Making a direct remake of a game with an identical cast isn't creativity. Taking a character and introducing a change that potientially creates something new is. Someone imagined this alleged character and he was developed. Created, if you will. Referring to pallete swapping and other creations is irrelevant to the topic at hand, which is: Is creating something that wasn't there before (cyber SZ) creative? Yes.

You're argument is flawed. This is a piece of art that NRS and WB did create in the exact way that THEY wanted to. They may have listend to what fans wanted, but the decision to make anything was theirs. We are paying for THEIR product.

Example: A person approaches an artist to commission a specific piece. The person details exactly what they would like in the finished product and the artist creates it. In this scenario, is the piece a work of the Artist's or the person commissioning it? Answer, the Artist's. I work in and around art galleries and this is a common scenario.

Even if one were to approach NRS detailing exactly what they wanted in a custom MK game made specifically for them, and laid down the millions of dollars to produce it, the finished game would still be a work by NRS.

The general public buying a copy of a work that NRS created ultimately according to their own decisions IS a work of NRS' own.

With all that said, believe what you want.

As far as I'm concerned, it's everything goes now. We all know changes are happening, so I wouldn't be surprised (and am hoping haha) that a Lin Kuei warrior will recover his body. Maybe even young Sub?

I have a great idea how about we wait til the game comes out, play the story mode, then rant.....because now we dont know squat if its real or not so until then......lol

I just tweeted the mk team telling thing i am for the change to sub-zero, and that i hope he has some cool move sets!

Good for you, mate.

Lmfao.

Cyber-Sub Zero.... HELL YEAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!! Thats wussup...

Whats wrong with people?? Cyber Sub Zero is gonna be f**kin AMAZING.... great job MK team... those are the type of hidden characters I wanted... cool characters... f**k frost and those stupid post MKTrilogy characters... except for Fujin cuz he was in Sub Zero Mythologies... Im a SubZero fan so thats why Im excited...

Looks like SZ couldnt get away from being turned into a cyber ninja... thats dope... this game is gonna be insane... beyond insane...

and Im super excited to see other -alitys......... I wanted MK to keep the humor.... thats one of the things that I love about MK... is their sense of humor.... Like animalities.... Cyrax turns into Jaws.... Friendships need to be back... they were hilarious...

If Animalities... Brutalities... Friendships... are back... this will be crazy...

I hope they release a DLC for the retro MKT costumes for Cyrax and Sektor... or the other cyber ninjas like Smoke... those were my favorite designs...

CANT WAIT until April 19th...

I'd love to read the fan comments being left on their Twitter pages, is there a way you can do that? lol

Depending on how it's portrayed, it could wind up being an incredibly creative idea, or it could reek of creative bankruptcy.

Making this Cyborg Sub-Zero Noob's reanimated physical corpse, the brothers' father or sister, or something similar has possibilities. It's bizarre, but there are possibilities.

What nobody with sense wants is to have one of MK's most iconic and well-developed characters completely derailed and his entire future jeopardized for the sake of "doing something different". It'd be even worse if all they did was reverse Sub and Smoke's roles because "LOL DIFFERENT THIS TIME". I'm one of the biggest Smoke fans on the boards, and I've been lobbying for him to get character development as a human for ages now. But I don't know if it's worth this cost.

Personally, I have enough faith based on everything else I've seen of this game to believe they wouldn't make such a boneheaded move. The TRMK admin's quote is meant to reassure. I'll take that as a good sign for now.


Anyway. We've got a whole month until the game's out. Odds are we won't even see it until then, so let's ju-

Also this the more I think about it.

^This.Also.I have no clue where anyone got Mileena is going to have a naked alt from.Way to read into an achievement name that says nothing of the sort.Like teddy bears?I do

....and all of a sudden,people are ready to burn NRS on the stake for a character we have yet to see,play or follow story wise.Way to be optimistic!I believe what ~Crow~ wrote to be pretty much spot on.

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

THERE HE IS

GET'IM

blackcyborg, I agree with everything you said. The only thing I don't like is that cyber sub-zero is replacing Rain because I really wanted him in. However with that said I bring cyber sub in with open arms. Also , i'm curious about how alot of the people complaining are the SAME people who complain about subbie being a poster boy. Doesn't make alot of sense to me.

BAHAAHAHAAH! OMG I hope Cyber Sub-Zero is real! OMG amazing. XD

And why are you guys jumping to the conclusion that Mileena is naked in her 3rd alt? It could really well be Mileena dressed as a Nun.

lol im telling yall mileena new alt is the lady in the red dress...watch

I think this whole thing is a misleading hoax put out by some troll or NRS. Does anybody know how this list got leaked out? If there is a logical explanation then i'll buy it other wise this whole thing looks fishy. Not too mention there was a big leak with this game and the last game so you think they would keep it under wraps.


If there truly is a cyber Sub-Zero then it must be a non-canon bonus character. It just doesn't make sense for NRS, and WB do take there money maker poster child and just bastardize him. It also seems like a lame waste of a character slot.

As of now I'm calling bullshit. This is a hoax to get us talking and freaking out about the possibilities of the game.

First of all fuck XiahouDun. That jack ass wanted to see the franchise resemble DBZ budokai. Smart is one of the last words I would use to describe him.

Secondly, why are you buying into this? There is little to no evidence that suggest this is real.

im with kabal on this one lol

...I'm not sure you ever read any of Xiahou's posts.

I can't wait to see what they will do April first lol.

That's a bit harsh, don't you think?

So... this game is "a direct remake"? And here I thought it was a retelling with a robust new fighting engine, an expansive story mode that reveals new insights into old, beloved characters, new gameplay modes, fighting moves, dramatic re-imaginings of characters, scenes, and locations, yet at the same time utilizing the most iconic and beloved cast of characters from the most memorable and respected era of MK history.

"Cyber Sub-Zero" ISN'T anything new. There were fan-created "robot Sub-Zero" fan art and fanfics dating back to the first day MK3 hit store shelves. So they didn't create something new at all... they created something that others had the idea for almost 10 years ago. This is hardly something new. I hate this idea because it ISN'T new. I have a "cyber Sub-Zero" sitting in my Kreate-A-Kharacter in Armageddon right now, along with Skarlet. If they had come up with a COMPLETELY new robot character, a robot named "Syntax" for example, one with an original story, original moves, original design, I'd agree with you that they were being creative. This is just a rehash of an idea I've heard before and hated 10 years ago.



As a game developer myself, no, nobody EVER makes the game the "exact" way they wanted to make it. Game creation is full of compromises, cuts, edits, changes, alterations, and getting rid of things you really, really wanted to include, but customers didn't want them or wouldn't appreciate them. Dead Island, for example, had a system where their zombies realistically were injured, revealing shredded meat, bone, and organs, but nobody playing the game noticed it so the team cut it out to save processing speed because it was wasted efforts.

And, no, they don't have complete and utter control over what they can and cannot do with their games. That's the reason MK games have sucked for so long, because their publisher forced them to release a game that was rushed, compromised, or included features and characters detrimental to the game itself. This is NOT a "piece of art", it is a commercially created product that Warner Bros. wants to make as much money off of as possible, and they'll do so by letting NRS try and make the best game they can. But in the end, WB doesn't want our "approval", they want our money, and they get that by creating a game that customers will want, not a game that NRS likes. As Ed Boon said himself, "we would rather have the sales of the majority than the approval of the minority." It may be their creation, but it was created with us in mind.


But the art doesn't belong to the artist; it belongs to the commissioner. The WORK was the artist, but the art itself then belongs to the one who paid for it. I do commercial art and take commission work ALL the time (it's actually my part-time job, doing freelance comic work), and everything I create belongs to the people paying for it. It's theirs, not mine. It was my labor, but they paid for it. It is OF my hand, but it ultimately is owned by those who purchased my services.


Yes... but it would still be FOR the paying customers, not for themselves. This game IS a result of fan feedback, detailing what we want, a "greatest hits" of MK, and from the very beginning Boon and co. have said that their motto for this game was "give the fans what they want". They may be making the game, but ultimately we're the ones they're making it for.


Again, you misunderstand. Commercial art is purely commercially driven. When asked why MK wasn't as hardcore as some fans wanted, Boon bluntly told them "because it would hurt sales". The bottom line is all about money, not about "creativity" or "art". I'm all for that, don't get me wrong. I love creativity in games, and bold experiments, like Mirror's Edge, Enslaved, and ICO. But Boon himself said he'd rather have the millions he made from Deadly Alliance than the high praise and poor sales of Street Fighter III, Blazblue, or King of Fighters X. They're making a good product to get good sales. If people want the game for being a good game, they get the money to keep making more. Change for the sake of change is bad business, and being different without method or meaning is just as harmful.

The old adage "don't fix what isn't broken" is essential to good game design. Look at the Zelda franchise, which is criticized for evolution instead of revolution, and yet each and every game is a colossal success, a critical hit, and a beloved classic. Look at a game that drastically changes the formula or alters what people love about the original, though, and you get ugly messes like Perfect Dark Zero, Devil May Cry 2, Metroid: Other M, the Cd-i Zelda games, Star Wars: Force Unleashed 2, and other games that ultimately ended up disappointing fans and critics.

If something is going to change, it has to be an evolution, not a regression. Going back to MK1-3 to explore the old games through a new, deeper perspective is a great idea... but changing some of the most beloved story moments and characters, for no reason other than "because we can", is poor development. I'm not saying it WILL be poor, but if they don't have a reason for it, they don't have a plan on how it'll ripple through the universe and impact the characters, then it'll be a bust.

Just like how Spider-Man's "One More Day" was a terrible, terrible story that stripped away over 20 years worth of character growth, story evolution, and fan attachment and regressed Peter Parker's status quo to what existed two decades ago, something that was certainly "different" from what we had been reading, but none of it was a positive change, so too do I worry, a bit, that any big changes to some of the best character arcs and stories told during the MK4-MK:Armageddon eras might get flagrantly and unnecessary changed, and Cyber Sub-Zero is a very possible sign of this.

NO, I am not opposed to change. I am, however, opposed to BAD change. If I was opposed to change, I wouldn't have played and enjoyed the 3D Mortal Kombat games, or giving the FPS-version of Metroid, Metroid Prime, a shot and adored it, or embraced the cel-shaded style of Wind Waker, or even telling Devil May Cry fans not to freak out about how Dante looks in the new trailer for DMC.

Change is good if the change that occurs is good. Change without purpose, foresight, or deft skill behind it? That's bad.

XiahouDun's, no matter what you think of him, is and will always be one of the strongest contributors when it comes to the MK mythology. And although I'm excited as hell about this game, his core point has always been correct: from a writing perspective, a time-travel story is regressive.


xbox360achievements.org has a pretty good track record.

Really enjoyed the amount of butthurt in this thread, especially over a concept we havent got to actually witness yet. 10/10.