And I repeat from an earlier post I made, That ok... lets consider this. Take Kratos and the unknown if any xbox 360 exclusive out of the game, and give human smoke that spot since he actually belongs to MK and you people would still be yelling about him not being canon. Yet people seem to be fine now with non canon Kratos. I don't want to hear "oh but he is a bonus character" ok fine I get it he is a bonus if you want to call it that. I call it a setback. I would rather have human smoke given a spot because he actually belongs to MK

What is this shit,Naruto?

That's a fair point. I never said I would flip if Human Smoke were in. I like Human Smoke. I just would prefer that he be an alternate like he was originally in UMK3. Although judging by the voice leaks. He is human Smoke. Which again, is fine. I'll be disappointed if there is no Cyber Smoke ever though. And I do wonder what they will do with the story and hope for the best.

1 being most...

1. Cyber Smoke.
In all honesty, it took me a while to welcome the new roster in MK3. Though Sektor was my favorite of the robots, I have come to like both Cyrax and Smoke in more ways than one. And inevitably, if this is to be a MK1-3 retelling, I dont see a possible way to leave out any of the robots, especially Smoke, the secret character of MK3.
2. Rain.
Now, Rain is my second choice only because I LOVED playing as him in Trilogy. In fact, he was probably my second favorite choice. (Noob being first) just because the combos I could come up with were rediculous. That said though, I am unsure of how he will play if he's to be included in this game. But because I enjoyed him so much in Trilogy, I'd like to see him re-imagined with a great story.
3. Shinnok
Although he was a pretty bland and easy boss, I believe he has lots of potential in the next gen. Granted, I don't really care to see him in this one.

Now these next few are interchangable to me and quite honestly I couldn't care less if they make it.

4. Tanya
5. Kenshi
6. New Character

There is a difference between Having a 2nd Smoke slot wasted with no story for one of them and guest character.

Having Robo-Smoke in game without story if we have Human Smoke in it than we don't need 2 the SAME characters in it, if one is more or less useless.

Kratos is just a damn GUEST... I want DLC characters as Rain or some others in it with an actual canon story included to them and not a What If charcter.

What's next? Human Scorpion? Human Sektor? Human Cyrax? All as DLC and with no story for which you oay?

I'd rather have that than a goofy look greek guy with period blood painted on his face And honestly The played totally Different in UMK3 !!! Since they basically butchered how scorpion played in UMK3 they could basically maybe just edit Human Smoke's spear to look different or give him some different pulling in move and he would be totally different from Scorpion.

lol at "period blood".

Welcome. And I must disagree; in that Cyber-Smoke - hell, Smoke in any form - is not a character with any depth to him at all. He never had any personality, character development - nada. He was a man, then he became a robot, and spent ten years in a dungeon before being turned into a cyber-demon. From the time he was converted, he had no free will, and likely no ability to think beyond his programming either, barring the likelihood of him helping out Sub against Cyrax and Sektor. Even then, he probably never got his soul back. Seriously, the most static of MK's heroes have had more development than him.

I hope Cyborg Smoke will be in the story mode just not playable and ends up as DLC of course.

The roster that I'm guessing on is friggin huge. I hope they can keep every character's individuality and personality in their moveset in check and not be stretched too thin.

Yeah, it's unfortunate. I was noting that Cyber Smoke simply has more to him than Human Smoke. I do concede to your point that Smoke needs more fleshing out period. I thought the argument was "which Smoke fits better" in which case I thought Cyber Smoke was just the more reasonable option. If we're getting into new story arcs and what not that is entirely different.

Hopefully, Smoke is fixed up considerably in this new game, I'm looking forward to his part of the story a lot just out of curiosity. I just hope they don't skim by him with one or two segments and then we move back to the "main" part of the story. As a matter of fact, I hope that isn't true for any of the characters.

Presumably, someone has to get the shaft though. :/

I read the debates. Your insults were funny, RazorsEdge701. If you're calling Smoke fans teenagers, you're wrong in my case at least. Couldn't it simply be that a major part of users here are teenagers, not that expressly Smoke fans would be teenagers? As for writing properly, it has nothing to do with pointing out hard facts. Read my message before you'll point fingers at anyone next time.
Okay. Human Smoke has dozens of chances where to go if he prevents the automation that never should have happened in the first place. Ed Boon wanted to include a familiar character into the new cyborgs because he was insecure how will the our ninjas be received. Smoke was the best option at the time because he was a character that everybody knew but with a little knowledge.
As you can see now, the cyborgs didn't become as popular as the proper ninjas (compare Reptile & Cyrax). Smoke just boosted their approach a little bit. Human Smoke wasn't able to introduce himself in Mortal Kombat II because as secret characters generally, he was added to the game just before the launch date.
What comes to the options for Human Smoke after the automation attempt he and Sub-Zero avoided, here are just a few I came up with:

1. Smoke could join now the Forces of Light and stay with them for some time. But later, in a critical situation, where Raiden is about to end the Outworld empire once and for all (something similar to Vegeta in DBZ), Smoke would turn his back to the Forces of Light showing that he would have turned evil anyway.

2. In Mortal Kombat 10, Smoke could have a serious injury which would force him to rely on cybernetics he thought he avoided and what he hated. Smoke would still be a ninja but like Kano or Kabal and become an obdurated desperado. He obtained his cyborg legacy aback.

The developers have the chance to postpone Smoke's automation by several means but now they can finally introduce us introduce Human Smoke, once and for all, still having the chance of releasing Cyborg Smoke afterwards. I'm sure many of the Tekunin in Armageddon were recruited afterwards. The #2 outcome would look like this: "Smoke BeautyShot"

3. He could simply remain good and allow people to see who he is in his own personality. He could for example become a sidekick for Sub-Zero or have a friendship towards him similar to what Kung Lao is to Liu Kang.

4. Smoke has fought with his identies now for a while and even in his ninja form he may have two separate forms (human body and fog demon); he would now become more chaotic and join the forces of Chaos, eventually showing up as a Lord of Chaos.
It doesn't require a Casablanca writer to come up with a decent story for Human Smoke. This is an all-new storyline now; anything can be expected to happen. Time traveling commonly results in unexpected outcomes. Once again you brought up that old phrase that Human Smoke is a plain Scorpion copycat. Well what about characters like Ermac, Reptile and Noob Saibot? They started off as Scorpion copycats as well and have become very interesting and popular characters in time. Smoke has got to obtain this chance too.
Frost and Sub-Zero differed enough despite the fact that they're both Lin Kuei cryomancers. Smoke in the other hand possesses smoke unlike no one other.
I thought this debate was cleared but you began to bring up same old phrases that were discussed. That's why I had to bring some old hard facts here too. I'd like to have a proper respond to my message this time. But NetherRealm Studios knows what they are doing now and it seems like Human Smoke is indeed returning.
For further information, you may want to see the updated original post in Human Smoke Reflections. Thanks.

Hi, my name is m0s3pH. I'm 23 years old, a college graduate, and Human Smoke > Cyber Smoke. By a lot. Oh, and by the way, Cyber Smoke's story since MK3 has kind of devolved from being an unwilling participant in the Lin Kuei's automation to just another evil stooge fighting for an alleged higher power, a la Reptile and Baraka. You tell me how interesting that is. Oh, and Sub-Zero's story hasn't revolved around Smoke at all since the jump to MK4, by the way. The whole "OMG I NEEDS TO SAVE MY BUDDY" was a one-off, so the whole cyborg intrigue for Smoke has long since worn off. Cyrax and Sektor aren't any more interesting, either. The cyborg thing was done as a space saver above all else in MK3, what with the lack of Scorpion meaning that they'd probably be struggling to fit that many characters in.

I urge you to pick Human Smoke in UMK3 and play as him for a while, then try to tell me he's a gray Scorpion. Go on. Do it. They play nothing alike.

I'm all for respecting the opinions of others around here, but your rash generalization about Human Smoke fans is comical at best.

I would say these men are more comical

''There is a common misconception that Human Smoke is just a clone of Scorpion, who is gray and smoking, with no difference in moves. In reality, Human Smoke is much more powerful than Scorpion because he has pop up combos, and he also has a slightly faster walking speed, which makes certain juggle combos easier.''

Source: http://shoryuken.com/wiki/index.php/Human_Smoke_(UMK3)

In my honest opinion Human Smoke made Scorpion utterly useless in UMK3, but I don't think they are making him a ''more powerful and faster Scorpion clone'' this time.

You're no different from the "teenaged, non-educated people" if you bash users with simple comments and respond to only posts you want to answer. But if this is the case, here you just found two adult and educated Human Smoke fans. It would raise a little respect from me if you for a change responded, properly, on our two messages above (me and m0s3pH). The reasoning "this isn't a comment good enough for me" won't pass.

If they keep his moveset without any "from my cyborg chest" attack, they could make them main and alternate costumes.

I think that he has to be mechanized. The reason because many people would love to see him as a human is that they feel sorry for his disgrace and want him to have his humanity returned so such an emotive character no longer suffers.

The paradox is that this way there is no reason to feel pity for him, so the people who love him for his tragedy would still love him but without the thing that made them love him.

F*** you Raiden your time travels are starting to shatter the universe into multiple paradoxes!!!! Why you couldn't heard what Doc told you about time traveling you mad evil resurrected lighting god?

I'm seeing the same two huge mistakes made over and over again by the Human Smoke defenders.

1) "I don't like the cyborg 'cuz Deception, trophy room, didn't do anything with him blah blah blah."

It's not a fucking remake of Deception, it's a remake of MK THREE here. We'll get to that shit when we get to it and if they change the beaten and stuck in a trophy room part, I'd be happy with that. I'd rather see him regain his humanity like in his original MK3 ending and stick around for a while.

Him becoming a cyborg does not immediately mean his destiny is to sit and do nothing. It just means that for this one game, his story does what it's supposed to fucking do, make the cyborgs interesting by making one of them be against his will.

Again, the problem with Smoke staying human is that Sektor and Cyrax are not interesting characters if they're all by themselves. Those two were willing and neither of them will be mourned or felt bad for.

There needs to be a forced-against-his-will cyberninja.

There needs to. It is the ENTIRE crux of that plot.

2) "Play UMK3, Human Smoke's moves are awesome, he's not Scorpion, blah blah blah"

Bringing gameplay to a story argument is bringing a knife to a gunfight.

Bring a knife to a gunfight, stab them while they are laughing

And yet you still forget that since events CHANGE in this game, that maybe Cyrax or Sektor did resist? You sit here acting as if his story is set in stone because you say so and apparently you are a god of NRS I suppose? The story of characters can change, you just have to learn to get over it, but most importantly get over yourself.

We only mentioned his moves because you were whining like a prepubescent schoolgirl about him being a gray/grey scorpion. If you played UMK3 AT ALL you would know that sure they have the same special moves but they play so different. Scorpion is trash while on the other hand Human Smoke is easily one of, if not THE BEST in the entire game due to his pop ups. Aww and Zmoke he didn't address your post or br0s3pH's like you asked. what a shocker

"I don't like the cyborg 'cuz Deception, trophy room, didn't do anything with him blah blah blah."Are you sure you're not generalizing me into a certain group? I think Cyborg Smoke is a fine character (despite the fact I've reviled him) but Human Smoke (is a lot better) deserves to earn a chance to be in the shaft for a change since there is no 3d game with Human Smoke playable. Cyborg Smoke has been there throughout the 3d saga of PS2/Xbox and will likely be there in the future too. Do you agree with me on this?
It's clear that Human Smoke will be a part of the story mode anyway, so why couldn't he be the playable version in this game then?I know that Smoke was in his ninja form again in Deception but that really wasn't the same, it was just worse. Yet still it is probably the closest Smoke can go after the automation. Smoke can't probably fully obtain his human ninja form ever again once the automation has happened. I'm not fully against the automation - it could happen - but this should be the game for Human Smoke to shine. Why I brought some alternative storylines is because it's likely that Raiden tries to undo some major events to prevent Armageddon.
And I hope you indeed did read the message I referred to for the most part at the least.

1. Tanya
2. Kenshi
3. Cyber-Smoke
4. Shinnok
5. New character

No thans: Rain.

Never once did I say I was against Human Smoke being in the game.

I said I am very against Cyber-Smoke NOT being in the game.

Those aren't the same thing.
Personally, what I was hoping for, before Ed's suggestion of Cyber-Smoke as DLC made it clear that he's not in the base game already, was that the two versions of Smoke would be different costumes, human as primary and cyborg as alternate.
Or that, if it's absolutely necessary that they have different moves, which I don't believe it is, then Human Smoke could've been immediately playable and Cyber-Smoke could've been an unlockable hidden version.
Playability and special moves aren't really what's important to me, though. What's important to me is Story Mode. If this is all just sort of a misunderstanding, and Smoke still gets turned into a cyborg during the storyline, but he's not in the game in that form because he's just an NPC as a cyborg, fine, I can live with that.
But if he doesn't get automated at all anywhere in story mode, I have serious concerns about whether this game is worth my money, because the only reason I'm buying it is to see what the original games never had: the story told in cutscenes. And if they can't be bothered to tell the best parts, if they don't know the right things to change and the right things to keep the same, then I'm basically being spit in the face after my nearly two decades of being an MK fan SOLELY for love of the story.

This Smoke Fight is taking away the point of this thread. It's about numbered lists from 1 to 6

Well there's your problem.

You did refer Human Smoke as "middle finger" in a topic but if I'm right you tried only to express the importance of automation. I do see what you're meaning.

You see Cyborg Smoke as a crucial plot key. So are you fine with it if Human Smoke is the one who makes it to the playable roster in this game?

Cyborg-Smokes inclusion in the game depends on two simple things. Either Human Smoke does get automated somewhere in the story, in this game, and Boon doesn't just want him to be an alternate, but doesn't have room for him on the starting roster; ala DLC.

Or Human Smoke doesn't get automated, but Boon wants to please Cyber-Smoke fans by offering him in a DLC poll, even though Cyber-Smokes appearance story-wise won't be canon.

Either way, he has a chance as DLC.