What I wanna know about first:

Character stuff

We have all sorts of elements that are possible in Mk. There's alot of magic and necromancy, a few military figures, un-dead figures, and certainly a lot of mythological, and martial arts influence in the game. 1.What kinds of specialists, or correspondents work with the team? Everything outside of martial arts can't purely be made up on the spot...right? Somebody there is reading vampire and magic books or watching military flicks right? lol

Realizing that, in the past it had been an objective to stay away from so much realism in Mk, martial arts in Mortal Kombat has become more technically realistic in MkDa-MkA. And what I'm saying is, it makes sense that a Military game have actual Vets to help "real"-ize those games, makes sense that sports games use actual players to help realize those games, and it makes sense that Horror and or suspense games inquire of the best writers, and the best directors and such to real-ize those games. So, this is a kind of inquiry to the research done to maximize the potential of each character on the roster. 2.What kinds of sources are the MkTeam tapping into, that uses reality as a base for Mk's fantasy?.....Besides just the martial arts... Because games out now, fighting games and otherwise, have no doubt become more "realistic".
Mk has enough untapped qualities in it for a massive MMORPG, I don't think it'd be just that martial arts stay the only article that is factual, or that draws from factualized lore in the game....
.

When I hear Boon talk of revamping the series it makes me wonder if they have people there that are actually into the Mythology of Japanese//Chinese Gods, or someone there that is passionate about Vampire folklore, or someone who was actually a part of a Military faction...3.Are there people there, who know the difference between magic and elementals? Rites and miracles? Military and the ridiculously in-accurate interpretations of the military?ect ect

Besides the history behind each type of characters mysteriousness, 4.who are we getting to help blur the line between reality, and fantasy?

Last thing is kind of a story//character depth issue. What I really wanna know is, 5.How many people contribute to one characters story?

Can't be just Vogel in there, he's gotta be like, the oversee-er for the most part. Too, with some of the retcons that happen for these characters, it makes me curious to whether some of the writers follow a characters story all the way backwards and forward, or just skim.



That's all for now, let's have some other angles and interest on this...

I'm not a member of the MK design team, but I can answer your questions regarding "research and reference" material.

Time is money. These games are made under very strict deadlines. Anything that's time consuming and not absolutely necessary is either ignored or handled as quickly as possible. The in game bio's in MKA are perfect examples of what I'm talking about.

On the other hand, they could simply hire more people who's only task is to assist in the story making process by researching the necessary topics, but imo, this aspect of MK just isn't THAT important to them. They figure people will buy the games regardless... and they're right.

As for a question of my own, I wonder why they felt every character HAD to have a weapon stance in MKDA, MKD, and MKA. It couldn't have been to keep all the fighters balanced, 'cause they aren't. I think it would be so much better if some guys had them and some had something else... more diversity. I guess I can answer my own question: character diversity = more development time = more money = weapon stances for everyone.

I want to ask for a request that they settle what went down at the end of Armageddon in the next game.

I'd like to ask the MK team why way back when MK: Special Forces was being developed and Tobias and the crew jumped shipped why out of everything that was scrapped did they decide to cut out SONYA - the Special Forces Arc was more about Sonya vs. Kano - Jax never really fit into that mix save his involvment in MKII. Along those lines would they ever consider re-doing Special Forces with the storyline originally intended by Tobias - maybe in a Shaolin Monks style game - granted the sales of Special Forces game tanked big time in every possible way but this aspect of the series deserves a second look.

Here's a question I think I'll make a thread about to see what people think.
Im not clear on it yet so, I'll use this thread to throw concepts out there.
Um..

Maybe too bold but... by now, is it a bad idea to consult fans about MK?

I don't mean vaguely either. I mean like, Scorpion fans...work on//discuss Scorpion with the MkTeam to some further extent than ever before? They're participation would make the websites more relevant I think.

This might be how it could break down. In between games, and sometime after production starts for the next game(I guess), Boon and Co enlist the 5 biggest, most active MK sites. And from those sites each character would have the five biggest fans come together to fill slots of the characters production(rear-end production) of a character.

From say MKO, you'd have a couple people like Acueleus design one of Scorpions alternate costumes. Aculeus, JAX007, Garlador or whoever is the best off the site. Maybe there's 2 best over here and 3 best from another site or something....just saying 5 on the Alt costume(s)

From say TMRK, you'd have like 3 of their best story tellers, and maybe 1 or 2 from MkO( I'm thinking XD84) and from somewhere else 1 more person. They shoot around concepts for Scorpions bio, and overall story or something. But still 5 total.

Same for Scorpions game play attributes. 5 Pure Fan Testers.
I mean, imagine if in one game, Scorpion threw his spear weird or something. Wouldn't you want to be like:
You: "Whoa! Yo, Hey Ed, look here maine.

Ed Boon: Yea, what's up?

You: *back,foward,punch*. You see that? You see the way he just threw that spear?

Ed Boon: Yea, I guess that's the new spear move.

You: You see the buttons I just had to push in order for him to do the move?....

Ed Boon: Yea, I guess the guys are trying something totally different with the configurations....

You: Naw dawg, this ain't gonna work maine...Got-ta change that one dawg"

(lol) and actually have them consider changing the thing?


-----------------
You see, none of the essential "game making" is contributed to by the fans. Like tinkering with the graphics or mechanics systems, or the over all story for the game. But I feel like, shouldn't We know, after some 15yrs what Scorpion is supposed to look like?

Don't we know how he's supposed to feel, or what he's capable of when we play with him, or Raiden, or whoever? I'm saying, the fans of whatever character,..be more involved in what the character is made up of. Because we have an established connection to said character already.

Doesn't that make sense...by now?

I know I'm thinking of less an influence on the game than to actually have to hire people onto the MkTeam itself. But I also know I'm asking about a more evident influence on the little stupid specifics that fans rant and rave about when the Team misses them.

Am I off on this or what?

This is in response to the long post right above this one.

Well, I have to admit that I was really pissed off when I found out Kintaro could not do the Shokan Teleport Jump! Hell he was the first to use it damn it!!

But no, I don’t think that would be a good idea, because the reason MK is so awesome is because the team keeps us guessing! Just because some one can write a cool fan fic. Does not mean they can live up to the story telling skills of John Tobias or John Vogel and his team. See we know how scorpion moves, but before MK:DA we did not know he could summon hell fire or do flaming back flips. See if some one who only knew about MK1-4 scorpion came up with his moves they might have missed a cool addition to the game play like that. The fact of the matter is, The MK team has been at it for a long time and Ed Boon has been there since the beginning. Every Mortal Kombat that has “failed” were the ones he had nothing to do with. (i.e. special forces, MK: advanced). Being in the Industry as long as they have been gives them some major insight that a Fan fic. Writer does not have.
I am just impressed that they go through the Midway Forums and listen to Fans and such. We already do help them with there games. We let them know what they did wrong and what they did right. Hell John Vogel even apologies for the Quan Chi Fatality in MK:DA ha ha ha

Hm. I must admit, I'm a bit surprised. More at your particular stand point than the "yes or no" answer to my question.

But, essentially, wouldn't you consider Vogel a fan of Mortal Kombat himself? As well as Boon and any other member of the team? Which I'd think, would contribute to their on-going interest and involvement in the story, gameplay and graphics of MK? I wouldn't have that be any other way.

Cuz you know, someone who simply works for the team might not have the same passion for the series. So I wouldn't say that some Fan Fic "can't live up to the standards". Cuz on occasion, some actually do surpass imo. Especially given MkA's horrid story failure( I know, I know what happened). Which leads me back to specifics.

(this question can still be answered by anyone btw)

If you took like 5, meticulously nominated fans from a fansite like ours(MKO), that were dedicated to one common fav character(ex: they all like Scorpion), and told them to:

1. Submit a bio for their character
2. Submit at least one alternate costume for their character(max 3)
3. Submit an analyst of the gameplay, character feel, and character moves(fighting style, specials, fatalities, ect...).

You're telling me, that there's nothing good that could come from that, simply because we haven't been working for the actual MKTeam all these years? Are you saying that you think a fan hasn't come up with "hellfire" for Scorpion before it was introduced to us in the game?

Please explain, cuz now I'm intrigued. lol

You see, by submitting fan contrived concepts that are concentrated to one particular character, the concepts themselves would still be subject to the actual MkTeams discretion. Which is really what my idea is about.

Fans would metaphorically be, a type of race horse with the directional blinds on. Which would mean that, the nominated few, wouldn't have "complete access" to any part of the "making of the game".

In my mind, I think it's entirely possible to allow a couple of fans access to their fav character before a game comes out. And to have them affect that characters performance because....we know what we want from each of our fav characters. To have the MKTeam consider that more intimately?
*Pom Poms*

For instance here: We get renders of characters long before the game is finished, pressed and released. What's saying that right around that time, they allow fans to come up with 5 alternate costumes? 2 of which, actually become a part of what the creators massage into the characters' clothing articles.

Or, the nominees contribute story elements specific to a character? This doesn't say that the nominees know much, or for that matter, anything at all about what the Team had, or has in store for that character. Just helps them see what the top fans of that character could be expecting storywise.
And again, I don't under estimate fan submissionsall. We have some excellent writers around MKO and other MK fan sites. XaiouDun84 is wonderful, and LeoBrZ81 can write some really vivd//graphic fight scenes.

Same for visuals. Someone like Aculeus has actually had one of his pieces of art in the game. Ever seen this?




It's in the krypt of MkDa? I wanna say? This dude is fantastic. lol. So is JAX007, and a couple other people around these fan sites.

I'm trying to figure out why they wouldn't strongly "consider" submissions from these types of talents. lol. At least on a "surface" condition. Meaning that we just give them very good, raw, interpretations of our favorite characters, and have them do what they do until they reach completion in the direction they were already headed.

But yea, tell me what you think....cuz I think I got enough to start a thread on this.

If I could ask the MK team a question it would be : “ Why did you guys not make new character Designs for all the MK characters for Armageddon” I think that contributed to many people’s problem with the game.

Another Question:

Can we have another game like Shaolin Monks please?

I would ask about MK8, (even though we won't know since Midway loves to tease hehe)


Another MK adventure game, SM style or MKM:Sub-Zero either one would be hot!

More DS MK games, UMK3 was perfectly done for the DS and is tons of fun online.

Perhaps next time MK2 with motor kombat?

I'd ask em whaddup with the many concept sketches of Hsu Hao in MKDA...j/k. I'd really ask them if they're going to put Tremor in MK8.

Another Line of Questioning:

Have you considered "EXC"(Elite Xtreme Combat), or something of that basic idea? "Mixed Martial Arts" in one character to where the "fighting styles", are not so clear and defined, but more like a quality about a character?

Alot of martial artist know multiple styles of fighting. (Boxing, Karate, & Jujitsu for example.) Presenting fighting styles in this manner could simply be used to distinguish the character(or the way the player fights with that character), and not just define each-and-every-fighting-style from the next.

Have you thought about mixing them together to compliment the characters//players' persona, instead of making us fight in "exactly" whatever style we're using?

Hypothetically now, if it was applied, how feasible do you think, is it that we could acquire more skills, or more martial arts styles into one character?

For instance: Scorpion comes with Hapkido and Ninjistu skills, but can learn some Weaponry, Nan Chuan and Boxing skills.......or whatever.

Hm, MMA is a fun concept, Pred. But I personally would prefer a fighting style more suited to a character (i.e. name, origins, intents, skills, the overall feel for a character.). MMA best belongs in an octagon.

MMA?

Mixed Martial Arts. Like your last post, as in the one I responded to.

MMA's just the abbreviation. EXC wasn't too familiar to me.

From: Watch this video about Unreal 3 Engine. This is why MK has the potential to be great.

............My questions consist of this:

1. "Art Direction"-- How do you (like The_Truth stated) "push" the engine to establish uniqueness from the resulting games of this engines predecessors, and still maintain this "dark and gritty" feel? I mean, what kind of objectives do you set if Re-invention is the goal?

2. "Mechanics" -- The biggest problem Mortal Kombat games have is mechanical. So after you get the look you want, what kinds of things do you change about your past that can be complimented by using this engine?

There's all sorts of existing animation techniques, and mechanical avenues to explore. We know a good amount about the other popular fighting games, and what they did//are doing. So, what could they do that wouldn't screw the gameplay up further, but keep them set apart from the others?

This keeping reinvention of Mortal Kombat in mind, they could fool around and make the gameplay TOO unique, JUST because they are using a new engine.

Somebody's gotta knows more about this than me.

A simple question: why?

ok .... I wonder if ermac or cyrax will be in MK8 . That will be cool. The fatality will be like deception and the others past games or the same way that amargeddon but with different combinaison for finishing his opponent for each character ?

Q: Why do you focus on 15% of your character cast when you have over 60 characters that you've created?

i would ask him if hes hiding any secrets from the games,like if theres still secrets left to find.

I realize that I'm long overdue for replying to this sort of thread. Sorry Pred, but when it comes to threads like these, I tend to have a hard time gathering my thoughts for one big, nutritious post.

Jumping straight into the MMA idea, I was thinking something like that. Imo, it works better for some characters than others. Even with 1 style, it could be modified to give a personalized feel for the character. This especially applies to two characters who use the same fighting style. To use Scorpion as an example for the personalized style, it could represent more of the aggressive aspects of that style.

For those who are not aware of my ranting about Scorpion's style choices, I'm someone who is in great favor of simply reconstructing Shirai Ryu Taijutsu by drawing influence from Togakure Ryu, Kumogakure Ryu, Gyokushin Ryu, Koto Ryu, and probably even Gyokko Ryu. These arts are ones that were said to be used by historical Shinobi Mono (a.k.a. Ninja), so it would make sense for Scorpion to use such a style instead of Hapkido, a modern Korean martial art.

Next we have the contrast of two characters using the same fighting style. Hmm, I'm going to use Shotokan, a Japanese style of Karate, as an example. Shotokan is usually described as being very linear, aggressive, hard-hitting, and external. It mainly uses striking and kicking techniques and deep, wide stances. One character could use a more offensive stance like Zenkutsu Dachi (front stance) and use more striking techniques while the other character could use a more defensive stance like Neko Ashi Dachi (cat leg/foot stance) and use more kicking techniques.

Where mixing martial arts styles works best is when it comes to most characters from other realms like Outworld. For example, Shao Kahn's fighting styles in MKD are Tai Tzu Changquan (Emperor Tai Tzu's Long Fist) and Liu He Quan (Six Harmonies Fist). Considering that Shao Kahn is many thousands, maybe even millions, of years old and is from another realm, it doesn't quite make sense for him to be using such styles. So for him, he could have a made up style that draws influences from real martial arts styles, such as Tai Tzu Changquan, Sanhuang Paochui, Bajiquan, Si Tong Chui, etc.

Two things I think could be implemented are the use of style-oriented defense moves and a universal ground game. Like nindz, a veteran member here, suggested a long time ago, there could be style-oriented defense moves such as the hard blocks of Tae Kwon Do and Karate or the hand-trapping techniques of Wing Chun and Escrima. For the universal ground game, I'm not talking about wake up moves but rather something that goes along with Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and various forms of wrestling that use groundfighting techniques. That way, such styles might actually work well in MK.

Now that I got that out of the way, I'll get into some other things.

I think that it would be cool to have fans like XiahouDun84, bleed, Konqrr, etc. be involved in the MK games. They could definitely give a positive contribution to the games and revitalize the series as it so badly needs.

For the art and overall design, it definitely needs to go in a darker, grittier direction, imo. For the mechanics, they need to implement the essentials and do those right before adding on any special things like "air kombat".

My question has to do with the story. Would they be able to make a sort of "MK Bible" that acts as an encyclopedia containing canon story elements for the MK games and flesh out the various stories? Although not all of the fans care about the story, it's something that fans such as myself would want to get.

Yea, that's along the lines of what I'm thinking. Cuz, you see, though i'm not a martial artist myself, many of the people I run into have more experience than just one style. So I guess it's another question of how the MKTeam can add more depth to the roster, and more character to the game.

I agree even more now with the way you put that "it would work better for some than others". Because some people just take up one style, or are better at just one. Some briefly study other styles and it compliments their specialty style. Yknow?

I think about it in a way that some martial artist are introduced to a ring. The announcers usually give us a run-down of what skills the fighter has. Just makes sense to add those kinds of traits to Mortal Kombat. Seeing as how it's the "off the wall" game out of all the other fighters.



I almost forgot you, and like Chrome, were my references on this site for particular martial arts information.

But again, I agree, and i think that little subtleties like that not only helps distinguish each character from the next, but it shows us more of the aspects of a particular martial art style.

Too, if we had to deal katas again(I think that'd be a good challenge in a extra mode or something. "Performing the Kata correctly"), that might also individualize them too.



You know, I think mixing martial arts should depend more on the story
of a character. i.e. "He comes from a history of boxers"..."She picked up martial arts from her friends, sisters, cousins(twice removed), grandfather after her whole family died"...ect(lol).

Just saying that the various attributes of a character should affect their experience as a fighter...and that those things are tightly nit within story parameters.

The age of a character is huge imo. I mean, over time, how bored are you anyway right? You have to be doing something with that time, and since these are supposed to be dedicated fighters, why wouldn't they expand their fighting skills?

It's exactly what we see in the dojos and in the movies all over the world. I think this would also make sense specifically pertaining to Mortal Kombat, because we always have the "big bad guy" waiting at the top of the latter.

Why, other than him just being the big bad guy? Why is he special? Is he an extremely weathered martial artist? Does that depend on his age? Was he "The One" somewhere else? Is he a sorcerer//wizard above the rest? A God?....Proove it.

We've had all of those types of bosses, I know. But I think the reason why they continually decline for favor of the next one...Is because we just beat them and wait for the next game to beat the next on a continuum. The impression that leaves is not a lasting one for sheer skill of the boss. There's no background-in-skill established...so there is little to no lasting fear factor per, the caliber of the boss in question.

You see? We can't refer to Shao Kahn as the ultimate boss because he was a brutal Emperor, and the "pure aggression of ___, ___, and ___ martial arts styles". There's nothing to learn, nothing to compare, nothing to fear.

I think in 2008>> we need more than we got during MK1-T



I just wanna ask if you're opposed to exaggeration? Or like slap-blocking?

I took some Karate and some Tae Kwon Do classes and the "hard blocking" you mention rings a huge bell to me.



You too. I'd add you to that list. You seem to know what you're talking about, and I think you're a compliment to XD84.




I'd agree in mood. I think we need deeper characters, and a more vivid, more elaborate rage of killing grounds.

Good post as usual man.

Exactly HOW much will the franchise change in MK8?Or, will it be closer to retro Mortal Kombat games (MK1, Mk2, MK3)?

Basically, will mortal kombat 8 change everything dramatically or go back to the roots of the franchise?

From what I read on Boon's interview, MK8 will be dramatically changed. So basically, FAR from MK1,MK2,etc. Those styles and fighting will be no more.
The style, gameplay, characters-- almost everything.
He stated that MK:A was the last of what we've seen for Mortal Kombat. Take a look here:
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/2007/02/05/new-mortal-kombat-8 -will-be-dark-gritty-and-completely-reinvented- fighting-on-xbox-360-ps3-maybe-wii-in-november-2008.htm
(*Sorry, everyone, I have yet to find out how to put up links -_-*)