometimes use him against friends that really can't play mk, the cutter is so nice ;) I also really like his fatality, not that it has anything to do with his skills.

You can use bombs strategically after Ninjitsu 1,1,b+1,CS...If you catch them with that combo then a close bomb into Sambo 2...that's 47%! They don't have much time to react, so you are in control of the situation.

He's real fun

MK_Legend Wrote: jumping out is not the correct way to escape. and u can NEVER ss the hellfire after a shove.

It's not a good idea, I know due to the threat of spear...but that's the only way I know of to escape it. And for all who don't know, you have to do d~uf or d~ub like you would do a backdash cancel after a move in Pi Gua.

What's the correct way MKL? Enlighten me

my random thoughts/strategies on scorpy:

i am an U+4~spear whore....
most of my current gameplay consists of these three ideas:
1)u+4~spear to 2,2,CS,2,CS,1,1,3,
--u+4 has HIGH priority and is **relatively** safe on block
2)2,2,4 mixups...nice safe string with great high/low mixup potential...can SS after the 4 or use d+4 instead (thanks MKL)
3)hellfire cheeZe...d+4,hellfire and others...also at the ends of juggles; instead of using moves that knock the opp. away, say for instance, you land 2,2,CS,2,1,1,3~hellfire and begin the hapkido mix-ups...
This is primarily my entire scorpy game..
I also hardly ever use pigua other than the shove to gain space and a few low strikes...anyone care to share?
Peace out bros!

devilgene Wrote: ...anyone care to share?/font>

This combo is prolly well known but since U haven't post it I will, it's very basic and doesn't do great damage but it looks extremely cool so... Hapkido: 2,3, u+4, u+4, f, b+3 The FKF has to be timed and connects in air, there's no high damage but it'll earn u some style points, something scorpion players need IMO Sorry if this is old news, I haven't used guides and am a PAL user so I'm a little late posting combos...
Posting another 'style' combo for Nitara, no max damage but keeps opponent airborn in Kama...so start in second stance power up 1,1,3,5,2,b+4,b+4 edit: thanks for the input

timco Wrote: 1. Hapkido: 2,3, u+4, u+4, f,b+3 2. Fu Jow Pai: 1,1,3,5,2,b+4,b+4

1. I like to add a hit to that with: 2,3,u+4, u+4, 4, f,b+3

You're better off doing just 2,3,u+4, u+4, then when they land do hellfire so you can set them up for more mayhem.

2. End that combo with b+4, b,d+4. It looks much better.

Raiden is mid tier in MKDA.If you don't count the reversal, Nan Chuan sorta sucks. He does have 2 sweeps that Scorp has, but overall his 2 hand to hand stances suck. He's all about the staff. He's really weak at close range so ya gotta punish risky shit with sm and 4,4,b+4(or is it b+2? I never play Raiden). Another great aspect of Raiden is his command throw (f,f+1). Not only is the damage solid and it gives you good space, but it's perfect for wall damage. However, if blocked you are screwed. Overall, Raiden can compete, but you have to be safe.

JC is possibly the best mid tier in the game(although Quan Chi and Hsu Hao give him a run for his money). JKD is illness. You've got u+4 which tracks slightly, and you've got 2,2,3,3 which starts mid. Karate has u+3 which has an auto ss and is pretty safe on block. Nunchaku has got the great 1,1,1,1 which is safe on block and does great damage. You've also got d+1 and d+3 which both recover fast and break up combos rather successfully.JKD:2,2,3,3,cs,b+2,cs,2,4 was thought by some to be his strongest juggle(not counting walls), but 2,2,3,3,cs~b+2~cs~1,2,4 is very possible if you've got fast fingers. Check for Konqrr's cage vid if he decides to try this baby out if ya need the timing for it. Gotta get my ass a good computer and a camera.

u+4 with Scorpion is good, but it isn't all that safe on block. Only use it when you know it will hit. I don't play much Scorp, but when I do I like to use u+4~b,f+1,2,2,cs,2,cs,1,1,3,4,1,1,3 for 33% damage.

Li Mei is decent, but you have to have a seriously tight defensive game to win with her. Baji Quan is gonna be your main stance if ya play her. She's got 4,4,cs,b+1 for your juggles and a great side step. LHBF has some seriously safe moves like 1,1,2,4. She also has two sweeps in b+3 and d+3. The sai is the worst weapon in MKDA, but atleast she has u+2 for a launcher. Lastly, d,b+4 may very well be her best move. It does great damage, is fairly safe on block, and is just an all around great move. Use it to punish shit when you are too far away to do 4,4,cs,b+1.

Cyrax is the worst in MKDA, but he can compete. If you want a chance of winning, you'll mainly use Pulse Blade. u+1 is super fast and does decent damage, and you can sort of mix it up with b+3 to mess with your opponent's head. Besides that and the bomb setup Konqrr gave, Cyrax doesn't have much. I'd crap my pants if a Cyrax player placed in the top 5 at TiT5, but all the power to the great Cyrax players out there!

Just in case you guys don't know this already, Jax has 2,2,cs,4,b+2,b+2,4,4,cs,4,f,f,d+3 which does 50%, and the f,f,d+3 is guaranteed! Jax also has *wall* 2,2,cs,4,b+2,b+2~cs~cs~2,2,cs,4,cs,4 which does about 63%. Jax is also one of the best mid tiers in the game..such a solid fighter.

SZ is too fricken good! I already mentioned earlier that 1,2,b+2,b+2~b,d+2~cs~sm~1,2,cs does 33 damage! Also, don't forget that SZ gets a free powerup juggle off of a d,f+1 or a b,d+2. Screw finesse and go for Dragon: sm,1,1,2,d+2,1,2,cs for 37% damage!(yes, the same damage as Hsu Hao's branch). The illest thing about it is that it has a 20% chance of doing 47! I'm not sure if I mentioned this earler, but Kori: 3,cs,b+2,cs,1,2,cs does 20% and is possibly the strongest juggle you can get off Kori: 3.

Versatile Wrote: 1. Gotta get my ass a good computer and a camera. 2. Li Mei's d,b+4 may very well be her best move. 3. Jax has 2,2,cs,4,b+2,b+2,4,4,cs,4,f,f,d+3 4. Dragon: sm,1,1,2,d+2,1,2,cs for 37% damage!(yes, the same damage as Hsu Hao's branch). The illest thing about it is that it has a 20% chance of doing 47!

1. I'm living proof that you don't need a good computer. I use a 300Mhz P2 cpu with 96MB of RAM using a PCTV card and a VCR.

2. It's good to close the distance on a turtle too.

3. I have a vid of it, see Jax 57% on my website. Credit is to MK Legend, of course.

4. The only reason it might do different damage is because they are in their weapon stance. And I agree, Sub-Zero is wonderful...Dragon d+3 anyone? LOL

This is probably common knowledge (I'm sure you good players know this already)...I haven't even tested it yet, but it makes sense. If you are in your weapon stance and your opponent lands a combo on you, quickly switch stances. You will take 15-25% less damage than you would if you stay in the weapon stance.

Shit, I wasn't even thinking of the weapon stance thingamajig. forgot that you take more damage in that stance. Also, I knew about the taking less damage if ya switch out thing, but im sure others didn't, so thanks for posting that.

You got aim Konqrr? If so give me your aim name.

Versatile Wrote: You got aim Konqrr? If so give me your aim name.

Let's see, my AIM name is uh...Konqrr

I'm usually on in the mornings and evenings MST.

on a tangent:
i'd be surprised if we don't see bo rai's infinite steal some rounds at TiT...AFAIK: it hasn't been banned because it takes a 'moderate' amount of skill to pull off, but if you land the starter sequence, it's PEACE OUT!!
peace out bro's.

devilgene Wrote: i'd be surprised if we don't see bo rai's infinite steal some rounds at TiT...AFAIK: it hasn't been banned because it takes a 'moderate' amount of skill to pull off

pffft...whatever, it's easy as hell. On my bro, LOL.

I'm sure that infinites are banned...if not, then I'd be pretty damn pissed for spending all that $$ and traveling all that way for that bullshiznit.