depending on the character list on this game it could be the reason for me to buy a 360 or ps3

Gamers are VERY burnt out and the die hard fans of years past have long since abandoned this franchise and moved on to better fighters and for good reason: lack of overall quality. Armageddon was the last straw for me honestly, i told myself I was done with this franchise until it can do something different and now they have so my interest has been reignited. The one good thing that's come of this crossover is the MK team finally grew a pair and stopped catering to this "casual gamer" fan base MK's acquired over the years because in my opinion if you are more interested in mindless violence over functional gameplay then you are part of the problem. Mortal Kombat needs to start catering to fighting game fans NOT Mortal Kombat fans and MK vs DCU COULD be a step in the right direction, only time will tell.

There are a few factors that do influence the general Vox Publica and the direction everyone is turning his head:

-fighting games are dwindling, only franchises are on the menu. Imagine a new fighting game hitting as hard as Tekken, DOA, SF or even MK. MK being the most isolated in terms of sales theatre, it is no suprise.

-alot of big names are announced and coming. Certain series just announced their sequels, and among them are some quite powerful games: Red Alert 3, Starcraft 2, Resident Evil 5, ... theese games made more then all MK games together, especially Starcraft. Not to mention the phenomenon of Duke Nukem Forever.... people are anxious after the trailer after 10 years.

-go read GU comics, not ebcause of the humour, but because of gaming news and related stuff. Alot is in motion currently in the industry.

I do not think that MK vs. DC is underrated, it is just that alot of factors are simultaneously keeping everyone else busy. This is why MK falls on face, because it still does not possess relevancy after 2000.







HOLY HELL....RED ALERT 3 ?????

Out of interest, more than debate, don't you think MK really fell from the mainstream something post MK3? UMK3 and MKT might have kept the name bouyant, but I daresay the series all but left the mainstream vernacular by that point.

I'd argue MK4's step into the '3D' world was probably the blow that pertains to the topic of the "gaming world." I feel like that was the point where everyones concessions for a barren 2D fighter went out the window, and they could concisely lump the series in the 'punchline' file, a few draws below the Tekken drawer.

I feel like I remember eagerly picking up an issue of UKPSM to check out a pre-review for the game, and it got a half-page write-up with a 6/10. Which struck me at the time as a turning point in the relevance of a series that, I thought, took a dive with MK3, and spun it's wheels with revisions that slowly lost relevance to anyone but nostalgia fans of the series.

What surprises me is that I've recently heard reviewers throwing MKII a bone still, albeit, more as a regurgitation of consensus, than their own critical opinion.

Considering that the most quality I find is found in MKDA, and character-wise in MKD, not really. However the gameplay is well beyond that problem. The truth is that the content in MK is extremely relative - meaning: nobody cares about a character, plot etc... MK is about gimmicks. And nowadays you cannot live from presenting over-the-top violence to a crowd so desensitized as us.

Adversus gameplay, gimmicks fail. And nowadays you need gameplay, as nothing else is relevant.


P.S: I consider MK3 and MK4 for being solely responsible for the trash amount of weakass designing in characters and plot handling. For the love of Christ, Hsu Hao is a Byronesque tragic hero compared to garbage like Kai, spandex ranger-ninjas and Shinnok.

While I'd agree that MKDA is easily the most solid MK game, and maybe that it was a blip on the radar as a return for a recognised franchise, but I think the goodwill within the industry (and gamers) was probably already gone by that point. I think the relevance had dissipated post-MK3.

I'd disagree about the importance of the characters and plot, because really, that's always been the key element working in MK's favour.
I personally don't believe any of the 2D gameplay came close to genre rivals, but the series has done well to make up for it's technical failings with a relatively strong sense of design and creative centre. Sure, there are a lot of gaping holes when it comes to maintaining that, but there are usually a lot of balancing positives.

I think gaming in general is in a really disappointing generation gap where the YouTube generation (and younger) are taking a market share with their dollars that funded more and more flash over substance and anything resembling thought.
I wouldn't pin that failing exclusively on the MK brand, because I think MK has always relied on the characters, as much as the silly gimmicks.

I don't know if it'll be relevant to MK's significance within the gaming community, but I'll be interested to see how something like MGS4 does in the current climate. As far as I can tell, it might be the first major vote for story on the new generation consoles, and it has the advantage of appealing to the glut of military games clogging the industry.

Which leads me to my Special Forces 2 pitch...

If you're going to say MK is about gimmicks, then that applies to all games...really, or movies.... Otherwise, not really...MK has always been about the storyline, unique characters, gore and darkness. You obviously haven't read more on this site especially concerning "what MK fans are about" have you seen the countless threads ranting about someones "bio" or "storyline"? I have....don't say nobody cares about MK in content, because they do....in fact TOO Much at times.

Gimmicks? ok, let's discuss

Sony PS3-gimmick? Blu Ray among the ridiculous price of 600 bucks thinking people will go ga, ga over that....clearly not the case as you see.

Xbox 360 Elite..gimmick? Elite version with more memory, thus getting people spend more money. normal 360

Nintendo Wii..gimmick? Well, intially yeah I felt it was...but at least it delivers with the interactiveness of the wii remote....so partially gimmick but at least plays well and is apart of the actual gameplay.

Also, MK has had good gameplay. MK1, MK2, UMK3, MK:DA and MKA. MK:SM and MKM all played well, fact. So, if you want to have a preference, so be it but keep in mind if you bring up gameplay be prepared to explain why otherwise it's just another false theory in my mind, I happen to play all the MK's competitively, so not to sound arrogant but I know. Have been for years. I don't just play these games twice a week every few months like most casual gamers do.

As for your Hsu Hao vs. Kai, well we all have our preferences...as you can see in that thread of mine, most people hated and do indeed dread Hsu Hao except for you and a few others. To be honest, I was surprised he got that many votes...but perhaps you're referring to MK:DA? Kai was introduced in MK4, not Hsu Hao. He was introduced in MK5 aka MK:DA.



Or how about SC4.....Star War characters...you're telling me that's not one big "attraction" gimmick? Please....

or...SF4 with making a "SF2" more or less with a new graphical cell shaded engine and a few "new characters" which btw are hardly appealing, maybe one but personally let's face it people want to see Bison, Sagat etc back not some girl that looks dominatrix lol. Let's face it, Capcom had to do something big to get the oldschool SF fans back, so what better way then to go "oldschool" with SF2 era again....

I can go on and on but surely you see my point Chrome.

I think the only people who really care about this are the angry MK fans, the DC fans of which opinion I don't know, the fans of MK who think it might be okay, and the fans of both who are liking it.

... people complained about chain combos in MK3 and after Killer Instict because they were Chains.

Oh by the way, you want a game without gimmicks? Play Longest Journey.
Faaar away from standard games, and it actually carries a meaning. And the list could go on....

Yeah, but you see the chain/dial up combos worked very well in MK3/UMK3....that's what most people don't realize. UMK3 is among the best MK's ever made factually, and it had dial ups and worked great. The people that "hated it" are the players that can't adapt to that combo system, they're used to the strings or some other kind of combo system. Of course not everyone likes MKs system or KI's or SC's or whatever....being that all fighters are drastically different from one another except for Tekken and VF, which are probably the most similar kind of "different fighters" out there.

Longest Journey, is that a PC game? Most games initially don't have gimmicks to start off with then usually they'll implement something down the line that is "boardline gimmicky"

Maybe its just cause DC has less than stellar characters. They were great for the 1920s-1970s, but since then they are just bland and boring.

As long as us MK fans and DC fans care about it!!!

Of course you "highly disagree". Of course.

You're going to "highly disagree" when you miss the point, and type out an entirely judgmental post, and have me judged wrong the entire time. You're also using the wrong proverb for a conversation with me about this.

I am not judging a book by it's cover. I know very well what that proverb stands for...I am a black man straight out the ghettos of America. lol I know all too well what it's like to be judged purely based on my looks(And I look like a criminal too, I gotta admit. I've been arrested for "fitting the description before. lol!). Anyway, there is literally no cover to look at. There is also no substantial content in the game to consider at this point. And you do not know better of any content, in order to tell me not to judge the content that is there.....

I am also not judging the gameplay, definitively. I haven't played it. So, it's impossible for me to do so DEFINITIVELY. Means that I can speculate, and compare all day long as a matter of my opinion. According to how I see it. And at the same time have an opinion based off of what they have given me to examine and determine whether I like it or not. YES, I can do that, and so can other people without YOU calling them a "hater".

You're getting all caught up in the picture comparisons that I've posted, seeing what you wanna see from my post, and ignoring my actual standpoint. There are people that are that dualistic MKF.
I am dualistic that way. I can recognize that I can't judge the game to a final degree, and at the same time, have an opinion that doesn't exactly agree with the logic. One simple statement that describes my standpoint?

I do not like what I'm seeing from this game right now because it looks bad, or old, or whatever iMo. But, I will reserve my final judgment until I actually play the game when it comes out.

I hope that is very clear to you now, and stops you from calculating that I am actually one of these people who do judge the game before it gets released. I'm not that. The difference is this:

NOT My Opinion: "This game will suck." Or "This game sucks."

What IS My Opinion?: "This game doesn't look good right now..and here's why -- Look at this, this, this, and this. That's why it doesn't look good to me."

Get it?



I wouldn't release unfinished work for one. Especially if my paycheck, and the future of my parent company depended on people liking it. So "No", but it wouldn't happen like that.

The same as I'm sure it's not going down with MK vs DC's pre-released content. THEY'RE DONE with what they've released so far, and they want people to JUDGE it, in order to see if they might want to CHANGE anything before the game actually comes out. Otherwise we would be getting the penciled Scorpion render, or partially colored Scorpion, and there would be some sort of disclaimer: "This is not done yet, but tell us what you think" // "WIP"...ect

The renders so far ARE DONE to the point that they need to be in order to show them to us, and THEY WANT us to critique them. That's what it's there for.

Can't you see that?



:::If they didn't want people to preview the game, and gain some sort of like or dislike to the coming game, they wouldn't show it to us until the release date.


:::Yea, so what I like SC. Couldn't tell you what the gameplay is like because I haven't played it. DUH. But I will tell you this based on my own opinion of their pre-released content MKF, SC4's gameplay Looks Better Than MKs right now.

Lol There's not just one way to look at a coming game dude. SC4 looks like it's gonna work very well, and it looks like it's going to be fun to play. MK does not.

First thing I said when I got a glimpse of SC4's gameplay was: "Wow, I wanna play that. If were coming out today, I know I'd buy that already."

First thing I said when I got a glimpse of MK's gameplay was: "WTF is that? I thought it was supposed to be all new. Didn't we just get alot of that from MKA?"



Ooh, You know what I'm gonna do right? K, here we go:

Go Get the Mitsurugi render, and show me the flaws you see....uuh, yea, I dare you to. LoL!

Chances are, you're not going to, because you're not capable, and nor do you know what you're looking at. So, nor do you know what you're talking about.

This:



Is a sad example of the last computer graphic that you've shown us - you've worked on.

These:







Are the last of mine. A hobby at that. aheheheh...

Now before you jump the gun, the point is not that I'm some sort of guru in computer graphics (yet). The point is....I'm Undeniably better than you, about graphic arts and computer animation. Lmao!

So, when I "rant"//critique on about a character render that Mk has recently put out, and more importantly, when I square off the comparative differences for you, it is totally within reason for you to pay attention to what I'm pointing at for you. Since you do not know better about what I'm pointing at, than me.

::::And another thing, I have never denied that they've improved graphically over the years. I have always said that this games rendered graphics, are barely an improvement from MKA. Which is exactly what I keep showing you. You could get that much of a difference, by spending a little more time in Photoshop, with the rendered graphics from MKA.

Yes, you absolutely can as a simple fact MKF:



Made by AKELDAMA aka Pr0d1gy of MKO. lol

::::You haven't shown that you have a good eye for computer graphics MKF, so cut it out with "I'm an artist" bit. You play with clay, dude. It's cool by itself....but that is not this.

I'm not trying to say that one is above the other or anything. Just saying, they're separate from each other. Treat it like that, and you'll be fine. "Singing is different from playing an instrument" Clay is different from Computer Graphics". It is what it is...

::::You haven't brought up 1 good point about graphics, or the progression in MK's graphics history. EVER., that I've seen from you. EeeV-EeeR. You have not ever done it, iMo. EVER. Hahaha..

You're only good point at all, (ever)is that it's impossible to definitively judge gameplay before actually playing it. I would stick to that if I were you. Thaat's you're strong point, right there.

::::And lastly here, I haven't ignored a thing. Not you, your ridiculous post that pussy-foot around me, not anyones critique, nothing. I haven't ignored a thing. Actually, can't believe that through all this typing, you can't tell how perceptually vicious I certainly am.



::::If I were close minded I would be...I'd be you, actually. I would rune the day someone I previously could hold a okay conversation with (me, - from your standpoint), would say something critical about our mutual favorite game.

That's pretty much how you've been to me since this games announcement MKF. I site sloppy graphics, and now we oppose each other. *shrugs* Oh well. Doesn't make me less experienced with computer graphics. iMo, it makes you transparent, cuz experience doesn't wiggle. Perception of a person does based on likes and dislikes. And since you don't have any experience about graphics...I question your integrity.

::::By that logic, I can start judging the game when E3 gets here. Which would be wrong again MKF. Because I personally, have not played it. However, they can give me more to form an opinion with. And more to decided whether I want to buy the game or not at E3. That much can be done.

::::Here you go with the "Im a high level online player" thing again. That's like saying, you can drink a latte faster than the next guy. Who cares?

And no it's not high level players that educate other people about gameplay. Those are perceptual people with a demand for more intuitive functionality within a pre-existing system.

The people who teach others, are those who have been taught or who have had experience in the field in question. Formally. And those people, are the ones who have had exposer to concrete information. As an example, oddly, I know what the file types JPG, GIF, and PNG stand for. How they effect the Kb weight of an image, how those things effect an animation, and what settings to use to get the best quality out of all of them.

Why? Cuz I've been exposed to that concrete information at some point, and to some degree. That information will not change. But you will change, depending on whether I like this game or not. Won't ya? Bet if I agreed with everything you said, you'd love it...

Proof?

::::You don't wonder why I "answered your own point" right there, do ya? You don't wonder why we agreed right there do you? LoL! It's because the only things you recognize are statements you have made. Go check everything Ive ever said to you about anything since this games announcement, and you will find the same message from me.

It is not "bad to judge a game before it's release because it's unwise". That would make you utterly broke($$), because everything an info-mercial flashed in front of your face, you'd say: "Well, I guess I can't judge until I buy it, ahuck!"

It's only unwise to definitively judge gameplay before you play it. In other words, you can't say it's bad, and have it be a fact of your opinion, unless you've played the game.

Nothing about that says it's bad to do so.



Best, most coherent, most clearly stated thing you've said thus far. *applauds*

That- is fine. You go ahead and spend your money on it....but I see some things I don't like. So I'm gonna opt for the demo, or this one free game rental I got from Blockbuster first.



Alright, I can get with that too.

I simply differ from that. I believe that if you're trying to get me to buy something from you, then you better put your best out there for me to see first. Because if it ain't the best you got, don't even show it to me. And if you put something less than your best out first, just based on "Ooh well, we're not done yet"....AND you know I'm not gonna like the idea to begin with? You will not sell one single item, to me. lol

You better change it or something, cuz I will not give you money for it...aheheh. The next person can have and be happy with it.



::::Depends on if I like what the trailer showed me.

I went a seen Dragon Wars because of their trailers....Terrible Movie iMo. But the point is, they put the best they had in the little trailer, and it made me spend money on 'em.

On the other hand, I was not impressed with Ironmans trailers(I knew about his character in the comics before the movie, but I couldn't give two shits about Ironman), but the buzz got me. So, I went and seen that movie too. That turned out to be the best movie I've seen at the theater in a long time.

Another instance, is that movie WAR with Jason Stathem and Jet Li in it. Saw that trailer and was like, NOPE. Catch the dvd.

::::Just to point out here, I go into every game with an open mind. If I'm fortunate to catch the trailer first, I give them a shot to impress me. MKvsDC failed terribly.

SC4 = Pre-Ordered

SF4 =Get pass the Art direction, and . Probably gonna pre-order that one too cuz it looks good for what they were trying to do.

Tekken = Didn't like the gameplay trailers, loved the graphics trailers...SO it's attractive this time, I'll probably play it to see if anything feels different.

VF5 = Nope, didn't like the gameplay trailers at the time, still don't like it, even after playing it.

DOA4 = Liked the trailer, Actually liked the game this time around.
====

So anyway, it depends what kind of trailer it is, and whether I like what they're showing me.

1. If I like it, and I am a fan, I'll probably pre-order the thing. Like I did with SC4.

2. If I like it, and I'm not a fan, I'll at least play it. Like what I'm doing with SF4.

3. If I don't like it, but I'm a fan, I'll at least play it. Like what I'm doing with MKvsDC.

4. If I don't like it, and I'm not a fan, they gotta try again with something else later.

All this can be decided before release.



I haven't seen anyone around here call someone who likes the game a name, just because they like the game. So you should probably stop it. Because you just said you would "When people stop knocking the "fans that actually like this game" and/or actually bring up logical, valid points...

Especially on the basis of making opposed, but logical points.

Everyone from Me, to people like Garlador & TemporaryUserName fits in that category. We're all sane, logical people who do not like certain things about this game, and you haven't known most of us for being illogical. Ever.

So I think you should honor the claim you just made, instead of using spite as a motivation to call another person a name. "hater" or anything else for that matter. We don't do it to you. And I know for a fact, I've never called you anything outside of abbreviating your user name. Maybe "Pete" once in a blue moon.

Anyway yea, that's my word on this...

=======

Oh PS: C'mon man, I know you know how to Edit HTML. Don't be a nuisance and quote this whole long thing. I mean at least bust it down like I did if you gotta do that..

Well mkflegend, I do respect your opinion, so don't think for a second that I'm trying to shout you down or whatever. It's kinda rare to have an argument on a message board that doesn't involve F-bombs and racism flying all over the place, so thanks for coming out swinging with well thought out opinions.

As for what Predator was trying to say, well, I think that there's a disconnect between what he's trying to tell you and what you're trying to tell him. I honestly have to side with him on this, because being a consumer and judging something as a consumer is entirely different than having people judge you on your work.

Okay, you're an artist. I've personally written poetry and short stories for a little over a decade now. Would it bother me if someone picked up and read the first unedited page of one of my unfinished stories and said "crap...not interested." Of course it would.

But the difference here is that I'm not selling my work. Midway purposely released that trailer to show the world, just as they are continuously releasing those renders. They're trying to draw interest and from the looks of it, the gaming press and non-MK message boards don't seem to be interested.

But let's take your example. Let's say that I was an award winning author who was trying to sell my latest book. Perhaps my publisher leaks the first chapter on the internet to both gauge and drum up public interest, but the interest simply isn't there.

Would I be frustrated? Absolutely. Idiots don't know a good book when they see one. Can I blame the public for not being interested? Absolutely not. Why? Because consumers shop by judging books by their cover. In any form of consumerism in this country, it's the sell, it's the cover etc that draws people in.

When I first see images, stories and concepts about a game, regardless of how close it is to it's release date, I can pretty much tell whether I'm going to buy this game. The initial punch from a publisher, that initial attempt to grab me will either succeed or fail and everything else after that will either strengthen my opinion or slightly weaken it.

I wasn't into the idea of looking like a moron while playing a plastic guitar, but now I'm hooked on Guitar Hero. So yeah, opinions can change. But for a vast majority of games, I know what I like and I know what interests me. Sure, like most consumers, if there's enough hype around a product, I might become more interested to the point where I'll research it.

But that's just it. There's no hype around this game. There's no interest, and that gets back to my original point. No one is talking about this game. If Midway can't lure me in, a long time MK fan that played MK1 through MK4 in all of their original arcade time periods and has owned every MK except for special forces, than what does that say?

I'm not an MK hater. The MK series is by far my favorite of all time. But over the years it has become more of a love hate type of deal as I watch other fighting franchises refine a good gameplay system to get better and better, while MK keeps trying to change their fighting system to disguise how shallow it truly is.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed MK:DA and MK:A as well, but on gameplay alone? MK is still lagging far behind the more modern fighters. So you take that, you couple it with a marriage that to me seems pointless, and yeah, I'm not nearly as excited as I was when I thought that MK was getting a complete reboot within itself.

As a consumer, I have that right to my opinion. You might think that it's premature, and of course, that could absolutely prove to be the case. But I'm looking at what I see (and sorry, compared to SC4's in game footage, the gameplay footage of MK vs DC, though at an EARLY STAGE, look's weak by comparison, with recycled animations and decent but not exciting use of the Unreal 3 engine), trying to hold back what I wanted so that I might take the game at face value, and it's just not there.

Consumers do research before they buy anything from laundry deturgent to movie tickets. They read previews, reviews, they listen to their friends, they get opinions and they draw upon their own interest and for me, MK vs DC is not only a faulty idea in and of itself, but it seems as though the gaming press and non-MK sites seem to share my apprehension.

Oh, and as far as Soul Calibur goes...

I'm talking about the original Dreamcast version here... That game was a masterpiece compared to the other fighters that were around at that time. Even nine years later, I can still dust off my DC, pop it in and have a great time with it.

SC is NOT a button masher either. It's one of the most strategic fighting games I've ever played. It's not like Tekken where you're basically looking to jump into your next flashy move.

A good SC player will use well timed dodges, guard impacts, and move their opponent around the ring using the right moves to keep their opponent where they want them. A good SC player can knock you around offensively and get a ring out or kill you with a good string of UNIQUE moves put together in combination (unlike MK or SF which has a few "special moves" and a "regular" move list that's far to similar from character to character).

Or a good SC player block at the right time, pick their spots, dizzy their opponent, anticipate throws and duck them etc etc. There is a ton of depth in Soul Calibur.

Yes, SC2 and SC3 were both pretty unimpressive when compared to the leap that the first one took over its competition at the time. But they're still pretty good, if somewhat unbalanced games.

If I were to make a top 5 fighting games of all time, SC would be right there for me at #2 behind MK2.

ThePredator151, meet mkflegend...

Oh snap!

Nice thread, a lot of good points made. But just to answer the question.

Yes, I got the same impression. I went to gaming forums, made a thread myself on a music forum with lots of gamers, asked friends (some of them are former MK players), etc. And I can say that 80% or maybe even 90% don't care.

How? Well I think there are many reasons. But I think tthat the last MK games are a big cause. There hasn't been a killer MK game for many years. Some say MK 2 was the last good game, some say UMK, etc. It varies, but it has been a long time...that is one thing we can all agree on. The last games weren't awfull, they just weren't great. And that is the thing MK needs to survive or spark interest.
And when the competition does a better job in those years, you can count on even lesser interest. Especially when they are all releasing the games at once. I think this is one of the main reasons.

There is a Dutch saying; "De koek is op"
Meaning litteraly; "The cake is gone"

Meaning there is nothing left except some crums.

Now, What can Midway do to spark interest? For one thing I think that midway should release a downloadable demo. I think that will spark the interest (which may result in more sales). All they need to do for this to succeed is .. well make a very very good game (demo).

Ok....you know I honestly have nothing personal against you but you did grind me up a little with some of your "off topic knocks" such as the art and apparently your lack of gameplay knowledge. My turn now.


Ok, Since most of that second half of that post was just utter nonsense(pointless knocks or insults) at least the second half I started to just roll my eyes once you tried "insulting" my artwork edit since you have no argument shows you're rather pathetic and desperate at this point. Actually, I get your point totally you don't seem to get mine but it's ok. I'd probably have better luck speaking to a wall at this point. I thought you were better then that Predator, but since you insist on taking personal shots let me tell you something you. I won't "flame you" because I try my best to avoid that but will say what I must regardless.

On the art thing, I really don't care for photo edits or comparison of art and....like I said, you're just going off topic now because I said something you didn't like and countered with a "personal attack" as oppose to making a valid point. But since you wish to compare art, ok you know speaking as how that's my second "render edit ever" and made it just for fun, you most likely are better then me in "edits" but dare challenge me in REAL art with your hands, say a sculpture or painting I'll own you with one eye closed. ; )And I guarantee most artists would agree a painting or sculpture literally hand made takes way more skill then computer edits. You see with that shit you have programs, tons of tools to help you out to much in my 2 year class experience. You can erase, go back a lot easier then if you're painting or sculpting, I took a few courses in school with CPgraphics. I wasn't sure what I wanted to do in art at the time, so I took a few. It's fun and challenging yes. But not nearly as challenging as a painting on canvas or sculpting with a block of clay. Now that's art. hehe but just so you know I've gotten more compliments with the edit then hating.

Now, First of all let me get this out of the way real fast, you're a hypocrite now...why? Well, because when I asked you about your own example of "work" and would you want it to be judged, you just told me you WOULDN'T want to be judged, yet you're doing just that to Midway/DC with MK8 lol. And you're clearly showing a bias for SC over MK. lol...that's fine, it's your preference but just so you know SC3 sucked ass in the gameplay department and SC4 needs to step up, FACT. If you don't believe it, go speak to TonyTheTiger, MasterMalone to name a few if you think I'm bsing you. SC3 had problems and isn't so great...but hey perhaps Master Yoda, Lord Vader and finishing moves now(ha, ha)will help sell more SC4 copies : ) despite if the gameplay is actually improved or not.

Also, please don't speak about something you have no knowledge of....I saw your 360 thread on the other forum, chances are you know nothing of the gameplay since you admit you sucked in most games you went online in. So, most likely that will include MK. If you disagree, lets play MKA sometime on xbox I know you have live, I'll school you literally if I must since you think it sucks, I'll teach you literally why it doesn't if you wish : )

No, you CAN'T judge the game yet based solely on a little, dinky preview or a few renders. You can get an "idea of the game" but you can't full out judge it yet. lol well you can but it's dumb and illogical. lol I'll still laugh at you and others on here for judging MK8 based off a few renders and a insanely small teaser, now THAT is ridiculous.


So, now you're bringing up "race" to try to prove a point? Ok, well then you've posted a great example for me then...you're black and you know what it's like to be "judged" for all the wrong reasons right? wow, so I guess it's ok to judge a game, bunch of hard working people trying to please countless fans then on a game that's hardly done huh? But not ok to judge a person? Obivously judging a movie or game is trivial compared to a person, but I firmly believe that nobody should judge anyone or anything on a jumping the gun conclusion ok. In that respect they're both the same.

I'm latino and can pull the "race card" too but I don't do that shit one, secondly I've come to realize that the world isn't fair and there will always be prejudice, racism in the world despite what culture you are. It's exists for everyone and every race, not just one or two. So, in that sense anyone that judges anything or anyone for the wrong reasons is just a jackass.

Garlador, Temp are skeptical but they're not "going out of their way to look for dumb things" to bash the MK renders on like some people have on here......just no. You see when some dipshit posts, "MK8 will suck balls ha, ha, ha, Boon is a fucktard" what exactly are they going by? Ohh so now they're a psychic right? or know everything about the gameplay, even though it's not out yet? hmmm. I'd say they're going on something called sheer stupidity personally with nothing valid to back it up. Ohh my fault, of course ha, ha, ha....4 renders so MK8 the "game itself" will reek of course. *rolls eyes*

The people you mentioned have even said in other threads, they'll be "fair" about it despite being sekptical. You on the other hand already have the game "horrible" which is just utter BS btw since you don't know, being as how you never played it. The most humorous thing about that statement is that you don't even play MK's or other fighters online at high level so please...humor me. If you did you'd post in the online forums, so that's how I know. Even I don't know how the gameplay will be, but looks better then the previous games and Check ohh yes that's right you most likely have no clue who he is, he's the combo, glitch, gameplay master on here...he already said MK8's gameplay will most likely be good and better then the past few, and you know what he was right with the last few MK's before coming out since he's talented in the "gameplay combo, what works and doesn't" department. So, I'll take his word any day over yours. Thanks

News flash, your OPINION IS NOT FACT! Arrogance can blind sometimes but seriously, you don't know shit in the sense of "MK8's gameplay" nor the actual whole game since it's not out yet. FACT. Nor do I, or anyone. Not even check, but at least he's stopping frame by frame via teaser to see what can work and what can't.

I like the renders, granted I like some more then others but to say they look horrible is just dumb. I'm not saying everyone has to "love them" but it's like KJ, myself, Akuma and many others said. They're easily on par with other fighters. I really don't care if you believe that or not, that's a fact. It's next genre and you can see the details a lot more crisp then MKA's. If you can't see this then I feel for you and that's not my problem.

You see, I respect your view honestly but from my personal experience. Just my own experience, Tekken requires more skill then SC. Yeah, I mean you can button mash in "either game" really but you see that's one bad thing about their system. In MK or SF, you button mash you won't win diddly know what I'm saying.


But you do bring up good points, the DC version was easily the best thus far concerning the SC series. I'm just saying the recent SC's weren't "all that hot" so when I hear someone rip into MK or SF, that's a SC fan(not saying you) just in general on this site, I can't help to laugh or step in because obviously they're "the fanboy" in that sense. And as for MKA and MKD, well MKD had a lot of issues but speaking as how I'm one of those competitive, high level and experienced players MKA is actually very good gameplay wise. Like I was saying earlier, if you happen to have online I can literally teach you or just speak to Check. He has PS2 online and has posted lots of good points on why MKA is a good game, and I must say I agree with him. It's balanced overall a lot more then MKD is(even though MK:DA is the best balanced and overall 3D game thus far) MKA is second for sure. You see what I'm noticing is a lot of people especially on this forum don't know that much about MKD/MKA's gameplay , especially MKA's. You see it works well enough to compete with other fighters, the sales of MKA also were better then MKD's and overall had lots of good elements. The mini games are easily better then in the past MK games then Tekken, SC etc. Overall, the older MK's are better but they can also easily compete with any other fighter. MK2, UMK3 etc.

I see your SC points, but just want to let you know that MK and SF have their own "strategic elements" within their games. It's just different from SC, DOA, VF and Tekken. All fighters have their own tactics that's unique.
I agree, although the recent MK games can be fun...they're nothing compared to the oldschool 2D MK's. Mk2 is definitely one of the best fighters ever, I agree. I respect your view, interesting points.
@Mick, if I mail you a dollar perhaps you can buy an argument instead of posting the same dumb picture over and over....that just screams "I have nothing" seriously... but remind me next time, I'll have to find a pic of a brick wall.

Yeah mkflegend, you and I agree on alot of points:

SC, to me, is better than SC2 and SC3.

MK1 and MK2 are the best of the MK series.

Tekken can be a very strategic game. I'd put Tekken 3 (my personal favorite of the series) in my top five all time favorite fighters as well as Soul Calibur and MK2.

Sure, SC can be button masher friendly. But to me that means that it's got a great pick up and play ability. You put a button masher in with a seasoned SC veteran and he'll wipe the floor with the button masher. Because SC does have alot of depth (as I've described in my earlier post).

Getting back to the subject at hand though, I see that Gamepro is doing a feature on MK vs DC in July (if that thread is to be believed, I didn't actually look into it).

So while I still think that the enthusiasm for this game is much more tempered than any MK game that I've ever seen since the beginning, I'll concede that the gaming press simply might not have enough to warrant reporting as of yet. Or perhaps Midway is being choosy with whom they impart details to at this point. I doubt it, but you never know.

So on that note, maybe I should rephrase my question:

Are MK fans excited about this game?

Based on what you guys have seen so far, from the character and background renders to the trailer... Or even just the concept as a whole... Are you guys psyched about this game? Are you going in with nervous aprehension? Do you not care that much because it's a new MK game (technically I guess)?

I think we can all agree that we'd be more enthusiastic if this were a true MK sequel, so that's pretty much beside the point.

From everything you've seen so far, does this game, and even the idea/concept of this game get you interested? What interests you and/or what turns you off?

Well I'm more curious then enthousiastic. Curious about the direction MK is heading, because its "reinvented". I want to know what I can expect for the next MK's. Because they will probaly use this as a basis for the next MK's (like MKDA - MKA).

Things that interested me from what I've seen so far;

- Character design that looks less exaggerated/cartoony

Things that turned me off;

- Shown gameplay elements (free fall kombat, close combat)

You know, you incriminate yourself every time you go in, thinking it's a good idea to argue with me. Also, up until the point where you get all sensitive and whatnot, you speak better. Beyond that, you sidestep points that have been proven to you. So, with that said.....

Thanks for editing the html, and I'd appreciate it if you call me ThePredator151 from here on out instead of directly or indirectly referring to me -- or anyone for that matter, as a "hater".

Oh one last thing. You know I know what you look like..."pulling the race card" was not the point. Improper usage of the proverb, and knowing the difference was...



Well, I gotta say I'm not. And beyond sprinklets here and there on the fansites, I don't see much of anyone else excited either. Alot of what I'm running into, are people that wish the franchise be put to rest already. That, and people who don't understand why those other people are saying that.

I think essentially, they need some new blood on the roster of the MkTeam.



Hell no. I'm turned off at the moment. Only reason I'm gonna play it is cuz I've been a fan of the games. So it's more of a pestering feeling I'm getting from this game. Something like: "Let me get it over with."



Absolutely not interested in this idea. I don't have an interest in crossovers in general. Features, I don't really mind, cuz then it's just a matter of never choosing the featured characters if I don't want to. But crossovers, especially this one, means in order to enjoy the game, you gotta act like half the game isn't there in order play it for what you wanted from it. I don't like that about a crossover. To endure the game, means you have to come in contact with what you don't want...which is my biggest turnoff about any crossover in general.

The other thing is how ridiculously goofy an idea it is to begin with, and to have it shoved it your face like "eh, eh?...great idea right? novelty novelty aheheheh"...

The problem is, company's used to pay attention to the fan contrived rave about how cool it would be to have so and so fight so and so...then they would make a game that directly succeeded that notion. That's not happening this time I tell ya. This time? This time is a strategically marketed "dick in the face" from WB/DC and Midway, just because the last Batman movie and Smallville are doing good(among some other properties, I know, doesn't mean it's ever a good time to rape a fanbase for money)...

ahh..forget the rest of that...

Turnoffs?:

1. MK mixing with anything. There's defiantly too much else for one MK game to exploit for that. DO YOU. Hire other people or something, because it is evident that it is necessary in order to sell your product.

2. Everything looks last gen. From character rendered graphics, to the entire teasers content. Same problems from watching and playing last gen 3D MK games, seem to still be there.

3. Gimmicks didn't work positively. Not the shock, not the "new"(OLD) gameplay modes, not the fuck-in novelty. Didn't even almost have me fooled. Gimmicks were so transparent it's disgusting. lol And he admits it everytime he talks about the need to start all over. Sales. If they made why people want the games, the sales would be there. Even if this whole deal is actually some kind of hoax....I could see it as a possibility. Just cuz of how stupid this idea is in the first place. lol "So anything can actually happen hu?" HA!

4. Nothing new overall. They are not delivering on what they said. Yea, it's a little petty. But nobody ever likes to be decived in such a fashion. Great way to say "screw the anticipation". Thanks.

5. Graphics are sub-par. Stop being good enough, and start being excellent. I would fall over backwards the day Boon proclaims that they are the best at anything....Have you ever heard him talk about Quality?!? NOPE. Can they produce quality from any part of the game? Start with still images at least, damn. lol c'mon.

Then move to animation....and animate everything. Mo-Cap is becoming very transparent in movies now....Well, you're computer programmers and artists collectively..put it together will ya? We're paying them to get better with every game we buy from them...are they refusing?

6. Lost potential in story, and ignorance to the fan demand. It's been proven by now that fans will sell the product for you if it's something they are with. But at its root, it's always a simple demand. Artists are the ones who elaborate on the simple request.

If it's a stupid reason to have them clash together, and you have to convince longtime fans that things are "plausible" because of story elements that we won't get a good feel of before we have to buy the game.....YOU FAIL.

Very simple.

If you got something ridiculous in the bag that you are confident about, and you know people are going to react negatively about it. "Massage". Renders and concept art only reach the portion of the immediate fanbase that haven't already left. And those who have a bad taste in their mouths about it, are away....spreading the bad news faster than any good news has a chance to travel.

========================
You know, there's an issue that hasn't been addressed so far. And it's that some people may have bought their console for "MK8"..??.. I brought this up before considering the system sellers, and didn't get far with it...But that could be a big turn off about this game too if you think about it.

I mean, I bought my 360 this year actually. Anticipating at least buying the new MK and SC. But you know how much money that is for now, one game if that's the way I went about it? The system may not live long enough for "me" to care about another round of MK mayhem. lol Just saying I could see if people got pissed because of that..I know I spent something like 800$USD on my system, I'd be even more pissed off if this game was the reason I bought my 300-600$ console. Haha..There's a few games coming that pretty much set me up perfectly for when I bought my console though. So I'm not particularly bothered that way...

alright man...I'm done for now. haha..

How so? lol, incriminating? Hardly. I'm just stating my point of view and a valid point and some of the things you referred to in your previous post were based on pure "theory" just as much as mine are, that's all I was saying. The difference is you're not pleased thus far, while I'm although not 100% pleased, I like what I see with potential for improvement. So in that respect, it's just safe to agree to disagree. ; )


I also never called you "a hater" per-se so it's obvious somewhere along the line you misunderstood me, I was being firm with my view concerning the general "hating on here sometimes". My view on the "haters" are very valid and lots of people agree with me on here concerning "the haters" And I did call you "Predator" at least once or twice in my previous posts. But if you wish, I'll call you "ThePredator151" If I refer to you as Predator, it's only for short.

Haters and "skeptical MK fans" are different, however if either makes a dumb statement or ignorant I will compare them in THAT respect. I know lots of friends personally, people on here that are skeptical but won't pre-judge or "hate" the game automatically. You see what I'm saying? Besides, most of the time I refer to people by username unless they pull out the fanboy cards, that's when the hater cards come out. ; ) This really only applies to a few certain users on here anyway who I won't name.

I'm not over sensitive, I just don't like it when someone goes off topic and tries to either flame, knock me in exchange for debating in a mature fashion. When you ranted on about my sig/art topic that wasn't necessary and we're talking Midway/DC's art here, not mine, yours or any users on here.

I know what you meant concerning the "race point" but I was just saying, in that context agreeing with you that judging, generalizing anyone despite black, white, latino etc is wrong. Surely in that respect we can both agree?

For the topic, I don't wish to fight with you or anything honestly. It's probably just good to agree to disagree with certain topics pertaining to MK8



Yeah dude, totally agree with the MK games. UMK3 although is also up there, especially in the gameplay department it's the most competitively played MK out there

You'll also find some fans out there of MK4(although minimal lol) but yeah MK, MK2 and UMK3 were among the best easily in the series. I enjoy others too, but for the classic games they're the best IMO.

Yeah, pretty much people will always attempt to button mash but ultimately depsite which fighters are easier to button mash, it won't win you matches on a more competitive environment in any fighting game. Which I'm sure you'll definitely agree on lol. It just won't do anyone any good.

Yeah, I read that thread. Gamepro you see the reason why I like them a lot is because not only are the arguably the most unbiased magazine(*cough unlike EGM or Extremely Gay Magazine * lol) GP has always been unbiased, even the MK games they didn't like that much in the past they actually gave good, logical reasons as oppose to pointless bashing because they don't like "the MK series in general" so that's why Midway among Ubisoft and others banned EGM. For others besides Midway to also not want EGM rating their games, it has to tell ya something.

Gameinformer is also not bad, but not as good as GP but better then EGM lol.

I think this game will start to grow more and more, I'm not that concerned about the "hype" I mean like I was saying before, not sure if it was this thread or another. Haze, PS3 had lots of hype yet didn't deliver at all.....it's doing a little better now but is still in dead last in the console wars and as everyone knows. Failed to live to the hype.

MK8 I see the opposite happening, some people that might have lost interest or won't go nuts go talk about it might be surprised once this game hits stores.

There's also the factor that it's a fighting game, and it's factually proven over the last 10 years that the fighting genre has gone down overall in "hype" and wasn't what it used to be. I understand some people might see the crossovers over the years or MK8 mk vs. dc as a "gimmick" but honestly if that's the case, then that might as well go for everything. Some fans that want "perfection" or I just don't know at this point, amazing they'll be satisfied with other flawed fighters as well like SC, Tekken or SF at times yet act as if MK is the only one who has disappointed occassionally lol......Anywho.

Check it out:

PS3=gimmick-ridiculous price and Blu ray....

Xbox 360=Initially I didn't see any, until they came out with the Elite...just another way to get drain more money out of the customers pocket..
Wii-at first I'll admit, looked very gimmicky with the wii remote but after playing it I must say I was wrong, it's very interactice, fun as hell and lived up to the hype. In fact, I remember all the hating on this thing too...yet I don't see many now.

SC series with SC2 and SC4:SC2 had Link, Tekken dude and Spawn on the console exclusives to try to get people to buy it. SC 4 is trying to do the same again with SW characters Vader, Yoda, new apprentice guy(and rumors have it 5 SW characters in total will be on both consoles) that honestly screams gimmick. There's also the addition of finishing moves in which the creator himself even said in an interview via last month GP he was inspired by MK's fatalities and SF's supers....
I'm not surprised on Namco's move here though, SC3 overall disappointed and wasn't that great gameplay wise as oppose to previous SC's. So, going back to the SC2 roots of "console exclusive" gig.

MVC2 can make the same case if people are going to say MK8 is gimmicky, having SF vs. Marvel characters go up against each other.

I can go on and on with boarderline "gimmicky" attributes to try to attract peoples/gamers attention.

But I will say this, the reason why I feel MK8 is a lot less gimmicky or less is because all of their characters will be on all consoles that the game is being released on. 360 and PS3. Boon was even asked about this as compared to SC or the Tekken series being "exclusive" in one of the interviews, he said he didn't believe in that, making the customer have to get different consoles to experience different characters or games.

On your question though, I'm honestly looking forward to this game for a few reasons based on what I've seen so far.

A. MK's doing something new literally, the past 3 MK's were similar this is way different.

B.I love the fact that DC is in a fighting game because I'm also a fan of DC. I'm a huge fan of both MK and DC(so this is another key reason I'm looking forward to this honestly) I've always been more of a DC guy over all other comics honestly.
C.Looking forward to the changes, the new engine and also am very curious about the crossover storyline honestly(despite canon or non-canon to MK's storyline)
I'm not all that concerned with THAT much, honestly the online options and want to see more actual gameplay. The teaser is not near enough to judge I have to see an actual match, not 14 seconds.

So, more or less I'm with skillz honestly.

I just started playing MK when the 3d games came out. I only got to play MKDA for a little bit. Anyhow, if MKvsDC sucks like MKA I wont bother talking about MK anymore.
Yes, I still play MKA but that sh1t has me Konsumed :D