you have a valid point, but you talk as if the competitive fighting crowd speak for the majority of the people who play mortal kombat and they dont, like you said the competitive crowd has shunned MK, but MK still sells. A franchise thats still a million seller after the "target audience" has completly shunned it, sounds pretty legendary to me.

^The argument isn't wether or not it still sells. The argument is over it's "legendary" status, and to a lesser extent wether or not it outsells other games. I don't care if the players are casual or competitive, but when less than 10 people are willing to play at the biggest event in the country, that speaks volumes. For the record, not everyone who goes to EVO is a diehard competitive player. (Just the people who win.)

Fair enough. whether MK outsells other fighting games is irrelavent. the game still sells alot is what matters. as far as MK's "Legendary" status goes "Legendary" isnt the word to use," Infamous" sounds more like it because like sombody said earlier MK is legendary for the wrong reasons.

mk is a legend. not just in fighting games, but in gaming in general. it took what was great about fighting games, and added more. it added things that other devs were afraid to add. mk is the reason there is a game rating system to begin with. blood and guts is what gave it attention and help it make national headlines (was 3rd strike on the cover of time magazine? didnt think so) but it takes more then that to last this long in the gaming biz. the reason its still here after 14 years is because under the blood and gore is a good fighting game. sure, its not the best..but its not trying to be. if mk doesnt take its self seriously, why should you? you want your "hardcore" competitive games, you have them..go play them. i understand that you want mk to be up there with the others, the thing is..its not your choice. until the mk team decides that mk needs to be in a game tournament, etc, it wont happen.

and thats whats sad. they say "we read the forums online, we see what the fans want" you know what i see when i come here? a bunch of 12-14 year olds that are asking for better fatalities and more characters. my friends 13 year old brother always comes over to write down the special moves and fatalities..doesnt give a shit about gameplay at all. always saying things like "they only have 2? they need more..or cooler ones". hes got it in his mind (and i think thats most of the users problem here) that hes the best because he can do specials and fatalities. i thought "wtf i was playing this game and doing fatalities while you were still in your dads nutsack".

mk does have its issues, and they need to be fixed. but they wont unless the ENTIRE community speaks up about it. you "hardcore" (all 4 of you)guys can bitch and moan all you want and it doesnt mean anything. its falling on deaf ears. i know you want your ideas heard and want to help mk, but all youre doing is giving fuel for the noobs/fanboys to start their flaming..and make even more character/fatality threads.

i garentee that if mko was to change the poll to "what does mk need to improve on" fatalites and/or characters would win by a landslide. and thats what pisses me off..they dont listen to the people who really care about mk and want it to be good, respected, etc and not laughed at by everyone, they listen to the kids who cry because sub-zero was bald in mkd.

lets say you go all out and make an online petition and give it to midway..showing that everyone here wants all these things..and you know what? it wouldnt to a damn thing. why? because they dont take these forums seriously. theyre not gonna listen to 14-50 users that post daily on the internet when the game is selling millions. like it or not, 50 people online dont speak for 1 million buyers.

and about evo..i love mk, but im not gonna shell out 100 bucks plus travel to go play it when i can stay home and play it for free. might be good for some people, but not myself. but, if i had the money to spare, that would be different.

So basically, because we're not the majority, our right to free speech goes down the toilet?

Bollocks to that.

For him, it makes no difference, for he is in cntrol of his little world, sadly.
MK is dogfood on the selling list, it is laughable to think that they outsold
anything withiin the category of Tekken or DoA, especially when their video
game market is at least 2X time bigger at least.

it is bullshit man, but thats how Ed thinks.

Look around you. See how many people love MK's gameplay? That's why it outsold the other games.

Also, I think I got another reason whyMK is better (this is just my opinion, not a fact.) MK has special moves which most other fighting games lack. The other fighting games are all close range battles, but MK could go farther. So SF had specials, but in SF(even though I love that game) all the specials are either a hado-ken or Sonic Boom. Sure, specials might not give you guys a reason to think MK is better, but I don't care. That's your oppinion and I can't change it. Remember that this is just an opinion. I have the freedom of speech too.

Sales figures are trivial as long as MK is still a hit. it doesnt matter what out sells what as long as it still makes that almighty dolloar in the end.

I think it was the highlighted part where Menthol said "garage" but you mistook it for "garbage" and went on a bit of a spiel about it.

And it's not entirely fair to say that MK is the reason for the rating system. Blood is the reason for the rating system, not MK. If blood wasn't done by MK, it would have been done eventually by another game. It was inevitable. MK may have been the first large scale arcade game to include noticable blood effects, but MK isn't the reason for the rating system, blood is. Yes Midway did it first, credit given where credit is due, but it's not like if MK never had blood then we wouldn't have a rating system nowdays, so MK really isn't the reason for the rating system at all. Saying "MK is the reason for the rating system" infers that if it wern't for MK, then there'd be no rating system today, when there very obviously would be, but it would just have been put to use for whichever other game featured blood effects first.

*Takes a look around* I still don't see any factual examples as to why MK's gameplay is good. And it hasn't outsold the "other games", btw.




Uh, Flash Kick, Blanka Ball, Honda's slaps, Chun Li's kicks, Hurricane Kick, Dhalsim's teleport, Dragon Punch...




The sad part is, if the core mechanics worked correctly, MK's specials would do nothing less than bring added depth to what would already be good gameplay. Pity.



You're more than entitled to your opinion. The game is horrible on a mechanical (gameplay) level. That is fact. Doesn't mean it can't still be enjoyed.

I really don't understand, I sincerelly don't understand what is going on.

Both my copies of MKDA and MKD(premium edition) are pilling up in dust right now. MKDA started picking up dust after a couple of weeks (once in a while, before MKD was released, I only poped it in to "cook with scorpion") and MKD was about a month and a half before it started picking it up dust (apart from the few times I popped it in to play puzzle fighter or when showing friends-in-denial what was wrong with it. )


From the 2 sides of this debate, one side has fact and the other side has no facts. After all the facts served in this restaurant, I wonder why people still think these facts are myths or opinions. Sure, it is possible there are a couple who hate MK and have come here to destroy it. Given that; there are still some who actually love MK, and probably know more MK than some so-called MKfans, that place these fact on a platter to educate minds that can't see the truth blinded by false misconceptions, thinking it is their opinion.

I have been seeing this so-called "whining" topics all the way since when this site informed us about mk5 and we saw/heard of power ups and reversals with characters that seem stiff. People whined, people bashed the whining, and it turned out that there was even more stuff to whine about that what we had in mind.
Pre-deception, the same thing. Only that there were double the facts, people still were in the notion going on about "but how can you possibly tell it would suck, no one has played it." Again, it turned out that there was even more to whine about that what had been predicted.
Nolstalga and dejavu' are kicking in again on this spectator and I can't figure out why people still don't get it. All these other games that people are bringing in have absolutely nothing to do with the situation.


This can be likened to a blue pen and a black pen. When asked which is better to use to write, I would probably say blue pen (blue is my favorite color.) Someone else might say black pen in this situation. Here these are the opinions of two people, there is no way to prove that writing with a blue pen is better than the black pen because it is opinion. While the opinions are not thesame, it is their opinion on what their preference is to write.

Same situation of the pen example only that the BLACKpen has little to no ink and the BLUEpen is fresh and full of ink. Which one is better to use? The BLUEpen of course, this is not opinion this is fact. Siding with the false opinion that the BLACKpen is better to write with can be severely proven wrong thereby discarding the fact that there is no opinion what so ever in this case.

I don't get how people are saying the BLACKpen is the better to use. To make it work you are going to have to shake it severely like a polaroid picture(okay, I couldn't help it.) And even when you make it work it would write for a little bit and then stop, then write again for a little bit (if you are lucky) going on like that in a cycle. If you are eventually able to get done writing, some of the words would be incomplete (due to the fact that the pen stopped writing at some points) making your words apear....well....broken (I know you like that.)
While the BLUEpen would cover pages and pages of written isht, luck or a 50% chance (I know you like that) would have to interevene for you to even be able to complete a page.

Granted a knew version of the BLACKpen is coming out but Ed says "Hi kids, we are bringing back the same black pen with a knew shell/ casing. And guess what kids, we are taking some ink out while adding some "water" into the left over ink."

The proclaimed "bashers" and "whinners" come back in more numbers and with an increased knwoledge of facts and are like "WTF, this same stupid black pen with no ink again?." Instead of others agreeing with them they say "but Ed said he is going to add some water to the ink."
What the Hell, the water added is not going to do the BLACKpen any good. There is a chance that it may write a little longer but it is going to fade away. The anti-bashers see this as opinion and claim "stop tryin to force others into your opinion."
What, this is fact not opinion. In fact, I would probably say it is not thesame but rather the BLACKpen is worse off as it is. Wether it may be better off is the only opinion that you might find in there but the truth remains that "using this BLACKpen to write would suck." Some how a couple of these "anti-bashers" use this BLACKpen and still do not believe it sucks. How, I still don't know, these guys have got to have never used a pen before to know how good it is suposed to write to even be considered an average pen.

Time passes, again in a new casing we are getting this very same BLACKpen, it is not like it is a new black pen were we could speculate wether it would suck or not. In fact it is this very same BLACKpen that we all used before only that this time Ed says "Hello again kids, we are bring the BLACKpen back but we aren't taking any ink out this time. We are adding little bit of "diluted ink" (the ink that was removed the first time and a bit more) to it."
By this time, some so-called "bashers" have had it and are going to bed, other "bashers" decide to still stick with it with the hopes of getting a fresh new black pen in the future that is full of ink like the BLUEpen.

Some how, some way, there are still people who exist that still do not think that writing with this BLACKpen would suck. I am here, a spectator (and once in a while participator) of this drama since day one, scratching my head in awe and amazement thinking like "this bull isht is not possible, people can't be that clueless."

Some, like bleed, try to open their eyes and shows them the BLACKpen in their face with facts that this BLACKpen, in fact has little to no ink.
Others, like secondgen, go the somewhat harsh route and crack the shell of the pen open shoving the ink tube thingy in their face with fact that this pen, in fact, does not have any desirable amount of ink in it. May even go through the extreme of tearing the ink tube smearing the ink every where to show that there isn't any ink in this isht.

MKO, or to be more specific, Scott asks "So Mr. E.B., can we expect any additonal or more real ink in this BLACKpen" and Ed skillfully doges the bullet and even adds "Hey, we are stiring the (little) ink *unintelligible* that is there."
More "bashers" are enraged, a couple decides to post "WTF, no ink in being added." anti-bashers alike "he is stirring the ink it already has so STFU."

I mean, I am really flabbergastard here. What is really going on, why is this same BLACKpen still defended. May be one could be like "P.O. razorxz, or whatever the cufk your name is, why don't you and the others just stick to the BLUEpen."
Just like you, I like using black pens, I just wish one day I could actually write conviniently with it. I hear that a new black pen would be created after this and hopefully there is enough ink in for at least average use, though my patience is running thin, by that time it may be my last stint in loyalty. Me defecting is a possiblity.

"Also, I think I got another reason whyMK is better (this is just my opinion, not a fact.) MK has special moves which most other fighting games lack. The other fighting games are all close range battles, but MK could go farther. So SF had specials, but in SF(even though I love that game) all the specials are either a hado-ken or Sonic Boom. Sure, specials might not give you guys a reason to think MK is better, but I don't care. That's your oppinion and I can't change it. Remember that this is just an opinion. I have the freedom of speech too."


EDIT.

Lol That was fucking awesome! (the rest of the post was pretty damn good, too.)
edit: I've got a new catch-phrase now! "THERE IS NO INK IN THIS FUCKING PEN!" Greatness.

Doesn't matter because the other fighting games have working mechanics. Every fighting has potential to do different stuff, but without solid mechanics it's pointless.

It may not have greatiest gameplay to match YOU'RE Soul Calibur expectations. But at least its original and fairly fun.

^Actually, I thought SC3 sucked.

Original? MK rips off Street Fighter more than Soul Calibur rips off any game.

I thought we had already established that MK was never original and was intended to be.

Edit: Hah. Now i'm just just stirring. Disregard.

Ok, interesting points I suppose but just because MK doesn't go to some EVo tourney in Las Vega doesn't mean it's not a great series.How many arcades back in the day were smothered with talented players, lived on a middle class budget and could do nothing to prove their skills?HHHMMM?

Not many I suppose, I can't afford to go to Las Vegas to play in an MK tourney anyway.That's why we have something called "online play"

If they wanted to, they could have someone from Midway moderate it while the schedule is set.Have each and every match recorded for legit purposes and that's that.What's the problem?

Tekken going to evo and MK not means absolutely nothing to me.There are lots of MK players out there that are good I bet that will not want to be bothered by going to Las Vegas for a MK tourney.Like I said, online play is the answer.If you don't have high speed internet then you might be fucked.But lets get real here, most people have the the internet and high speed users are increasing so..


I only had to say something when someone mentioned that MK is crap, that's not true at all.Deception's gameplay might have left something to be desired but I can't let the close minded people on here rate the entire MK series with statements like MK never delivers when it comes to fun and gameplay.Nope, I disagree.Yes, MK 2, MK 3 and UMK3 are in the past BUT what some people fair to realize is that it's those games that had to prove something after MK, MK 2.That they did, also MK 4 a lot of people didn't like but come on the game wasn't that bad.

I'll admit, it's probably not MK's best but I think that game takes way, way too much heat personally.That's my opinion though.

I just can't see judging a game that has yet to come out based on the previous two games.It's like judging a C 6 Corvette on a C5, well the C5 didn't do that great against certain sports cars like the viper, Ford GT.Guess what?

The new C 6 Z06 505 HP corvette is owning everything it faces man.It's taken out the Viper SRT 10, the Ford GT, the new Porsche Carrara S, a customized Mazda with 475+ HP, and an infinite modified G35 with 500+ HP.It's a bargain for the price, performance, style and Value.

Yet all those Ford, Viper enthusiasts were so sure their power sports cars would beat the Vett.They were wrong.

Just a little example of proving why you shouldn't judge a book by it's cover or newer products by it's past.

MKF, What's a bad game to you? If you don't think MK's current fighting engine is garbage then what engines are worse? And please, for the love of all that holy, give examples. Don't just say "Tekken is worse than MK, IMO." Say why and make sure those examples have something to do with the fighting part of the game. I don't mean because of things like Konquest, Puzzle Kombat, and online. I mean the core engine that lets you move around, attack, block, etc.

R u fucking on rocks, this looks like the best MK since the original one. With every single character since MK1 this gonna kick ass

^ ban him

So far Mortal kombat is the only game "I" know of, that feature THREE fighting styles, per character.

I consider that original

That Black and Blue pen post was classic!



Multiple fighting styles is not original.

Gen in STFA 2. had 2 styles

Lei wulong had multiple styles in Tekken 3 Not sure about T2.

DOA2 had multiple stances

SC had multiple stances



They were done more naturally for individual characters.

MK just made it a gimmick