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reptilz
04/30/2008 05:51 AM (UTC)
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Preditor 151 I agree 100%.
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mastermalone
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04/30/2008 04:30 PM (UTC)
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ThePredator151 Wrote:
I was reading over a couple of the rants and a couple things stuck out to me...I'll jump around over time with these things..cuz I really don't care for an "argument"...

But, whatever happens I'm wit it.

So, let's go in..

mastermalone Wrote:
Now, the inclusion of the DC characters may seem wierd and gimmicky, but it is a nice touch in my opinion. Most Non-MK fan's interest in the game has been sparked by this news. Even gamers on SRK (www.Shoryuken.com) have expressed interest in the game now that the focus on gore is no longer the main point of MK vs DC.

They are laughing at all of you because your precious fatalities are gone. They plan on buying the game therefore, replacing all of you who will not buy the game.

I'm laughing too. I say, if the game sucks, pass on it, but if it's good, why screw yourself out of a great experience?

I tend to use common sense when it comes to these issues.


First is the blackened comment. I wanted to ask you: "How's that better?"

From a business standpoint, the dream is a customer base who will almost mindlessly buy your product on an endless continuum. What they'll be effectively doing, if the gameplay is "stellar", and your comment becomes the truth, is exchanging pretty much guaranteed sales, for skeptics and nay sayers of the franchise based on this franchises gameplay history. People who haven't had any faith in the franchise vs the opposite. Generally speaking anyway...

Players who's buy will depend solely on whether MK's gameplay resembles what their criticisms allow them to understand as correct. Because as I understand it, those fans don't buy a fighting game for any other reason than "excellent // good" gameplay. It's why those games suffer everywhere else that MK is strongest, and it doesn't matter to them. All the other "Fluff", as it's renowned, is MK's strong points.

I'm saying, look at the history here, in context to what's going on right now within the MK fanbase. How would that "exchange" be a good one? Especially if it were absolute...
=-=-=-=-=-=

When you consider that this gimmick itself is placing those usual, "pretty much guaranteed" sales in jeopardy right now....how is what you said a laughable instance?

The way I'm looking at it, and based on your comment, that at least has strong similarities to asking for "The Death of MK". Because the worst case scenario in that instance, would be no "replacement" of current fans with other ones, and nobody likes the game even after playing it. See what I mean?

It's all gathered around the very gimmicks they're trying to use to sell the game. "DC" & "look at the gameplay".

But, you screw up the story, and the gameplay STILL isn't adequate? All that's left is half the MK characters that should be there in the first place, and some newly designed DC characters.

Just saying that this maneuver, this..exchange you're talking about, is jeopardized in the first place. It'd be a stupid marketing tecnique if that's in fact what they were trying to do...which I don't that's the case.

Business common sense tells you to retain....and expand you client//customer base.

And on that note: Can Anyone tell me where MK benefits from DC being there?

I've toyed around with the "shock value" of the two universes, equating to bigger numbers. That's the one, and main way, but if it tanks, where would they benefit? DC wins either way from the venture. *shrugs*

=====

On another note here, and from my analyst of MK's past gameplay, people buy it because the characters have potential to fight like a fictional martial arts movies, choreography. Or, "movie magic".

There is nothing technically sound about that, the purchase, or the gameplay any way you look at that. "Technical Martial Arts Styles" themselves were slim to none back in the day with MK1-4. And with the last three MK games, it seems they can't even get those on point enough to entice the people you say would conveniently "replace" current MK fans. So I don't get it..

But...that's what the preference over the technical fighters is all about. People aren't buying MK because the styles are historical, or correctly portrayed in the game. That doesn't matter enough to this fanbase as I understand it. Generally people don't really care if it's "absolutely correct", they just want it to "look good while they're kicking somebodies ass".

That's as far as MK fans go...is the "flashy" portions of movie choreography. That's all. Eastern created, eastern concepts influenced by what Hollywood is doing.

Of course we have a few "techies" over here, but that's all people are generally asking for from this franchise. In that perception of things, it ain't called Nan Chuan...It's just....."What would Raiden look like fighting?"

I'd say, alot like MK1-2, give or take a few things.

=-=-=-=-=-=

Speaking for myself now, I buy MK for the same reason as far as gameplay is concerned....I'm just one of the people who can recognize that even given the above paragraph(s), the MKTeam hasn't even been making that idea(or a similar one that's been in the games) WORK RIGHT". That's my frustration, is that it just don't work right from a programming standpoint.

Whatever the concept is about MK's gameplay, has never been technically correct on any level...really. But, I recognize how all the terminology's purposes are relevant. Frame advantages, oki and all that...I know, I get it.

Saying that if they're gonna go with a gimmick, and want to attract more people to the franchise, that they should be using the gimmicks they have...instead of reaching out, and throwing more "new", "shocking", and as XD84 put it, "goofy" concepts into the pot. They got more than enough to do what they're trying to do...they just took it in the wrong direction at some point.

I'd say >>

::Exploit the concept of MK's gameplay: go all out, make it looks like a Jackie Chan///Jet Li//Donnie Yen//Chow Yun Fat//Tony Jaa//Zhang Ziyi..ect ect movie fight. It's not technical at all in it's conceptual-ism. Some of the other games are stepping right on this right now...VF5 is the closest to this that I can think of right now.

::Exploit the Story element: go all out, there's enough there to write a couple fantasy novels. I don't have to read much to figure this out. Never have.

::Exploit each character: more than 3 out of the 60+ characters should have alternate titles by now. Or be a part of an alternate title. Mythologies or Shaolin Monks should be series of they're own, that run in story behind and exploit all the loose strings of the main fighting games that come out. Judging by his popularity alone, we should have been had a Scorpion game. Full of shirai ryu clan stuff, the distaste towards the Lin Kuei, and leading on past his murder and the murder of the first Sub-Zero..

That shit is a book and a game all by itself.

::Exploit MK1-Ts' art direction & fantasy: go Boris Vallejo & Julie Bell, or Luis Royo, and the like. Realize something like their art in MK...it's right on point for MK. Matches almost perfectly without even touching it. Google them as their spelled here and you will see...
=====================

Anyway, I hope this is the case with MKvsDC, regardless of the overall gimmick. But i've learned to heighten my skepticisms as far as MK's potential is concerned. This current game so far seems to be just another occurrence in the "un-realized potential" saga of MK.

So, given the history of MKs gamplay, this gimmick, and the fact that I rented the last 2 MK games first....There's no way in hell I'm sold on this. There's no way I'm even convinced to "give it a chance" just yet.

The best case scenario that I can think of right now, is that they prove me wrong, show something wildy contrary to my current thought process at E3, and THEN, I'll get on the side of "just try it, you can't judge it till you play it". But let's be real about it, they're not gonna drop this..."unorthodox" gimmick and finally comply. Not in the middle of this campaign..

As it stands right now, I'm merely considering playing it just cuz I want to. Other than that, there's no reason for me to touch this game. Not their "word", not anything "new" their coming up with, not the DC characters, or the Story element, and definitely not the "POTENTIAL" that gameplay MAY be "better" this time around...

Why look at it differently now considering the past is un-shaken? Why should I be optimistic about what seems to be the same formula over again?

DC characters? Teh n00 gameplay?

That's the laughable part man..

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Lastly here, what you're considering common sense isn't so. Considering the tendencies of this franchises history, common sense points to "Don't buy this one cuz they're doing what they did before...again". They're trying to trick everybody into buying this one, with yet another open ended invitation that "the next one will be better" somehow...

Well, I wanted them to prove it this time instead of jerking people around AGAIN. Close the open ended bs, make the gameplay work right no matter what the concept for it was, and write a completely canon story for once. No more ridiculous "To be continued" crap unless it's really REALLY warranted.

The way I see it, MK is thee "Shocking" franchise to the fighting game genre already. Every game they've released has had more than adequate shock value. Whether it was blood, gore, and fatalities....or bigger bosses, huge rosters, or "end of the world scenarios" in story that sold those games. It's never lacked the way of shock value.

That's why they keep selling the games. It's never a "quality" selling point with them...it has always been a huge gimmick to keep the sales up and the profits rolling in. (they've never said, our gameplay is the best, our story is the best, our characters are the best, our art direction is the best..or whatever. It's always "Hey, look at this new.....GIMMICK".)

Anyway, the only way that they've really always lacked is gameplay. That's the only real constant, and especially since 3D. Story isn't. Character design or development isn't...it's always been something finicky about the gameplay. It was just acceptable at a time in history more than another.

::iMo, they just fail to show mastery of their own, self created craft. Saying that if you're going to be the franchise that helps launch "blood, gore, fantasy, story, and martial arts" on to the gaming scene, own that shit.

"Keeping up with the Jones' " ain't the point. As an example, there's not another guy like Jackie Chan in the business like he is. It's cuz he proved "you can't do it better than me while I'm around...". Mk hasn't really proved anything besides being able to lead people on, and "shock" them every once in a while.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

It's like, conceding like they've done doesn't necessarily "finish them" off right away...but progressively, you mind as well step to the side and let somebody else do it like you should have been doing it all along. Business contingencies or not, there's no excuse NOT to do YOU better than everybody else. MK IS the commodity, not "MK & DC for the purposes of"....

That's really the radical dispute about blood and gore and fatalities man...

EX::) What if Jay-Z tried to convince people to buy a CD of his, that was a children's record....or gospel...or rock & roll? That shit is out of character like crazy...and nobody would buy that from him. I'd even question people buying anything else from him after that. And if Jay-Z doesn't work for you, use 50Cent... Aheh, supposed to be "Mr Gangsta, hustler, guns and thug life, and you put out a children's album?" No deal d00d. Doesn't matter if it was the best lyics and beats man has ever heard.

Now, apply that to MK. "Supposed to be blood and gore and fatalities, and you go an tangle around in the ring with a franchise that you know doesn't solicit what you're about?" No deal d00d...and just for that, I might not buy the next one either.

They fucked up on a few levels with this one, at least recognize it. lol

===================
--------
===================

More, and probably somebody else later. Although I think there's a couple other things in your post that stick out.

151



Let me start by reitterating that yes, SRK is laughing at MKO forum members who are saddened by the lack of gory fatalities.

To begin answering your questions I'll start with:
"How's that better?" From a business standpoint, the dream is a customer base who will almost mindlessly buy your product on an endless continuum. What they'll be effectively doing, if the gameplay is "stellar", and your comment becomes the truth, is exchanging pretty much guaranteed sales, for skeptics and nay sayers of the franchise based on this franchises gameplay history. People who haven't had any faith in the franchise vs the opposite. Generally speaking anyway...

Well, for starters, the small number of people who will actually not buy the game based on the lack of fatalities will no doubt be replaced by a potentially larger consumer base due largely in part to the inclusion of the DC characters and the "T" rating. Now, teenaged Timmy's mom will have no problem buying him an MK game, not to mention that the game will have characters that she herself recognizes. The SRK members will purchace the game once/if the gameplay has been established as acceptable. So from a business standpoint, I see the tradoff of losing a few disgruntled gore fans for a potentially larger installed base as a positive.

As I mentioned before, most of those SRK guys had no idea that there were new MK games made after MK4. They know about this new game which bodes well for potential sales.

Keep in mind that this game will still retain a certain level of brutality. The MK Team is pushing the limites of the T rating so I'm sure we'll see finishers along the same level of violence as Def Jam: Fight for NY or Marvel Nemesis. Besides, most of the fatalities in MK were just plain silly if you ask me. MK 1 and 2 were the most gruesome, after that, we had Jax growing 200 feet tall and Liu kang dropping MK machines on fallen foes. Weak.


There is nothing technically sound about that, the purchase, or the gameplay any way you look at that. "Technical Martial Arts Styles" themselves were slim to none back in the day with MK1-4. And with the last three MK games, it seems they can't even get those on point enough to entice the people you say would conveniently "replace" current MK fans. So I don't get it..

But...that's what the preference over the technical fighters is all about. People aren't buying MK because the styles are historical, or correctly portrayed in the game. That doesn't matter enough to this fanbase as I understand it. Generally people don't really care if it's "absolutely correct", they just want it to "look good while they're kicking somebodies ass"


I am a bit puzzled by this particular comment. I for one have never bought a fighting game purely for it's authentic representation of actual Martial Arts. Street Fighter is and always will be my favorite fighting game franchise yet, none of the characters in that game have ever employed the use of an authentic looking Martial arts style. If a fighting game mimiced reality too much, it would be boring. Not even Virtual Fighter is 100% accurate in it's representation of Martial Arts. Reality is boring, fantasy is fun. That's the rule.

The way I see it, MK is thee "Shocking" franchise to the fighting game genre already. Every game they've released has had more than adequate shock value. Whether it was blood, gore, and fatalities....or bigger bosses, huge rosters, or "end of the world scenarios" in story that sold those games. It's never lacked the way of shock value.

That's why they keep selling the games. It's never a "quality" selling point with them...it has always been a huge gimmick to keep the sales up and the profits rolling in. (they've never said, our gameplay is the best, our story is the best, our characters are the best, our art direction is the best..or whatever. It's always "Hey, look at this new.....GIMMICK".

Anyway, the only way that they've really always lacked is gameplay. That's the only real constant, and especially since 3D. Story isn't. Character design or development isn't...it's always been something finicky about the gameplay. It was just acceptable at a time in history more than another.



I agree with this section 80%. Yes MK's shock value is it's selling point. But again, the shock value doesn't have to be grotesque finishing moves or stage death traps. The shock value here with MKvs DC is the inclusion of the DC characters. Plus, the actual fighting seems to be more cinematic than previous incarnations of the franchise, which adds more shock value. Honestly, people expect MK to rely on Shock to sell it, but how about great presentation, quality and overall experience for a change? Wouldn't you prefer that to just some lame fatality that you would no doubt complain about on these forums.

What if Jay-Z tried to convince people to buy a CD of his, that was a children's record....or gospel...or rock & roll? That shit is out of character like crazy...and nobody would buy that from him. I'd even question people buying anything else from him after that. And if Jay-Z doesn't work for you, use 50Cent... Aheh, supposed to be "Mr Gangsta, hustler, guns and thug life, and you put out a children's album?" No deal d00d. Doesn't matter if it was the best lyics and beats man has ever heard.

Now, apply that to MK. "Supposed to be blood and gore and fatalities, and you go an tangle around in the ring with a franchise that you know doesn't solicit what you're about?" No deal d00d...and just for that, I might not buy the next one either.


That analogy is a bit extreme lol! If Jay-Z tried to sell gospel, he would no doubt falter, so in that respect you are correct. However, Jay-Z used to create very hardcore, explicit material. He has since cleaned that up and was able to produce better sales that he previously had. He has now moved up to producing new talent and owns his own record lable. In addition to that, he scored a knock out of a woman (Beyonce Knoles). I would say he did quite well after cleaning up his act.

Look, all in all, I can see how you would come to your conclusions, but I've been around for a while and I 've learned how business models work. I've written many a course on business in my day. Remember, I am also an instructional designer for an online college, so i've picked up on a few things while writing about the various subjects. Midway has made a business decision (a gamble) to reduce the violence level of MK to gain a wider audience.

They have also included some of the world's most recognized characters to attract an even wider audience. That, makes perfect business sense to me. As far as the story is concerned, I have no doubt that those DC writers can come up with an outstanding plotline. I'm not too worried there. What I am worried about is whether or not the gameplay will be smooth and intuitive.

Thanks for responding with an intelligent post Predator. I enjoy your style of debating as opposed to some of the others here who flat out attack instead of replying with a well written replay.


Peace



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reppy
05/01/2008 03:52 AM (UTC)
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XiahouDun84 Wrote:
My 2 cent rant on this absurdity...
All in all, I have no real expectations for MK vs. DC. I'm not excited about it...but I'm not really pissed off about it either. In all honestly, I'm just rolling with the punches and watching to see how things play out. At the end of the day, as long as the gameplay is good, Kitana & Wonder Woman are in, and the story is non-canon & MK9 returns to normal.....won't bug me.


Once again, the voice of reason. Thanks, Xia. :)
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VENOMOUS75
05/01/2008 06:14 AM (UTC)
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Not that I'm taking sides in this, but why make a rant thread, if the ranters can't rant wihout an argument from those who are happy for the game?

Maybe I'm looking at this the wrong way: perhaps this is an equal opportunity rant thread...?
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05/01/2008 08:40 AM (UTC)
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mastermalone Wrote:Let me start by reitterating that yes, SRK is laughing at MKO forum members who are saddened by the lack of gory fatalities.


You know, I never doubted that...I just questioned the funny part about it.

How is it "funny" that as of the announcement, MK is......handicapped? I don't get the joke.

Well, I guess the fact that I don't care about this game right now could contribute to why I missed the joke(lol) but..nah-ah, I don't get the joke. They won't get a "complete" MK game either..... Whether they replace a couple fans over here, or not. *shrugs*


mastermalone Wrote:Well, for starters, the small number of people who will actually not buy the game based on the lack of fatalities will no doubt be replaced by a potentially larger consumer base due largely in part to the inclusion of the DC characters and the "T" rating. Now, teenaged Timmy's mom will have no problem buying him an MK game, not to mention that the game will have characters that she herself recognizes. The SRK members will purchace the game once/if the gameplay has been established as acceptable. So from a business standpoint, I see the tradoff of losing a few disgruntled gore fans for a potentially larger installed base as a positive.


I got it..

I'm not gonna sit here and argue hypothetics and further the assumptions. lol

mastermalone Wrote:As I mentioned before, most of those SRK guys had no idea that there were new MK games made after MK4. They know about this new game which bodes well for potential sales.


I think they would have known about "MK8" either way. In fact, I'm sure of it, considering this is "the year of the fighting game genre". They were paying attention to this market enter 2008. So I don't buy that DC characters, or the promise of better gameplay did that. Wouldn't have to look for it at all to see MK competing with SC, SF, Tekken, DOA, or VF again.

mastermalone Wrote:Keep in mind that this game will still retain a certain level of brutality. The MK Team is pushing the limites of the T rating so I'm sure we'll see finishers along the same level of violence as Def Jam: Fight for NY or Marvel Nemesis. Besides, most of the fatalities in MK were just plain silly if you ask me. MK 1 and 2 were the most gruesome, after that, we had Jax growing 200 feet tall and Liu kang dropping MK machines on fallen foes. Weak.


I don't buy into that "pushing the limits" bs either. A limit is a limit man.....The difference will have to be considerable in order for it to be considered "T" (the SIMS games are Teen rated). And I think the finishers in DJ and MN sucked anyway, really bad actually.

Somebody had to bring me those games for me to play them...But once I saw the attempt, I put those games down, never to pick them back up again. Even though I recognized the sales tactic too. Just seemed like a cheezy cop out for the sake of sales vs the characters names. Like 50Cent's game(s). That's not what I wanna play.

I have a thing about knockoffs too so, once I identified with the ploy, plot, and scheme of those games, and then make my little contrast, it totally turned me off about those games. I love Fight Night on the other hand...but, and because that's something else entirely.

And I agree with MK1&2...& maybe even MKdA. That one wasn't bad for fatalities either. MK3-4, and MKD & A were "eh". So I see your point.

mastermalone Wrote:I am a bit puzzled by this particular comment. I for one have never bought a fighting game purely for it's authentic representation of actual Martial Arts. Street Fighter is and always will be my favorite fighting game franchise yet, none of the characters in that game have ever employed the use of an authentic looking Martial arts style. If a fighting game mimiced reality too much, it would be boring. Not even Virtual Fighter is 100% accurate in it's representation of Martial Arts. Reality is boring, fantasy is fun. That's the rule.


You got it, I agree. That's all I was saying.


mastermalone Wrote:
I agree with this section 80%. Yes MK's shock value is it's selling point. But again, the shock value doesn't have to be grotesque finishing moves or stage death traps. The shock value here with MKvs DC is the inclusion of the DC characters. Plus, the actual fighting seems to be more cinematic than previous incarnations of the franchise, which adds more shock value. Honestly, people expect MK to rely on Shock to sell it, but how about great presentation, quality and overall experience for a change? Wouldn't you prefer that to just some lame fatality that you would no doubt complain about on these forums.


Oh I'm not pressing the grotesque issue. But, the effect would be the same (and I'd argue greater) if it were there instead of the DC characters. "Shocking"....Now add the cinematic, and or this possible "better gameplay" to that scenario. Sold! Right away. You'd have everybody age 17 and up running to go get this game. Run-ning lol

So, of course, I would LOVE quality from MK. The problem is, this venture is not indicative of that. This constitution is a sales tactic. Pure and simple.

One of the things you'll find from my post all over the net about Mk is that they have yet to show mastery 15+years in for what they've been doing. They haven't mastered "Mortal Kombats gameplay", "Mortal Kombats Story Element", Mortal Kombat's Fantasy, Brutality, grotesque blood & gore, OR graphics element". They haven't mastered any of what's important to the "quality of MORTAL KOMBAT itself. YET

The only thing they have mastered....you guessed it....is the Gimmick factor. The shock value....they've mastered how to get the games sold to an adequate degree. Yes sir....

I think that's really silly when if they just made THEIR game great, they wouldn't have to attempt ploys like this current one "for the sake of....". And if they did it anyway, it would just sell the game even more.
Not making the right game is not going to sell you more copies...it's just an exchange of some sort. Making the right game, in which the quality of that item is fantastic for what it is meant to be, would be....Halo3, Call of Duty4, GTA4, Mario Galaxy, Smash Bros Brawl...ect ect as far as sales are concerned..."iMo" I guess, hu?

mastermalone Wrote:They have also included some of the world's most recognized characters to attract an even wider audience. That, makes perfect business sense to me. As far as the story is concerned, I have no doubt that those DC writers can come up with an outstanding plotline. I'm not too worried there. What I am worried about is whether or not the gameplay will be smooth and intuitive.


I get that concept, yet this particular venture still seems so out of wack. So bizarre a choice. Even considering MK's history it's still really unorthodox.

Hm..Far as the writers, I don't doubt their talents either. Not one bit, and in fact, if they were writing specifically for MK and nothing else, I'd be all geeked about it. lol I just don't want what their writing. *shrugs*

mastermalone Wrote:Thanks for responding with an intelligent post Predator. I enjoy your style of debating as opposed to some of the others here who flat out attack instead of replying with a well written replay.


Peace


All hood man.

151
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skillz
05/01/2008 02:18 PM (UTC)
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I can see that the people who will not buy MK vs. DC because of the lack of gore will be replaced by young kids. That is almost a fact since we know that there is a "T" rating. However, the question if SRK members will buy the game is really hard to say..and sofar I'm tending towards a "No".

Reason for me to say this, is your point about gameplay as a deciding factor. The way I see it, SRK members are people that play SF, SC, and VF that are all in the same league. Meaning their basic needs of gameplay is of a high standard.

They didn't heard of or played MK 5, 6 & 7 because it wasn't in the same league of gameplay.

Because we've seen and heard little bout the actual gameplay of MK8, it is hard to say if this MK will compete with the rest. My reason why I am saying "No" sofar is because I heard the same thing since MKDA.
Where I heard

"We've got different fighting syles"
"We've got deathtraps"


Now I'm hearing

"We have got close kombat"
"We have got Freefall kombat"

It all seems to familiar. But then again, we haven't heard and seen much to make a solid judgement..so I won't, but sofar I'm really sceptical.

I think that Midway don't want to compete with yhe other big fighting games anymore. They want to compete with games where they rely on popularity and gimmicks. Like Def Jam Fightnight, using rappers as a selling factor.

For mainstream gamers it is a "win", for fighting game lovers it is a "loss". That is the way I see it. Correct me if Im wrong.

Jay Z did the same thing, I wouldn't say he cleaned up his act. He decided to focus on another public, and compete on another level. As a hip hop junkie, I wouldn't say that Jay Z lost me. But for certain needs, I will have to look elswhere.

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outworld222
05/01/2008 09:25 PM (UTC)
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To start off, I will not post this in the rant thread. It deserves a thread of its own

To the fans

There were a couple of people here who were trying to warn us of what was about to come. Of particular to mind comes Cyberdog also TRMK, but there were others, perhaps as many as 3 or 4 of more people who told us this game was going to be a VS game. Did we listen? None the same. So what did we resort to? Yes that's right, name calling. I specifically wanted to tell you guys to quiet the storm down, but it would be all the same. It seems to be in your fucken DNA bloodstream to spew profanities and flame half the time. Which brings me to my second point.

To Ed Boon

After giving this great thought, and having gone through the ups and down of what the possibilities could be of this game VS the disappointments [No pun intended], I have come down to two theories which I am sure is what this game comes down to. This game will be a success if and only if with the superb execution of these two separate entities: Character selection, and fighting gameplay mechanics. Hey Ed, Surprise us. Don't just go ahead and pick some characters from MK1 and 2 and call is an MK game. That won't do the game justice, if that is, you still care about the game anymore.

As for the fighting mechanics, its been talked about many times here before, so I won't be going through it, however, if it is something that is extremely tired and out of place, then I will give up on MK for the year 2008.

When is the point where we see the actual potential of this game?

Once the gameplay trailer is out, presumably at E3, that is when we can say: "Hey this is the right thing to do" or,as I fear it may be: "This has gone to an irreversible tangent"

At any rate

Happy waiting
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05/02/2008 05:31 AM (UTC)
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Here's my rant:

My opinion on the idea of MK vs. DC: It's a horrendously stupid idea.

My opinion on Ed Boon: He's a fucking sellout.

My opinion on how the gameplay will be: They still haven't gotten 3D right after 4 console games, why would it change now?

My opinion on how the game will sell: It'll be a huge hit, because people don't know what quality games are. They just see Batman and are like ZOMG MUST BUY.

My opinion on how the storyline will be: Pssh, I play MK for the storyline, and this could be as enthralling as Harry Potter and I won't buy this game. There's a better chance of finding a cure for AIDS than me buying this game.

For my final piece, I want to say that if anyone responds to this post with "you are so totally not a true fan of MK, blah blah blah" then you are truly sad and don't know me at all.
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05/02/2008 05:46 AM (UTC)
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Sorry for the double post, but this just struck a nerve:

mastermalone Wrote:
Let me start by reiterating that yes, SRK is laughing at MKO forum members who are saddened by the lack of gory fatalities.


You say this like we're supposed to care. I'm not bitching about the lack of fatalities (though you can't call it MK without them, it's the series's identity) nor am I looking for an argument with you, but I could honestly give a rat's ass about SRK laughing at us simply because we don't like something about MK vs. DC. We have every right and reason to hate it. But hey, since they're laughing, I'll offer the fact that Street Fighter hasn't exactly been terribly relevant in about 15 years. That'll shut them up. Also, the fact that you stated that most of those guys didn't even know that MKDA, MKD, and MKA existed shows that they really have no right to say anything. They may not have been good games, but for them to not know they existed... I'm not sure how to even explain that one.
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Ninjakata
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05/03/2008 06:55 AM (UTC)
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I'll use this to review my initial thoughts on the announcement, observations and revelations, and end with where I currently stand on their decision to make MK vs DC Universe.


When that render was released to the masses I had to take a good look at it. I couldn't believe what I was seeing, so I tried to reassure myself by thinking that
this was going the Wii's exclusive spin off before they hit us die hards with the true gritty, MK we've been waiting for. Looking at the render again I thought, " Look at the detail on there faces." This is definitely PS3/XBOX 360 material. I didn't sleep much that night fearing the worse. After watching the announcement with the trailer, and watching the Gamespot interview, I was flabbergasted beyond belief. As for immediate thoughts they were:
- They killed the franchise
- You sold out
- Dammit Boon you skinny Lou Ferrigno lookalike, you screwed us again
- DC? What?
- No fatalities? Thats unreal
- I'm not buying this piece of steaming dung
- Damn those marketing demons
- They have knelt to the schlong of DC
Looking back mind you that these are no longer my thoughts, and I mean no disrespect toward Ed Boon. Thats just what ran through my mind at the brief moment I was pissed. I'm sure some of you could relate.

As for how I felt then may be a bit funnier, but hell its how I felt at the time.
It was as if Boon was holding a huge bag of Kibbles n' Bits (next-gen MK news). He sparingly drops each kibble down the long block and turns the corner. Me being the gullable lab I was eagerly proceed to follow the trail while munching on every available kibble and bit of news I could find on the next MK game. I couldnt wait to see what was around the corner. Turning the corner there were a few more kibbles (noob.com number games and crossword puzzles, blurry picture). Then I saw one last kibble which was bigger than than the previous ones. Salivating thinking that this would be the tastiest one, I dig my claws into and devour the last bloated bit. It turned out that the last kibble was indeed poison (MK vs DC reveal).
Where was Boon in all this? Hiding behind the corner empty bag in hand laughing his ass off at my reaction to eating the poison infused kiblet lol.

As for observations Boon actually admits to working on the " next gen MK "
for almost a year before the marketing people came to him with the DC thing. Since they were not going to be fatalities their were certain technologies that they could skip doing in this iteration ( like dismemberment physics). He talks about it in the interview below:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=aHqjzOQN0R4

Watching the trailer on the computer I thought, this looks like a high res Armageddon. Not impressive. Then today I downloaded the trailer on Xbox
live and watched it on my high def TV. I was actually a bit more intrigued. Whats funny is that even through the trailer, they are actually incorporating things I've always wanted to see in a future MK game. Huge levels with huge falling transitions, weaponless hand to hand combat, and Sub-Zero who is my favorite Mortal Kombat character is in so I'll have to at least rent the game.


You know, gameplay wise they are going to have to make a quantum leap. I don't want to see Batman doing 50/50s, 3,3s, and infinite throws online. Gather a school of testers with deep experience and put them to the grind stone.

In conclusion I initially thought that Boon followed through with a sellout idea, but with further thought this could be a setup that could surprise all of
us. They'll reach a larger fanbase, and Boon knows that when he returns to making a bloody MK, the lost fans will come back banging down the doors, thus increasing their sales.










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outworld222
05/03/2008 09:39 PM (UTC)
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For the love of anything, can someone tell me who SMK is????
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-Brad-
05/03/2008 10:29 PM (UTC)
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outworld222 Wrote:
For the love of anything, can someone tell me who SMK is????


It’s a Street Fighter forum.

http://forums.shoryuken.com/
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outworld222
05/03/2008 11:35 PM (UTC)
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Let me just say fatalities have always been not that great of a concern to me since the 2D era ended. Now that we are in the 3D era, it is all about gameplay and character selection. I've said this before, and I will probably say it again.

Other important things include: Background design and Konquest, Mini games, etc.
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mastermalone
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05/03/2008 11:43 PM (UTC)
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m0s3pH Wrote:
Sorry for the double post, but this just struck a nerve:

mastermalone Wrote:
Let me start by reiterating that yes, SRK is laughing at MKO forum members who are saddened by the lack of gory fatalities.


You say this like we're supposed to care. I'm not bitching about the lack of fatalities (though you can't call it MK without them, it's the series's identity) nor am I looking for an argument with you, but I could honestly give a rat's ass about SRK laughing at us simply because we don't like something about MK vs. DC. We have every right and reason to hate it. But hey, since they're laughing, I'll offer the fact that Street Fighter hasn't exactly been terribly relevant in about 15 years. That'll shut them up. Also, the fact that you stated that most of those guys didn't even know that MKDA, MKD, and MKA existed shows that they really have no right to say anything. They may not have been good games, but for them to not know they existed... I'm not sure how to even explain that one.


Don't worry man, I'm not the arguing type grin. I'm grown man with a wife and kid. my wife keeps my busy enough in the argument department lol! Anyway, I made that statement about SRK because it's true. Whether or not you or anyone else "gives a damn" is besides the point. I just wanted to let the people who stated that they will not buy the game, that their decision will not affect the overall success of this game.

By the way, Street Fighter is not the only game that SRK members play. There's maybe 15-20 fighting games that are the topics of discussion there. Street Fighter's relance over the years does not concern them. They will play that 15 year old series for the next 15 years withought so much as a whimper. The quality of the game play transcends time.

The reason that some hardcore fighting fans were unnaware of MKDA-MKA is because Midway lost them at MK4. The subsequent games left so much to be desired that the word of mouth of the new MK games failed to generate much widespread interest in the hardcore community.



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WarriorPrincess
05/05/2008 09:04 AM (UTC)
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At first I was extremely pissed off, well not so much pissed off as I would just very disappointed. I'd been looking forward to this MK news for awhile and it wasn't nearly anything what I expected. Boon left me thinking that this was going to be a revisioning. I thought that a new MK tournament was going to begin fresh, with new fighters on both sides of the playing field, both good & bad. We were promised a darker, grittier, more hardcore MK fighting experience, so seeing that they decided to merge MK and DC was needless to say not the highlight of my day. But after I had a lot of time to sleep on it and think about the possible characters from the DC side that I adore and would like to be involved in the game play, I began to warm up to this crazy idea. So now I am not as objective to the game as I was when the news was first announced. I still have some very high hopes as far as what they do with the graphics, over all game play, costumes, scenery and the roster they will include. I have hopes that my favorite DC villainess' (Catwoman & Poison Ivy) are in the game. Oh god how sad I will be if they are not. Oh and also, I think it's about damn time they started including actual cinematic movie endings for the characters. The last time we had any sort of cinematic ending was MK4. But anyway, I'm done ranting . Carry on, nothing to see here hehe. ^_^
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m0s3pH
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05/05/2008 06:51 PM (UTC)
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mastermalone Wrote:
m0s3pH Wrote:
Sorry for the double post, but this just struck a nerve:

mastermalone Wrote:
Let me start by reiterating that yes, SRK is laughing at MKO forum members who are saddened by the lack of gory fatalities.


You say this like we're supposed to care. I'm not bitching about the lack of fatalities (though you can't call it MK without them, it's the series's identity) nor am I looking for an argument with you, but I could honestly give a rat's ass about SRK laughing at us simply because we don't like something about MK vs. DC. We have every right and reason to hate it. But hey, since they're laughing, I'll offer the fact that Street Fighter hasn't exactly been terribly relevant in about 15 years. That'll shut them up. Also, the fact that you stated that most of those guys didn't even know that MKDA, MKD, and MKA existed shows that they really have no right to say anything. They may not have been good games, but for them to not know they existed... I'm not sure how to even explain that one.


Don't worry man, I'm not the arguing type grin. I'm grown man with a wife and kid. my wife keeps my busy enough in the argument department lol! Anyway, I made that statement about SRK because it's true. Whether or not you or anyone else "gives a damn" is besides the point. I just wanted to let the people who stated that they will not buy the game, that their decision will not affect the overall success of this game.

By the way, Street Fighter is not the only game that SRK members play. There's maybe 15-20 fighting games that are the topics of discussion there. Street Fighter's relance over the years does not concern them. They will play that 15 year old series for the next 15 years withought so much as a whimper. The quality of the game play transcends time.

The reason that some hardcore fighting fans were unnaware of MKDA-MKA is because Midway lost them at MK4. The subsequent games left so much to be desired that the word of mouth of the new MK games failed to generate much widespread interest in the hardcore community.





Oh I'm fully aware that MK4 killed the series, but MKDA got a lot of hype- it just strikes me as a bit odd that they wouldn't know that the last 3 or so games existed... just doesn't add up.
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Deathbearer
05/05/2008 08:57 PM (UTC)
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When I first saw this I felt a combination of disbelief, shock, and hate/rage. Now that the shock and disbelief have worn off and the hate/rage calmed slightly, I just gotta ask...WHY would Boon do this now?! Why not after a game that explained the aftermath of Armegeddon? The fighting looks fun and the graphics look good, but why not just put that shit in a canon MK game?! Why not give us a game with new characters like you said!? I play Xbox live {not MK:A cuz i have the PS2 version} and I for one get tired of pre-pubescent kids' voices shrieking into the headset, and that's exactly what'll happen when their mommies go and buy them this game and they get their asses handed to them since most likey they don't know shit about MK!
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subzerohero0311
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05/05/2008 11:41 PM (UTC)
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I am a big fan of mortal kombat and respect not only the ideas but the risks that have been made to this game, but i have to disagree strongly on the new MK vs. DC.

The first few games were well constructed and had a strong base of characters, They had everything a gamer wanted a new fighters, blood, violence, and the thing we are losing that everyone loves the Fatality's.

These are all concept that made the game what it is and got it talked about from the gamers, readers, and the NEWS. The games got more enhanced and changed drastically for 4 and up, Being the fans and gamers we are we adjusted quickly and loved it. Although Armageddon was somewhat a upset it all set up the excitement of the new release of Mortal Kombat 8.

We were all put on with hopes of new characters, some old ones a new plot, fighting system and so much more. This would have been a great seller like mortal kombat 3, Which did the same exact thing but with lower technology.So what im getting down to is when they came out with this i was disgusted, once again i agree with them and i like to see me make a game but i am titled to my opinion.

Not only did they bring up my beliefs into a whole new game and the idea was changed, They brought in a whole new series of characters from a comic company although DC is a beautiful thing thats not what i was expecting. The game will be rated T really? I mean mortal Kombat is what M is all about im interested into how they pull this off, The story might be great, although seeming like a ditch effort of a story. A portal that intertwines the two genres together. I was excited and showed my friend this new release and some did not play the game they knew its not what mortal kombat is.If this upsets someone i apologize but if you could say something to sway my opinion or agree please feel free.Thanks
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ZXVanX
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Want an MK fan fiction made with your favorite mortal kombat character? contact me and I will get to it!

New Fan fiction made! check it out! its called : Johnny Leads the cage !

05/06/2008 12:57 AM (UTC)
0
My final opinion, listen well.

Since Childhood, I loved MK, for its true being! the awesome god speed fights, the blood, the gore, the song, the ambience! the kombats! the movies! it was just so awesome! the characters! but now A new gameplay ( that can't be SURE to trust at 100% for now since we don't know enought about it for now ) and plus, the DC peeps are coming, wich ruins it more, why must Sub-Zero fight batman ? we all know Sub-Zero owns him badly.

Scorpion VS Super? Haha, make me laugh XD ! :P

I just already hate this game in advance! I sincerly hope the next titles will be better!

ZXVanX !
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outworld222
05/06/2008 09:06 PM (UTC)
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Seriously, it seems that Mortal Kombat is going to get killed sales wise with this project. Watch! Mortal Kombat is too much of a 90s concept anyways.

Boon should be fired for this one. Good grief.furiousfurious

There is a great deal of skepticism on my part towards this game.

Goodbye Mortal Kombat.
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05/06/2008 10:17 PM (UTC)
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What if this whole thing is an elaborate, ingenious hoax? Devised to fool not only fans, but the general gaming community as well?

I would explode if that were the case...I would love that so much...lol

Here's for wishful thinking I guess. Even though I know better. heheh..
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Chino_Cheng
05/07/2008 02:46 AM (UTC)
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Theres probably a good reason why i haven't purchased a MK game since MK4, most probably because MK has turned to shit. I really don't think this whole DC thing is going to help.
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shadowcat
05/08/2008 02:32 AM (UTC)
0
This game will suck balls hands down

lets take a look

-Graphics 5/10 (on a next gen level) compare VF5 to this (ha)!!!!!!**&^%^

-Mechanics (Give me a break this is midway!) For those of you saying
maybe this time they will get it right (keep telling yourself that)

-MK vs DC ( ha.. ten years to late) AKA M vs C

-Story (No comment?) No hells way is this going to work without sounding ridiculous



On a side note the new scorpion render is hideous (sorry but that is not next gen)

-And for any of the True (as you call them mk fans) have anything to say speak up cause only the true fan will end up buying this heap of shit

no pun intended peace out!furious
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ZXVanX
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Want an MK fan fiction made with your favorite mortal kombat character? contact me and I will get to it!

New Fan fiction made! check it out! its called : Johnny Leads the cage !

05/08/2008 02:50 AM (UTC)
0
Chino_Cheng Wrote:
because MK has turned to shit.


how hard did you fall on your head ?

shadowcat Wrote:
This game will suck balls hands down

lets take a look

-Graphics 5/10 (on a next gen level) compare VF5 to this (ha)!!!!!!**&^%^

-Mechanics (Give me a break this is midway!) For those of you saying
maybe this time they will get it right (keep telling yourself that)

-MK vs DC ( ha.. ten years to late) AKA M vs C

-Story (No comment?) No hells way is this going to work without sounding ridiculous



On a side note the new scorpion render is hideous (sorry but that is not next gen)

-And for any of the True (as you call them mk fans) have anything to say speak up cause only the true fan will end up buying this heap of shit

no pun intended peace out!furious


COMPLETLY AGREED!
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Chino_Cheng
05/08/2008 11:49 PM (UTC)
0
Unfortunantley a lot of MK fans seem somwhat mentally impared. I guess they are just catering for the masses.
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